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¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ PowerDork
9/8/21 7:28 a.m.

So, never having owned an old fiberglass car, what is going on with the holes in the seat area and the frunk?  Is the entire thing all crispy and falling apart, or was that some sort of exploratory surgery?

maschinenbau
maschinenbau UltraDork
9/8/21 8:15 a.m.

In reply to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ :

The "firewall" holes seem common on most derelict Europas. The panel that protects your rear end from the engine was made from the 60's British equivalent of masonite board, so it is completely rotten 50 years later. Most restorations glass in some marine plywood in its place. There are some exploratory cuts, such as under the gas tank to remove it, but mostly it's just beat up since it's very delicate and thin. Which means lightweight and fast. 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ PowerDork
9/8/21 8:30 a.m.

This is basically just a cardboard model rocket kit, then.  Power in the back, as little as possible for it to push.

RoddyMac17
RoddyMac17 Reader
9/8/21 8:51 a.m.

There are some exploratory cuts, such as under the gas tank to remove it

The hole under the tank is factory made, well the main hole not the torn bit on the vertical part along the chassis.  On my car, I ended up glassing in some marine plywood for under the tank and as you've already stated, the firewall.  One thing to note, the holes in the front bay require covers so that the air is pushed either through the radiator or into the heater plenum/storage area.  But that's if you're going to stay "stock" in terms of a radiator. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
9/8/21 9:18 a.m.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

This is basically just a cardboard model rocket kit, then.  Power in the back, as little as possible for it to push.

And, if I remember correctly, you'll want someone better at adhering the fins straight than I was. 

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter)
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
9/8/21 9:42 a.m.

this is perhaps the only time i will offer to help find you some appropriately sized *smaller* brakes so you can package 13" rims.  hit me.

dherr (Forum Supporter)
dherr (Forum Supporter) Dork
9/8/21 10:17 a.m.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:

This is basically just a cardboard model rocket kit, then.  Power in the back, as little as possible for it to push.

I  believe this is a candidate for "best post of the day"! Bet this will be in next month's magazine......

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa PowerDork
9/8/21 10:34 a.m.
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:

this is perhaps the only time i will offer to help find you some appropriately sized *smaller* brakes so you can package 13" rims.  hit me.

Early Falcons had 13"s maybe?  Possibly 14"
Scarebird brakes might have a solution, I'm fairly sure they have something for 14" brakes.  Generally cheap as well.

RoddyMac17
RoddyMac17 Reader
9/8/21 10:44 a.m.

An easy option for the fronts it to find some GT6 caliper brackets (or Lotus Elan +2), "metric" caliper bolts from a TR6 (metric shank but imperial threads), and a pair of 79 - 83 Toyota 4x4 Pick-up calipers.   They share the same mounting dimensions as the Girling 16P calipers which are stock on the GT6 (13" rims).

But they are a bit heavier than the type 14 calipers that are stock fitment.    Failing that, if you're handy with a milling machine, you could create your own caliper brackets which would open up a ton of options.  

maschinenbau
maschinenbau UltraDork
9/8/21 10:53 a.m.

In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :

Right now the goal is 13's front, 15's rear. 17's are obviously way too large. The car originally came with 13x4.5, which are the steel wheels in the pics. The lug pattern is 4x3.75", so options are impossibly limited. Luckily the Lotus also came with a full set of mystery magnesium 13x5.5 aftermarket wheels. I can't find any info about them, other than these stampings "M. Maal" and "Made in England". Which is pretty cool. There are still some sticky tire options in 205/60R13 which should fit these wheels. 

The only internet photo I can find of them. They look awesome cleaned up. 

The problem is the rear hubs and brakes are simply too large, even for a 15! Keep in mind this is the "front" of the Toyota Avalon. I still have Jeep Wrangler 15's leftover from my Datsun build. I paid $10 each for them, which is a good price for 15x8 and they almost match the aftermarket front 13's. So the current plan is to adapt the "rear" brakes from the Avalon, which are much smaller, onto this "front" hub. The rear brake rotor hub face to disc face is too deep to make this work, because it will hit the knuckle. So I need a "less deep" rotor of equivalent dimensions. What could possibly work? How about a junkyard rotor off a Chrysler 300M/LHS/Concorde. Switching to this rotor gives me the 0.60" I need to clear the knuckle. Avalon rear rotor specs vs Chrysler rotor specs . Now the only hard part is a caliper bracket adapter.

You can see the difference in rotor hat height here. 

Just barely clearing the Jeep wheels. 

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner MegaDork
9/8/21 11:14 a.m.

There's a Brembo site in Europe that has an excellent searchable database of brake rotors. At least, there used to be.

I am hoping for an Estes themed livery to acknowledge the model rocket heritage.

SVreX (Forum Supporter)
SVreX (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
9/8/21 11:34 a.m.

I'm so happy!

I just wish that I was not once the owner of BOTH free Lotuses! Lol!!

Matt B (fs)
Matt B (fs) UltraDork
9/8/21 12:38 p.m.

It's been a tough few days, but this thread reminds me that the world is in fact a wonderful place.  Looking forward to the progress!

rustomatic
rustomatic Reader
9/8/21 5:53 p.m.

Just fit the body to the wheels--fiberglass is good for that.  Subtraction may be better than addition here, especially if it's better to drive in the end.  Tiny brakes, tiny wheels, and a 300hp Camry beast will not play nice together . . .

Looking forward to more!yes

On that note, I've got a full (nice and recently working) front brake set from a '92 C4 Corvette (with rotors and track pads) that I'll donate to the cause, if you want to make things interesting . . .

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa PowerDork
9/8/21 5:58 p.m.
rustomatic said:

Tiny brakes, tiny wheels, and a 300hp Camry beast will not play nice together . . .

He who shall be last shall be sideways and smiling - gearhead meme, Jeremy  Clarkson, Top Gear | Top gear uk, Funny memes, Top gear

Brotus7
Brotus7 Dork
9/8/21 5:59 p.m.

If you decide against the 4x3.75" front wheels, you can redrill the hubs on a mill to 4x100 and press in a bigger lug stud. I can help ya if you go that route, just drop me a PM.  It was pretty easy when I did mine.

Onward!

malibuguy
malibuguy HalfDork
9/8/21 10:10 p.m.

2gr ftw

AWSX1686 (Forum Supporter)
AWSX1686 (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
9/9/21 8:51 a.m.

Awesome!

84FSP
84FSP UltraDork
9/9/21 12:12 p.m.
Brotus7 said:

If you decide against the 4x3.75" front wheels, you can redrill the hubs on a mill to 4x100 and press in a bigger lug stud. I can help ya if you go that route, just drop me a PM.  It was pretty easy when I did mine.

Onward!

Despite the coolness of the magnesium wheels 4x100 is indeed the easy button.

Scott_H
Scott_H Reader
9/9/21 2:59 p.m.

I did a 2GR swap into my Lancia a few years back.  I mated the engine to the E153 MR2 gearbox which works better than the Camry/FWD version of that trans as the shifter cables come out of the front of the trans pointing nicely towards the tunnel.

There are a few cool options available too.  The manual trans flywheel from the MZ V6 (1MZ - 3.0 litler and 3MZ -3.3 liter ) will fit.  Fidanza makes an aluminum version of that flywheel that bolts up.  There's a guy who  makes stainless headers that fits nicely.  They are the same front and rear head.

Please let me know if I can assist with any questions, pull up wiring diagrams (I have access),  or anyting else.

 

Awesome project!

maschinenbau
maschinenbau UltraDork
9/9/21 7:20 p.m.

In reply to Scott_H :

I just have two questions right now. Where is that build thread please?? And is this swap going to be as awesome as I feel it will be?

GM > MG
GM > MG New Reader
9/10/21 8:23 a.m.

Love the Europa.

This ones going to be Epic...

acheron64
acheron64 New Reader
9/10/21 5:46 p.m.

Apparently they repair fibreglass boats with epoxy, coz stronger. 

Epoxy a roll cage to the body ?

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa PowerDork
9/10/21 6:01 p.m.
acheron64 said:

Apparently they repair fibreglass boats with epoxy, coz stronger. 

Epoxy a roll cage to the body ?

Having just gone through this with one of my boats, sometimes they repair fiberglass boats with epoxy.  Polyester resin is still fairly common and it generally depends on what in particular you're repairing.

For repairs, epoxy goes with epoxy as wet polyester doesn't adhere as well to epoxy, but for polyester resin you can use either wet polyester or wet epoxy depending on what exactly you're working on
More info: https://www.fibreglassdirect.co.uk/blog/post/choosing-a-resin-polyester-or-epoxy

Winston
Winston HalfDork
9/12/21 7:32 a.m.

This is somehow in worse shape than when I had it, at least the fiberglass. Chassis/running gear seems to have at least had a lick of paint put on it, it was black/rust back then. Good luck man, you're already farther along than I got.

I told you the wrong year in my email; it's actually a 1969, part of this group as far as I was able to tell:

"A small number of Series 2 vehicles were modified to be "federalized" for export to the United States. These Federal Type 54s had the low front fenders (guards) of the European model and the larger 1,565 cc engine of the later Lotus Type 65."

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