David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
7/24/08 2:20 p.m.

Now that we have the readers rides featured on our message board, time to make it interesting. Who ever has the highest ranked car as of 5:00 pm Eastern time tomorrow wins a free Classic Motorsports T-shirt. Vote and vote often. Have friends? Get them to vote, too. It's a free country, right?

To make it easier, here's a direct link to the Reader Rides page: http://classicmotorsports.net/reader-rides/

Brett Melancon
Brett Melancon New Reader
7/25/08 7:31 a.m.

Is there any way to make it so you can get votes without having to be registered? Thanks Brett

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
7/25/08 6:50 p.m.

Looks like we have a winner. I'll get in touch to get the particulars.

Coupefan
Coupefan New Reader
7/26/08 9:14 a.m.

I protest! Why a black X1/9 over my yellow X1/9? It's chromatic discrimination I tell you. It's a conspiracy, call Mulder and Sculley. Wow, 18 votes, how many friends do you have?

Tim Baxter
Tim Baxter Online Editor
7/26/08 10:28 a.m.

Brett just campaigned hard. His black Fiat really is über-sweet, though.

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
7/26/08 12:24 p.m.

We have lots more T-shirts, so I'm betting we'll hold some similar contests in the very near future.

rconlon
rconlon Reader
7/28/08 8:53 a.m.

This is ok since Brett needs the clothes -HA!

Ron

Brett Melancon
Brett Melancon New Reader
7/28/08 9:46 a.m.

Hey, I like driving topless.

Shinsen774
Shinsen774 Reader
7/30/08 7:39 p.m.

Hey! I missed this contest entirely somehow; and I need a new t-shirt. I used up all the mojo in both of mine redoing the interior of the MGB.

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
7/30/08 7:43 p.m.

Okay, let's do another contest. The owner of the car with the most Reader Ride votes at 5:00 pm Eastern this coming Friday gets a free Classic Motorsports T-shirt. And since Brett already won, he's ineligible. (I know, I'm mean.)

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
7/30/08 7:45 p.m.

And looks like the X1/- guys have been busy. Triumph fans, where are you? MG supporters?

Stang67
Stang67
7/31/08 11:07 a.m.

Looks like the I-car guys are stepping up to the challenge. This is fun.

Tim Baxter
Tim Baxter Online Editor
7/31/08 8:06 p.m.

The Fiat guys are voting down the non-Italian stuff. Bad form.

André Rousseau
André Rousseau Reader
7/31/08 8:42 p.m.

Hey, if you vote someone down maybe your own car should loose a vote by default.

If you can't say anything nice... Don't say anything.

A.

Luke
Luke Dork
7/31/08 9:27 p.m.

I don't think voting down should be an option.

Rupunzell
Rupunzell New Reader
7/31/08 9:41 p.m.

It is interesting that the X1/9 is NOT included in the "Fabulous 50". The real question is why not? The idea of using a transverse front wheel drive engine and transaxle, moving the entire package to the middle of the chassis layout to create a low cost mid-engine car is one of the most significant sports car innovations to date. The X1/9s basic design foundations have resulted in the current Lotus Elise/Exige. Toyota MR2 series, Pontiac Fiero series, The proposed future VW/Audi mid engine car, Nobel M12, MGF, Honda NSX and others. Yet, the current US car media and publication refuse to acknowledge just what the X1/9 started. The overall packaging of the X1/9 is not any less remarkable. It's space utilization is still among the best of all mid-engine cars. It met porpoised US safety standards that no Detroit design could meet. It's chassis is one of the best of it's time, similar to the Lotus Europa. Both FIAT/Bertone and Lotus did not build this chassis with the semi-trailing arm suspension or swing axles which were simply dangerous if not properly death with. Like the Lotus, the X1/9 has a stiff , rigid chassis which is basic to any performance car, but so forgotten by other car manufactures of the day. The last article CMS did on the X1/9 has factual errors and did not present the full story of what the X can be of why it ended up the way it did. I challenge CMS to do a proper historically correct, factually correct article of the X1/9 and what this car can be based on what a good number of X1/9 owners have personalized their X1/9. Better yet, I challenge CMS to build a Honda K20A powered X1/9 with a properly revised chassis and compare this modified X1/9 to a Lotus Exige side by side complete with measured data and track lap times with a proper professional race car driver.

Brett Melancon
Brett Melancon New Reader
8/1/08 6:46 a.m.

Well said. For years, the X1/9 has always been the underdog of the sports car world. Even SCCA penalized them for being good. Just look at the rules and compare what is allowed for an X to other comparable (on paper) sports cars.

I am not making digs at the other cars, like I have said before, it would be hard to find a car that I didn't like. thanks

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
8/1/08 6:24 p.m.

Blame our readers for the fabulous 50 article. The list was compiled based on votes from our readers. (Where was the Fiat brigade then?) As far as future I-car editorial, we have some coming. I even snuck one more Fiat into the next issue just for you guys.

Getting back to our contest, it was a close one. I had to run an errand at 5:00, so I didn't get to see who was in the lead. How about if we just call it a three-way tie between bluevr6, Coupefan and PV.

Rupunzell
Rupunzell New Reader
8/1/08 9:51 p.m.

"Tyranny of the majority" does not mean the readers know best. If this is a popularity polls, then it should be titled as such. Fact is, most car folks never get to experience much of what the car world has to offer. How many readers have ever driven, been in or been involved with any of the cars I listed? What tends to drive the "classic car" market are specific to an individuals history with these cars. If they had many memorable miles in these cars during their youth, it is likely they would like to re-live those fond memories later in life. Consider why Detroit muscle cars have reached the market values today? Fact is, many of them had little to offer beyond tire smoking power in a straight line. Yet, those wins at the stop light grand prix were fond memories some muscle car owners are looking for. Or it could be the seductive looks of a car or anything else specific to a give car owners experience. All I'm saying is, the automotive press and media needs to do more than just cater to their readership preferences, part of their mission should be to educate their readership and expand their knowledge of the automotive world and do it with honesty, history and facts of design details. If the readership does not understand the technical aspects of a given car design, then take on the task of educating the reader. It will benefit the publication, writer, manufacture and reader all at the same time.

Being Popular alone does not make a car significant or a "classic". One must dig deeper than just popularity as this is limited by the knowledge, experience and abilities of their owner/drivers. Fast food is not the best for your health, but it sure is popular.

Back in the day when Road & Track was a quality publication, they did just this in their publication. R&T published technical articles with substance and even a short but useful encyclopedia of automotive terms. So, if CMS wants to just be another publication that is similar to many other US based automotive publications, the current path will get you there. It will put CMS fighting for the same readership base as the US automotive publications. If CMS wants to find a niche as one of the best US based automotive publications, then another path is required. Just look to what R&T did up to the early 80's to see what I'm referring to.

PV
PV
8/1/08 9:58 p.m.

I don't think voting down should be an option either. There are some great non-I cars on the list. Besides, it's just bad manners and rude.

David, it seems you have done little to attract the I-car brigade so therefore you have very few I-car readers. Consequently when you ask the readers what they want to see you are asking a bunch of British car guys. Guess what they want? Don't blame us for not showing up because we have no reason to subscribe to your magazine in the first place.

Since it was brought up, the X1/9 vs. 308 article wasn't your finest hour. It made me not want to buy your magazine. Rupunzell said it pretty well. To me, the car you chose to juxtapose against the rather nice looking 308 just made the X1/9 look silly and immature.

On the other hand David, you are on here interacting with the masses. It looks like you sincerely want to make the magazine sucessful and I wish you nothing but the best in your quest. Maybe all-British makes the best business case but if you think about it, there really isn't a US magazine that covers French or Italian cars for beans so you may be suprised what a GOOD Fiat or Citroen write-up will do for you. For now I'll stick with my un-godly priced "Classic and Sportscar" subscription.

All the best, PV

Tim Baxter
Tim Baxter Online Editor
8/2/08 7:52 a.m.

Um, Rapunzell, it is:

>The Fabulous 50
We Poll Our Readers for Their Picks of the 50 Best Sports Cars of All Time.

And then again in the article:

In other words, it’s a deeply personal thing. Which is why we turned to you, the Classic Motorsports audience, to determine our list of the 50 favorite classics. Unlike some other magazines, we’re not telling you what’s cool; you’re telling us. Because rational or not, you know what you like. They may not necessarily be the fastest or best-looking cars ever. They’re certainly not the most reliable, or even the most comfortable. But to you, they’re the best.

I put the article together, way back in the day. I found the results fascinating, although I didn't agree with a lot of them. Take the Fiat 124/2000. I LOVE them. I think they're great cars. On the other hand, I wouldn't personally place them above the Lotus Elan, MG T-series, Ford Mustang or VW Beetle on a list of great classics, but there they are. And I think the X1/9 is a glaring omission to the list, but it is what it is.... mostly fun to argue over.

As for your other comments on what we should do.... have you looked the magazine much?

PV, I can assure you David is very interested in Italian cars and making their owners happy. He has an Italian car himself.

Rupunzell
Rupunzell New Reader
8/2/08 9:38 a.m.

Yes, we subscribe to CMS which is why I commented they way I did..

I'm not a FIAT spyder fan, it's dated in it's design even if is the most "modern" of the front engined two seater relative to similar British two seaters of the day. The exception would be the Lotus Elan which is simply so much better and more interesting than any similar car of the day.

Beyond the I-car thing.. What about French, German, Swedish, and ..... cars? Pre WW2 American cars which IMO, were some of the most significant automotive designs that were ever done? CORD, Auburn, Packard, Dusenberg, Franklin... and the list goes on what about articles on these cars and why they are significant technically, socially and who owned these automobiles when new.

It's not just about how fast a car goes, it's also about innovation, style, fashion, and what the world was like at the time when these cars were designed and built. In many ways, like art, cars can be a time capsule which those who understand the topic can get an snap shot into what the mind set and world was like. There is a very human side to the world of cars and when this expression of art, science and technology is allowed to flourish, its a very real part of the human experience and expression.

Many lessons can be had from automotive history and what designs from the past have altered the automotive design path into why automobiles are what they are today. While historically significant automobiles are usually still with us today, many times, their designers have become forgotten. Yet, these automobiles are the results of their work, imagination and extension of who they were. Get to know the automobiles designers, and you get some understanding of who these individuals are and why they did designs they way they did.

~~~~~~~~~~~~ "As for your other comments on what we should do.... have you looked the magazine much?

Coupefan
Coupefan New Reader
8/10/08 2:27 p.m.

I come back from vacation, and find that this contest has been going on. And amazingly, my car comes into a three way tie? How did that happen? Oh, and David emails telling me I won a shirt! Welcome home!

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