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Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/1/18 9:10 p.m.

So I had been shopping around for a 70’s corolla wagon for awhile.

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/70s-corolla/137850/page1/

Long story short found a 1983. Probably didn’t ask enough questions before I took the long trip to go and buy it. Rustier than I had thought. Was advertised as a transmission issue but engine was ok. 

So here is me trying to start it: 

https://youtu.be/hc05ISkFr2s

any idea’s ? Keep in mind I am just starting out trying to learn how to work on my own cars. 

 

Also any info on the wheels would be good. The guy said they were popular in Puerto Rico? And if I were to ever sell them he may want to buy them from me. 

KyAllroad (Jeremy)
KyAllroad (Jeremy) PowerDork
5/1/18 11:19 p.m.

I had a 1980 SR-5 hatchback in high school.  It was a pretty serious dog stock but responded nicely to old school hot roddy stuff.  Weber carb, headers, opened up exhaust and it pulled strong through redline.  The 3T-C engine is stout and will take a ton of abuse.  I did stiff shocks and springs as well, just because.  Actually got my start autocrossing it at Otis Air Base on Cape Cod in.......1989 surprise

They are fun cars, primitive and slow by today’s standards but the longitudinal layout and simple RWD setup just felt right.

Ransom
Ransom PowerDork
5/1/18 11:32 p.m.

There are some funky noises there. Not sure whether mic location is making the rattling sound worse than it actually is, or whether it's something normal made to sound funny.

Has it been sitting? If I try on my optimistic glasses, I can wonder whether it's old gas or a carb that needs cleaning, or both. It's starting, so it's got spark. No guarantee the spark is happening at the right time, but it seems to be trying, and timing will be a lot easier to check once it's idling.

So my hopeful/easy answer is to make sure it's getting fresh fuel to the carb, and then you may need to clean out the carb if it has been sitting. My pessimistic fear is that it really is making terrible mechanical noises and is mortally wounded. Are you getting oil pressure after a couple of these semi-starts?

Ransom
Ransom PowerDork
5/1/18 11:36 p.m.

Oh, and I think those are first-gen Supra wheels.

Trackmouse
Trackmouse UltraDork
5/2/18 12:23 p.m.

Congrats on a good purchase. Even if it isn’t running yet. These are very popular in Puerto Rico. 

We need more details about what’s going on to help. 

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/2/18 12:38 p.m.

Thanks for the input. 

I tried starting it a few times. It would start  “run” for 2 seconds stall and make that terrible rattling/grinding noise. I was holding the phone part under the car when I was taking the video, it didn’t  seem that loud in the car.

clutch pedal feels weird? When I push it down  not sure how to explain it. Just stiff maybe

Also it is really hard to be push. Like took 3 guys to push it down the street to get it to the trailer. Then had to use a come a long to winch it up onto the trailer while those guys were pushing still  

at first I thought maybe it was stuck in gear. Bc as I tried to roll it off the trailer the drive shaft was spinning even though I have the shift lever in neutral still . I ended up pulling the plugs to get it to roll down off the trailer . 

As I was pulling the plugs saw a lot of interesting things  like hoses to no where random wires etc  

i am not sure what other details I need to check on  my dad is coming over tonight to help me push it in the shop . 

Once I get it in where do I put the jack stands? Rear axel tubes and engine cross member?

 

 

 

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess MegaDork
5/2/18 12:57 p.m.

The drive shaft is going to move whenever the rear wheels move. 

Hoses to nowhere could easily be why it won't stay running or idle.  Plug everything as a starting point.

 

TheRX7Project
TheRX7Project Reader
5/2/18 1:10 p.m.

I would definitely start by plugging/finding homes for all the "hoses to nowhere" and try to find any possible vacuum leaks and get some fresh gas.

If the clutch feels really stiff, check the clutch master and slave cylinders, especially if the car has been sitting for a while. One could be frozen or sticky.

As for being "hard to push", check if any of the brakes are dragging. Jack up each wheel and try to turn it by hand. They should turn fairly easily.

The car looks like a nice project. How bad is the rust? Floors? Underside? Looks solid on the shiny side. Best thing you can do from here is pick up a factory service manual or even just a Haynes manual and get to reading and learning. Keep in mind that old cars are just nuts and bolts, there isn't going to be some mystery computer issue keeping it from running. It obviously WILL run, since it starts, so at least you're not fighting an unknown no-start condition.

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/2/18 1:34 p.m.

In reply to TheRX7Project :

Thanks yeah it should be fun. I will start with looking at the fluids and see where all the hoses need to go. I will also go ahead and order a manual. 

Floors look ok. The lower rocker panels on the rear have rust, one side is rotted through. Every door has rust on the bottom. Not sure how extensive this is yet and some of it is under flaking paint. Rear hatch has some bubbles. And some how the under hood support has rusted out where the latch goes so they put in hood pins. 

Trackmouse
Trackmouse UltraDork
5/2/18 1:57 p.m.

This thread has all the makings of a success story. 

And, yes, I would put two jack stands under the solid axle in back, and two jack stands under the “frame rails” behind the front tires. Note- I’m talking about the chassis rails (it’s a unibody), so don’t put them under the rocker panel pieces that everyone jacks on and ruins immediately. 

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/2/18 5:44 p.m.

So I ordered a manual so should be here maybe next week. In the mean time I saw a vacuum line unhooked. I hooked it up and got this (see video) it started and idled but sounded like it had a bunch of rocks in the motor. 

https://youtu.be/ezCIev3NElU

also I had pulled the plugs yesterday they looked kinda dark. And the one was getting hard to get in. I don’t think I have it in all the way but am scared to try to tighten it any harder bc I don’t want to break it off. The threads looked ok. 

also got it pushed into the shop with “project learning curve”

Trackmouse
Trackmouse UltraDork
5/2/18 6:31 p.m.

In reply to Somebeach :

Hey, all else fails, weld that diff, slap in a 4ac or 4ag with side draft carbs. And hoon that thing!

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/3/18 6:25 p.m.
Trackmouse said:

In reply to Somebeach :

Hey, all else fails, weld that diff, slap in a 4ac or 4ag with side draft carbs. And hoon that thing!

I haven’t got to look at anything else yet bc not really sure where to start with that engine knocking. 

But if I was going to do a swap any reason not to do a beams? It seems like you can buy them for 1kish with the 6 speed.  Then it looks like xcessive makes all kind of swap parts for the Ae86. And I was thinking I read somewhere the AE cars have a lot of the same mounts and things?

 

it is opposite of my original plan which was get it running good.  Then stopping good . Then suspension work. Then add power. Hmmm

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess MegaDork
5/3/18 7:07 p.m.

The wiring is the hard part of a swap like that.  Are you good with Japanese schematics? 

MrChaos
MrChaos Dork
5/3/18 7:38 p.m.
Dr. Hess said:

The wiring is the hard part of a swap like that.  Are you good with Japanese schematics? 

Xcessive has harnesses as well. a touch spendy though.

44Dwarf
44Dwarf UberDork
5/3/18 7:40 p.m.

The knocking is of some concern but honestly, I think it needs a tune up.   Is it a 2tc or 3tc?  I recall back then we still had cap and rotor and plug wires.  As for the plug you put in that doesn't feel right.  pull it out, obtain a plug thread chaser (like a tap but not made to cut threads just fix) bring that cyl to TDC so both valves are closed.  now here it gets strange but it is the best way.  Obtain a can of Barbersol shave cream (yes that white stuff) get a drinking straw, fit the straw over the nozzle of the barbersol snug fit but it will go on.  Now fill the cyl with shave cream the straw will get you down past the valve cover holes.  Use the thread chaser and remove it. Leave the plug out, put a rag over the valve cover and crank it. the shave cream will SQUIRT out of the cyl carrying with it the chips and shavings from the thread fix.  Wipe it up install the plug.  

Sounds like you have cross fire on the ignition wires or carbon tracking under the cap.  I once bought a truck for $50 with a "blown motor" turned out the owner had used graphite to lube the points cam earlyer in the week and it made the cap arc out and crossfire.

barbersol

plug thread chaser

 

44Dwarf
44Dwarf UberDork
5/3/18 7:47 p.m.

Yup rock auto says tune up kit el-cheapo brand is $26.  wires, distributor cap, rotor. you may also check the coil as it has a carbon brush to contact the cap underside.

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/3/18 9:08 p.m.
Dr. Hess said:

The wiring is the hard part of a swap like that.  Are you good with Japanese schematics? 

Definitely not good with that. 

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/3/18 9:13 p.m.

In reply to 44Dwarf :

It is actually the 4ac. Not a 2tc or a 3tc. That is a good idea. I will look into the plug thread chaser. How can you tell when that cylinder is TDC?

I will also check out the cross fire. Any way to check that out? I have a meter that does volts and ohms?

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/3/18 9:14 p.m.

In reply to 44Dwarf :

Thanks. Will look at doing that as well as the plug chaser.   How do you search rock auto’s site ?

I was looking for a specific 4ac tune up kit. I know when I did a tune up on an older fiero I used to have I used a specific fiero kit. 

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess MegaDork
5/4/18 9:43 a.m.

Is that a 4AC motor?  If it is, you can swap a 4AG in it and rock on.  That's the way to go.  Look for a 20 valve for a 160HP motor bone stock that will bolt right up to that transmission.

44Dwarf
44Dwarf UberDork
5/4/18 10:06 a.m.

Cross fire will normal show as black lines on the underside of the cap but most caps are black so can be hard to see.  The Blue caps made by a big outfit make it easy to see....and after having 3 blue caps in 6 months (on a 302 ford in a 68 bronco) I no longer use that brand for caps, there no longer my STANDARD go to for ign parts.

Rock Auto didn't say what series motor it was but i looked by year and model but double check.  at $26 I'd just do it as a cheap check to see if motors good or bad, you spend more then that on a motor swap.

My friend had many 2tc's an 3TC he used to build and beet the snot out of.  We got so good at changing motors 4 teenagers could swap a motor in 1 hour start to finish.  The motor were generally very reliable...even when modified what was lacking was his machining and wallet.  He worked at an auto machine shop and would "try" things....offten used parts from customer discards ect.

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/4/18 1:16 p.m.
Dr. Hess said:

Is that a 4AC motor?  If it is, you can swap a 4AG in it and rock on.  That's the way to go.  Look for a 20 valve for a 160HP motor bone stock that will bolt right up to that transmission.

Yeah it is a 4ac. That was the rabbit hole that I went down the other day when it would idle but sounded awful.  that led me first to the 4ag. Then the 4ag 20 valve  Then a full on beams swap lol. Seems like the beams are around 210hp and rev to 8k 

I think I am going to try to hunt down a tune up kit and fix the plug. Then if still not running well will start dreaming again on the motor swap. 

Trackmouse
Trackmouse UltraDork
5/4/18 1:40 p.m.

Guys, I think we need to stop filling his head with the cool ideas. He’s just starting out, so that means we need to help him out with this little engine and try to get it going.

I would like to suggest that you watch a few YouTube videos on how an engine works. That way you can come back here and understand some of the terminology that we will be using such as “top dead center“. 

The video does kind of sound like a timing or miss matched plug wires issue

Somebeach
Somebeach New Reader
5/4/18 2:21 p.m.

In reply to 44Dwarf :

Thanks for all your good advice, I looked again and was able to find the tune up kit. So I was able to order it. 

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