Came across this article last night, with a claimed fact I find astonishing.
Who knows of a 2 seat sports car that beat the 136,840 mark? Or is this (still) true?
Came across this article last night, with a claimed fact I find astonishing.
Who knows of a 2 seat sports car that beat the 136,840 mark? Or is this (still) true?
The closest I could get was 1990 Miata - 35,944. That's a lot of Fieros.
Is the Fiero really a sports car?!
Region_Rat said:Is the Fiero really a sports car?!
Sure. It's not a very GOOD sports car, but it's 2 seat RWD and the mid-engine nature gives it bonus points.
As for best selling, they topped out at 370K total. Mazda has made 3 times that many Miatas, but it took them 25 years to do it.
The later Fieros were good sports cars. Ask me how I know....
Don't loose perspective of the era when the Fiero was hinted and then released. It was the heart of the malaise era. A mid-engine 2 seater looking like that at an affordable price was mind blowing. People lined up to buy one. But in typical GM fashion, the bean counters neutered the car before production began and it came out half baked. By time they realized what they had and fixed it properly, it was too late.
Robbie is going to get to see a really nice one soon.... 
I've had several Fiero's and enjoyed them. Yes, the 1988 was best but the other cars weren't bad. The 84 was worst of the bunch though.
What I find odd in that article is GM hoping to sell 30,000 in the first year, but cancelled the car due to slow sales despite selling well over that every year except '88 when they cut production short. (And still sold 30,000 that year)
Another one of those stories where GM gave up on a great concept too soon.
The Corvair could have / should have been the US 911, The Fiero could have been the US Cayman.
I owned both 1987 ad 1988 (the latter with a turbo 300 bhp engine). They made good sports cars. Any V6 car (but especially the 88 with all new suspension) were worthy of attention.
My 88 in a face off with it's replacement.
Fine print at the bottom of ad, but the Fiero at introduction was making statements of 40 mpg on the hyw. And, they claim that 40 rating was with a 3 speed auto trans????
According to Fueleconomy.gov, the '84 Fiero 4 speed manual launched with a mpg rating of 27/33/47
For the 2007 EPA rating reset the manual trans Fiero was re-rated at a more realistic 21/25/33. Quite the disparity. I'm sure the 40's ratings help sell it as a commuter car.
In reply to John Welsh :
At 55mph, surely.
obsolete said:In reply to John Welsh :
At 55mph, surely.
Without the engine running, rolling down hill.
In reply to obsolete :
Yes, at 55 mph...and don't call me Shirley
codrus (Forum Supporter) said:...but it's 2 seat RWD and the mid-engine nature gives it bonus points.
So is the Smart ForTwo.
For contrast, in 2010 GM sold 14 Pontic G3s. That is not a typo, 14. In fairness, it was cancelled that year. The year of its release, 2009, it sold 6223 units!
Driven5 said:codrus (Forum Supporter) said:...but it's 2 seat RWD and the mid-engine nature gives it bonus points.
So is the Smart ForTwo.
OK, let's add "and is more than 10mm wider than it is tall" to the list. :)
As I recall, the Fiero was originally marketed as an economy car for all intents and purposes. It wasn't until a year or two into production that Pontiac shifted more in the direction of it being a sports car.
I had a 84 manual with studded snow tires. It was a scary car to drive. It would swap ends at or below the speed limit on off ramps on dry pavement. In the snow it was fantastic with all the weight over drive wheels.
The 85 got some small refinements in the suspension. The front lower arms were changed to allow an extra 1/2 of travel and the rear toelinks were lowered some amount. This did make a difference, but still not what was needed.
Engine compartment wiring was changed completely to a much clean and simpler design.
Oil pressure guage replaced the voltage guage on 4 cyl cars.
NickD said:As I recall, the Fiero was originally marketed as an economy car for all intents and purposes. It wasn't until a year or two into production that Pontiac shifted more in the direction of it being a sports car.
Exactly right. To get the model approved they needed to submit it as an economy car, knowing full well that if they got approval they could push for improvements when it was in production.
The 1988 was by far the best handling - a very expensive total replacement of all the suspension to get it finally optimized as a sports car - then they cancelled the model for the next model year.
Apparently Corvette was always very jealous about being THE sports car. When Pontiac built two prototypes of a proposed turbo version, resistance was strong. The performance of the turbo Fieros was very close to the stock Corvettes and there was no way they were going to get approval for that.
Different times - the prototypes only put out 190 bhp but still threatened to approximate the performance of the Corvette of the time at a far lower price. That gave me the idea to turbo my 88 GT, only more so - instead of 190 bhp I built 3.2 300 bhp engine and drove it for 20 years reliably. Acceleration was dead even with Supra turbo...and it was quicker than the Aura NSX (1st gen) much to the disgust of one that lived out where I did.
See https://www.carthrottle.com/post/wvmy4po/
I was not impressed with GMs prototypes for a 1990 version - too much Firebird somehow.
With marketing like this, they should have been ready to move some units!
wspohn said:NickD said:As I recall, the Fiero was originally marketed as an economy car for all intents and purposes. It wasn't until a year or two into production that Pontiac shifted more in the direction of it being a sports car.
Exactly right. To get the model approved they needed to submit it as an economy car, knowing full well that if they got approval they could push for improvements when it was in production.
The 1988 was by far the best handling - a very expensive total replacement of all the suspension to get it finally optimized as a sports car - then they cancelled the model for the next model year.
Apparently Corvette was always very jealous about being THE sports car. When Pontiac built two prototypes of a proposed turbo version, resistance was strong. The performance of the turbo Fieros was very close to the stock Corvettes and there was no way they were going to get approval for that.
Different times - the prototypes only put out 190 bhp but still threatened to approximate the performance of the Corvette of the time at a far lower price. That gave me the idea to turbo my 88 GT, only more so - instead of 190 bhp I built 3.2 300 bhp engine and drove it for 20 years reliably. Acceleration was dead even with Supra turbo...and it was quicker than the Aura NSX (1st gen) much to the disgust of one that lived out where I did.
See https://www.carthrottle.com/post/wvmy4po/
I was not impressed with GMs prototypes for a 1990 version - too much Firebird somehow.
Hmmm, Firebird + NSX. I'm down.
It really doesn't have all that much competition. Think about it, the Corvette and T-bird would be too expensive, the MG/Triumph/Alfas etc. too unreliable and too leaky, 914 and X1/9 too exotic... So what was competing with it for sales numbers? Basically just the MR2, Miata, and Capri. All of which were competing with each other. So in 1984, realistically, the only 2 cars available for this market that could have seen big sales numbers were the Fiero (which was available in 1983) and the MR-2, which wasn't available until halfway through the year.
In reply to codrus (Forum Supporter) :
Ok, so thanks to this post I'm going to look at an '87 Fiero with a supercharged 3800 swap! I have zero expectations but it's close and the price seems reasonable...any special areas that need to be looked at on these?
Um...if you pass on it, please send the info to me. Seriously. I have Fiero #2 literally on a transport trailer right now, to be delivered tomorrow. I'll likely be selling Fiero #1 shortly thereafter, but would always be interested in a nicely done 3800 swapped car. I'm still not the foremost Fiero expert, but I'd look for rust. They are 35 years old after all. Given the body panels, it can be harder to spot, so bring a flashlight and scour underneath as much as you can. I don't know enough about the swaps to give a ton of advice there. I know heat is a challenge for them in general. Good luck and I'm jelly if you get it!
In reply to Tyler H (Forum Supporter) :
John Oates rules.
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