BRZ/FRS/86 Drivers, Long Term Ownership Experience?

I am sensing a consensus beginning to build among the voices in my head in regards to my car search. "Frisbee" they murmur, growing louder by the day. I still need to drive a few more things before I'm 100% decided, but a test drive in an 86 Saturday really cemented this thing at the forefront of my search. 

At this point, I'd like to glean some more info from actual owners of the Frisbee twins (or triplets now, I guess) and I know we have at least a handful on here. This would be a primary 4 season DD for me, seeing somewhere in the neighborhood of 20k miles per year, so questions include things like:

How do you like living with these and how have your opinions on ownership changed over time - likes, dislikes, would or wouldn't buy again?

Any problems or issues that have cropped up over time? 

Any sense on interior durability, and how well it would hold up to loading and unloading a large and exuberant dog from the backseat every day?

How's ease of maintenance on them? They look to be pretty easy to work on, at a glance. 

Winter driving? Will be getting a good set of snow tires for sure. 

Feelings on long term reliability? Anything worry you about making it to 100-150-200k miles? 

Thinking right now, if I do in fact end up going this route, is I'll probably end up buying lightly used. These things seem to be depreciating pretty well, don't seem to have any major reliability concerns, haven't changed substantially aside from minor tweaks on the '17s, and I'm really not that picky about options, which are pretty limited anyway, so why not? Won't feel as bad beating it up a little with the dog, or in the winter, or maybe even at an occasional rally x that way either. I'm seeing early cars with relatively high miles as low as $12k range (yes, even with clean titles) and low mileage later examples up around $20k, while I think I could get the new model for about $26k OTD based on the numbers we were talking. BRZs seem to hold a slight edge in value, understandably.

Just wondering where the sweet spot is in the used market, if there were build quality improvements after the first year or two or anything like that. I have a slight preference for the styling of the BRZ, but otherwise don't really care and would probably prefer a cloth interior for durability anyway. 

Bought mine six months before it was even released. I am not a high miler, so cant speak to that.

I have had it as a DD in Ontario since June 2012 including winter driving.

No problem with winter driving as long as you have snow tires. She does wag her tail a lot and the nannies are pretty much there all the time when it is slippy. With the nannies off, she is actually easier to drive in the snow, but you have to be on top of the situation.

Have done several long non-stop road-trips. Great car for that. The one thing that I never tire of is driving the car in whatever conditions. I have no day to day driving needs that would require more power, so the eternal whine of "it needs more power" does not enter into the equation for me.

I have had the car out on a fast slalom course a few times. It would be very good at that game if I were any good at that game. Fun for sure.

The seats love me. May not apply to everyone's physiology.

Your dog is going to bite you if you make him ride back there. I would not blame him. I have had actual humans back there, and it might have been legal, but it is also cruel.

Interior quality is that of a Corolla. The money was spent on the chassis. That said, my interior has held up just fine. If your fetishes include the tactile quality of plastics, you probably wont be impressed with the FRS.

Trunk space is fine for  whatever I want to do. Have hauled haf sheets of tin and a lot of steel for the Molvo with the seat folded down. Fine for skis.

If you value in car entertainment, then you will want a new sound system, the radio is pretty much allergic to music and/or reception.

In order to hit the weight target of 2700 lbs, sound deadening was left on the cutting room floor. Driving on gravel is an experience. Sleet and hail make you think you are inside a snare drum.

I myself have a dislike of the boxer engine. I consider the need for two cylinder heads and 4 cams on a 4 cylinder engine to be poor engineering. That said, it works.

Direct Injection is turning out to have some issues, in particular grunge building up on the back of the intake valve.

Buying premium gas at a 25 cent per litter ( $1/gal to you) gets old after a while. So so $100 oil changes. ( $75 if I do my own)

Early cars had a noise from the high pressure fuel pump that sounded like crickets. I do not know what if any solution was implemented. I think I herd them once on a very hot day.

Early taillights filled with water. Replaced mine twice under warranty and I noticed that interior condensation is back. Not gonna worry.

I find the blind spot to be annoying. My mirrors are adjusted properly. Still managed to somehow back into someone in a parking lot

I've been eyeing them HARD for almost a year.

Sweet spot is for a '13-14, 30k miles, 16k. You can even get a Limited/Monogram for that much (Monogram = alcantara in FR-S form). BRZ Premium still gets cloth FYI.

I missed one with 6k (!) miles for 16.5k recently.

Check insurance prices.  I'm also interested in these as a slightly larger miata DD/trip vehicle (2 small dogs don't quite fit in the miata) but the insurance costs for me kinda killed it.  

As a outsider looking in I keep hearing from owners that the love affair wares off after a while due to the lack of power. Fact or internet lore I don’t know but something to think about when purchasing. .  

I have owned my Limited  (manual 6spd, Galaxy Blue) since 2013, has about 33k miles on it currently.  

I have driven it a little bit in the snow with Altimax Arctics here in Buffalo, just to see what it's like, but my 04 WRX is still the primary snowmobile.  

Have autocrossed it a bit in stock form a few times over the years.

I definitely can't take off on snowy roads the same in the two cars, so planning ahead for the breaks in traffic a little more is necessesity :)   

The lack of power I only noticed when I went from the eBay muffler delete pipe back to the stock muffler.  When the car is quieter, it seems I need to drive more aggressively to have fun, but that's just me.  I also get WAY better mpg's with the muffler delete (because I try not to be annoyingly loud with the delete, also much less likely to get any speeding tickets !).  Tip Toeing around I have averaged as high as 37mpg on one highway tank, though average is around 26, and in the freezing weather it can be a little lower.  

The VCS has kept me out of trouble a few times on slick roads (mostly the fault of my tires probably).   

But I like that I can turn it off completely if I want to (have to do it each time you start the car though, it doesn't remember the setting after you shut the car off).

The only maintenance I've had to do are oil changes.  

I did manage to get both tail lights replaced by Subaru because they were filling up with water.   

Do I wish it had more power ?  depends on the day and depends on my mood.  It's probably all relative to what you are used to.  

There aren't a lot of them where I live, so there is some uniqueness appeal in my situation, but I know it's not like that everywhere.  

Otherwise, no issues with it, and I'll probably not get rid of it anytime soon.   But, if I had the money, I might play around with power, tunes, tires, etc...

Seems like most of the practical concerns have been noted. You need to make sure it fits your lifestyle, but for me it fit my needs 99% of the time (even as an only vehicle).

I've owned it new since '13 and I have gotten a little annoyed with the lack of the power on the highway. All other places it is mostly fine. On a twisty road/track the power is *completly* adequate, and I never wish for more power when the road hits a turn. 

If you live somewhere with nothing but straight roads, look at another car. However, if your fun driving consists of anything with turns, you should be happy as long as you leave the ego at the door when commuting/dailying.

EDIT: Also, in terms of maintenance, everything has been easy & reliable so far for me. The struggle is real with the spark plugs/coil packs, though.

Just over 3 years and 37k miles on my '15 BRZ Limited.

No reliability issues, Tak not of the shorter than normal transmission service schedule and use a quality fluid like Motul.

Only interior quality issue is the steering wheel, and that seems to not be to rare, the rest is all good.

Sonolin said:

If you live somewhere with nothing but straight roads, look at another car.

This X1000. The FRS basically has one purpose, and it's handling. The interior is cheap, the suspension is stiff, road noise is high. These are the costs of the most sublime, confidence inspiring and giggle-inducing handling this side of a Porsche Cayman. You'll have to decide if the trade off is worth it. 

There’s a “17” 86 with 5200 miles for 20k in Pittsburgh CL

I've had my '15 FR-S since April of last year.  58,000 miles with nothing but oil changes.  I'm not real excited about the upcoming spark plug change.  I don't know why the poster above is spending $75 on oil changes.  Maybe oil is really expensive in Canada?  I average 30mpg and the speed limit is 75mph here.

I love mine.  It's by far the favorite of the cars I've owned which include: 240z's, 1st gen MR2 both n/a and supercharged, '72 911, first gen RX7 and a 240sx.

I don't have any complaints about the power.  Maybe because I still remember when the 200hp MR2 turbo was the shizzle.  It does not have the right-now torque of today's turbo cars.  You've got to rev it to get into the powerband.  

I don't know how it would hold up to dogs, but I haven't noticed any wear on the driver's seat from me getting in and out.

It is loud and not the best choice for eating up highway miles.  Visibility when backing up is pretty awful.

I couldn't afford the upkeep on a Cayman and the Elise doesn't have any storage space so for me the 86 is the perfect car.

Thanks for the input everyone! Good to hear most of you are still pretty positive after a few years even while being open about the car's shortcomings.

I'm not immensely concerned about the lack of power, I think its adequate given the mission of the car and fine for a daily. Maybe it's something that will wear on me over time, but there's always a remedy for that. Plus, I have the LS1 swapped RX7 for when I feel the need for more.

I don't think my dog will bite me for stuffing him into the backseat, he's pretty adaptable. I'm more concerned with how well the car will stand up to him. I figure I can fold the backseat down and throw a blanket over top. He got around in my 4th gen Camaro just fine and it can't be much different than that. I would miss the convenience of just throwing open the hatch and letting him hop in the back of the Cherokee though.

Why are the oil changes so expensive, does it spec 10wUnicorn piss or something? Seems like they're pretty cheap to run otherwise - consumables should be reasonable, pretty good mpg, reliability seems good. I did an insurance quote last night and it wasn't bad at all. Aren't these port  AND direct injected? I would think that should avert the typical DI valve gunking issues.

Interior is fine with me, still miles better than my last 3 DDs (Cherokee, Camaro, E36.) I like the layout a lot and the ergonomics work well for me.

My commute and most of my driving in general is back roads, not much highway, so I think it suits the environment. Really not finding much to dissuade me 

Furious_E said:

Thanks for the input everyone! Good to hear most of you are still pretty positive after a few years even while being open about the car's shortcomings.

I'm not immensely concerned about the lack of power, I think its adequate given the mission of the car and fine for a daily. Maybe it's something that will wear on me over time, but there's always a remedy for that. Plus, I have the LS1 swapped RX7 for when I feel the need for more.

I don't think my dog will bite me for stuffing him into the backseat, he's pretty adaptable. I'm more concerned with how well the car will stand up to him. I figure I can fold the backseat down and throw a blanket over top. He got around in my 4th gen Camaro just fine and it can't be much different than that. I would miss the convenience of just throwing open the hatch and letting him hop in the back of the Cherokee though.

Why are the oil changes so expensive, does it spec 10wUnicorn piss or something? Seems like they're pretty cheap to run otherwise - consumables should be reasonable, pretty good mpg, reliability seems good. I did an insurance quote last night and it wasn't bad at all. Aren't these port  AND direct injected? I would think that should avert the typical DI valve gunking issues.

Interior is fine with me, still miles better than my last 3 DDs (Cherokee, Camaro, E36.) I like the layout a lot and the ergonomics work well for me.

My commute and most of my driving in general is back roads, not much highway, so I think it suits the environment. Really not finding much to dissuade me 

Mine handles dog duties just fine. I've had our border collie mix in mine quite a bit, and the interior is holding up even after long beach days (and lots of sand). The plastic is a fair bit scuffed up, though, but that's more from our feet (entrance areas + low slung sports car + cheap plastic) rather than the dog. We also picked up our new puppy + crate + food + said mutt and they fit OK. The only thing look-wise that sticks out is the terrible paint quality - lots of rock chips, minor dents, and scratches (probably a combination of DD + city parking). I've resolved its a cheap sports car & not to worry too much about the looks, but if you are anal about that I've heard a clear bra helps a lot.

Oil changes can be a bit more expensive due to it needing ~5 quarts of oil + 0w20 (hard to find, which usually means a little more expensive). I'd say on average I spend ~$50 total on oil changes. It was actually cheaper the few times I took it into one of those shady oil change places, but that stopped quickly after they stripped the drain plug.

Spark plugs are really the most annoying maintenance item, and I'd recommend taking it in for that one! Did it recently myself and hated myself for not taking it in.

Mine has been pretty much problem free, though the transmission crunches into gear occasionally and can be kind of  reluctant to go into first when it's below freezing.  I also have a problem where the drivers side window doesn't go up all the way on it's own sometimes.  It has frameless windows so the window drops down about half an inch when you open the door, then it raises itself back up when you close it so that the window fits in the groove of the weatherstripping properly.  My window doesn't always go back up all the way, but stops maybe 1/8" from the top.  Water stays out, but the wind noise is pretty bad until I manually raise the window using the switch.  I haven't looked into whether there's something I can adjust or not, mostly because I forget about it until the next time it happens.  Other than that, no problems.

When should the spark plugs be changed on these cars?  Mine has about 75,000 km (45,000 miles) on it so I assume they will need to be changed soon.

Manual calls for spark plugs at 60,000 miles.  I forgot about the 2nd gear crunch when cold.  I have a mile of dirt road to traverse from my house to the pavement so I pretty much just trundle along in 1st till I hit pavement and by then it's warmed up.

There is no reason why the oil change should be so expensive.  I get 0W20 Mobil 1 at Walmart for like $26 per five quart jug.  Another six or eight bucks for a filter and that's it.

The fancy oil costs exactly the same as the other stuff I see at autozone. $33ish with a filter? I don't think it's bad at all. GF has a Crosstrek with same F20A motor.

^Some of us don't like crawling around in the garage to raise the car, drain the oil, dispose of the oil, etc. So for me, it's worth the convenience to pay the price. I drive my car so little I've only had the oil changed twice this year, and next year (if I still have it) it will end up being changed because of time, not mileage.

I take my car to the Subaru dealer and just hook up using their WiFi, and work through the VPN until they are done. 

I don't mind paying the dealer price, instead of saving money for the shady oil change places that may or may not be putting into the engine what they actually say.

In reply to Sonolin :

Good to hear yours holds up well to dog duties. Mine is a lab/aussie shepherd mix, so probably pretty similar size and activity level to your border collie. I don't care so much if the plastic gets scratched or things get knicked and dinged, just trying to avoid anything immediately disintegrating after dog hauling use, like the seats in my Camaro did (though they were made from hands down the worst quality leather I have ever seen.) Another reason I'd rather buy used too, I'd feel less bad when the inevitable E36 M3 happens if I know I'm not the first one to "ruin" the car. 

$50 or less is what I'd consider normal for oil changes. I actually do like changing my own oil, gives me a chance to poke around and keeps tabs on things. Had a weird moment on the test drive when the sales lady mentioned the first two years of maintenance and oil changes were free. She gave me a weird look after I responded that I wasn't sure how I felt about that lol. 

Furious_E said:

In reply to Sonolin :

Good to hear yours holds up well to dog duties. Mine is a lab/aussie shepherd mix, so probably pretty similar size and activity level to your border collie. I don't care so much if the plastic gets scratched or things get knicked and dinged, just trying to avoid anything immediately disintegrating after dog hauling use, like the seats in my Camaro did (though they were made from hands down the worst quality leather I have ever seen.) Another reason I'd rather buy used too, I'd feel less bad when the inevitable E36 M3 happens if I know I'm not the first one to "ruin" the car. 

$50 or less is what I'd consider normal for oil changes. I actually do like changing my own oil, gives me a chance to poke around and keeps tabs on things. Had a weird moment on the test drive when the sales lady mentioned the first two years of maintenance and oil changes were free. She gave me a weird look after I responded that I wasn't sure how I felt about that lol. 

Haha, yea I hear you on the oil changes!

Your dog should fit fine. Our border collie mix fits fine with room to spare. The cloth seats are holding up very well - still comfy, and just slightly worn I'd say (looks-wise more than anything). I'd imagine the leather on the upper trim BRZs would hold up worse (I think they get leather, at least), but I much prefer cloth seats myself.

The Limited, and Monogram FR-S/GT86, get a leather/Alcantara mix.

I have tools, somewhere.  They have grown cold and rusty in the past 2 years since picking up '15 BRZ.   Ergos and interior space are just right.  Ain't nothing broke yet.  On the canyons roads, etc. close by, I really enjoy it, but for the money, what, $10K+ used, I'd really think long and hard about a Boxster, C6, Z3 or Z4 M, 968,  stock 8er in good shape, MR2 Spyder for < half as much.  But for trouble free fun with just enough space and cookoo aftermarket, if you like, 86 is hard to beat.   It aint great for moonlight topless cruises, or just cruizin in general though. 

That is a great point.

The aftermarket for the Twins is just bonkers, nearly matches the Mustang aftermarket. And when you consider how many have been built and only available for 5-ish years it's incredible.

There has to be at least 20 forced induction kits, companies like Enkei making a specific wheel just for the car, etc. 

In reply to parker :

Must be a Canada thing. Just left the oil chance place and with $10 off cupon oil change was $94 Cnd or 73.84 USd at todays rated. Filter and Oil from Canadian tire is $60 plus the 13% (sales tax) and I still need a 5th and 6th liter bottle to get the job done so add another $30.   I think they want $20 ish for an oil filter for this car.. So, you can do it yourself for $110 or get it done for $94 as I just did.

The main thing that is annoying with the oil is it is hard to find 0w-20 (at least the places I frequent), and the places that have it tend to price it a little more than other oils.  But if you plan ahead it isn't too bad.

Hard to find 0w20 and it take a goofy 5.7 quarts. I buy the 5qt jug and a lone quart to make up the difference.