CAM classing a truck

In reply to Javelin:

You mean like how since I first heard of the class, the Fox was in CAM-T and the 3rd gen f-body wasn't, then the Fox got moved out of CAM-T, then both cars got moved back to CAM-T again?

patgizz wrote: so can i assume cam-t since the production run began in 1988 based on the clear as mud wording in the appendix? i just don't want to look like a d-bag when i show up and have to class my vehicle. either way i'm running it next event as long as the crack in the windshield doesn't stop them from passing me through tech.

False. CAM-S. You have a regular cab, ergo it holds less than 4 people.

Javelin wrote: False. CAM-S. You have a regular cab, ergo it holds less than 4 people.

Then clearly you haven't had 10 people in the bed driving around......

Ranger50 wrote:

Javelin wrote: False. CAM-S. You have a regular cab, ergo it holds less than 4 people.

Then clearly you haven't had 10 people in the bed driving around......

+1 Internet Points for you today!

Sedans/coupes with seating originally for 4 or more adults or pick-ups

to me i read that as "passenger cars with seats for 4 or more people OR pickup trucks", not "passenger cars or pickup trucks with seats for 4 or more people"

i don't think the intent is to say crew cab trucks are in one class and regular cabs are in another. really, i don't see anyone running a crew cab, or at the very least it would be comical to see one slalom.

also i have to find a larger front sway bar, and my new rear one is gigantic.

In reply to patgizz:

Dooood, read CAM-S, it says the exact same thing, only with "2 passengers". It's very obvious that regular cab pick-ups are CAM-S. In fact, the SCCA website ran a story like a week ago on a C10 running CAM-S. CAM-C is for crew-cabs and Blazers and such.

Note that it's even older than yours!

Javelin wrote: In reply to patgizz: Dooood, read CAM-S, it says the *exact* same thing, only with "2 passengers". It's very obvious that regular cab pick-ups are CAM-S. In fact, the SCCA website ran a story like a week ago on a C10 running CAM-S. CAM-T is for crew-cabs and Blazers and such.

Probably just a typo, but CAM-T is the only class that doesn't mention trucks in the rules at all. CAM-C and CAM-S are the classes for trucks.

Any idea why they'd be motivated to split 2 passenger trucks from 4 passenger trucks? Seems to me that it's more likely that trucks can fall in either CAM-C or CAM-S and the determining factor isn't the number of passengers, but the weight. So trucks over 3200lbs would all fall in CAM-C, while stripped out race trucks between 2350-3199lbs would go in CAM-S with the more exotic stuff.

Javelin wrote: Note that it's even older than yours!

please also note that that thing is completely awesome!

bentwrench wrote: Why do guys all go to the Corvettes and Vipers for comparison? Those cars are big heavy pigs on a tight AutoX course and a light weight 4 banger with at least one ball can smack them down.... Actually I think they are moving away from any classification and grouping competitors by PAX now. A lightened up 2wd S10 Blazer with a nice setup would probably be as good if not better than the big 2 road race cars.

Nope. Trucks fall into the class that conforms to their year. In this case, it would be CAM/T.

patgizz wrote: i have the rules in front of me, and enjoy that they're short. however i'm a tad off on the classing for my truck. it's a 1990 c1500 short bed regular cab, and is basically a 454SS clone but lower. i'm reading the CAM-T rules that say body styles originating from 1954-89. the body originated in 88 so based on that it falls there. but then CAM-S says this "Sports cars and sedans/coupes with seating for 2 or more adults and pickups" so do pickups fall into CAM-C and T based on the design or do ALL pickups fall into S with the corvettes and vipers for some strange reason? reason i ask is my truck is my only non broken backup capable of getting seat time in while the datsun is down for engine repairs, and today is my 2nd missed event because of those repairs. the car won't be done for the next event either likely as my most important goal is being reliable for the challenge, but i want to get seat time and am just trying to figure out what letters to tape onto my doors.

CAM is the catch-all special olympics of autox class anyway. Who cares what you are running against.

Dietcoke wrote:

patgizz wrote: i have the rules in front of me, and enjoy that they're short. however i'm a tad off on the classing for my truck. it's a 1990 c1500 short bed regular cab, and is basically a 454SS clone but lower. i'm reading the CAM-T rules that say body styles originating from 1954-89. the body originated in 88 so based on that it falls there. but then CAM-S says this "Sports cars and sedans/coupes with seating for 2 or more adults and pickups" so do pickups fall into CAM-C and T based on the design or do ALL pickups fall into S with the corvettes and vipers for some strange reason? reason i ask is my truck is my only non broken backup capable of getting seat time in while the datsun is down for engine repairs, and today is my 2nd missed event because of those repairs. the car won't be done for the next event either likely as my most important goal is being reliable for the challenge, but i want to get seat time and am just trying to figure out what letters to tape onto my doors.

CAM is the catch-all special olympics of autox class anyway. Who cares what you are running against.

that's a pretty horribly insensitive comment toward people with disabilities. right up there with all you guys here that think it's still acceptable to call things retarded.

Other than the timing events of an engine.

My s10 has a bench and holds three people...

patgizz wrote:

Dietcoke wrote:

patgizz wrote: i have the rules in front of me, and enjoy that they're short. however i'm a tad off on the classing for my truck. it's a 1990 c1500 short bed regular cab, and is basically a 454SS clone but lower. i'm reading the CAM-T rules that say body styles originating from 1954-89. the body originated in 88 so based on that it falls there. but then CAM-S says this "Sports cars and sedans/coupes with seating for 2 or more adults and pickups" so do pickups fall into CAM-C and T based on the design or do ALL pickups fall into S with the corvettes and vipers for some strange reason? reason i ask is my truck is my only non broken backup capable of getting seat time in while the datsun is down for engine repairs, and today is my 2nd missed event because of those repairs. the car won't be done for the next event either likely as my most important goal is being reliable for the challenge, but i want to get seat time and am just trying to figure out what letters to tape onto my doors.

CAM is the catch-all special olympics of autox class anyway. Who cares what you are running against.

that's a pretty horribly insensitive comment toward people with disabilities. right up there with all you guys here that think it's still acceptable to call things retarded.

A truck in a car contest is the very definition of special olympics.

What do you call timing that isn't as advanced as it should be? Retarded.

What do you call a person that isn't as advanced as it should be? Retarded.

It's a literal thing. If that offends you, might I suggest taking up a new language that doesn't have the word 'retarded' with the same meaning as it does in english.

In reply to Dietcoke:

Not everything is about winning. The vast majority of autocrossers are out there to have fun. Who cares what type of vehicle they're doing it in? Are trucks the ideal platform for performance driving? Absolutely not. Is it a blast to see other's faces as you drive your inferior truck to a time similar to more expensive, sportier cars? Hell yes.

mtownneon wrote: Nope. Trucks fall into the class that conforms to their year. In this case, it would be CAM/T.

NOPE. CAM-T is the only CAM that specifically doesn't even allow trucks.

It's very simple. Seats 4 = CAM-C, seats less than 4 = CAM-S.

Javelin wrote: In the 2-page CAM rulebook; specifically:

SCCA said: CAM-S (Sports) (all eligible vehicles) • Sports cars and sedans/coupes with seating originally for 2 or more adults and pickups.

Although upon further review, one of the changes for this season also states:

SCCA said: CAM-C (Contemporary) (body styles from 1990-on plus CAM-T cars and CAMT cars with ABS/TCS) • Sedans/coupes with seating originally for 4 or more adults or pick-ups

So it looks like if your truck holds less than 4 people, you are CAM-S, and 4 or more people, you are CAM-C. Note that there is NO provision for pick-ups in CAM-T.

Since everyone still seems to be missing it.

I think this thread is helping me to make the decision that my next project car should be a truck.

Probably the picture of the stepside helped a lot.

Javelin wrote:

Javelin wrote: In the 2-page CAM rulebook; specifically:

SCCA said: CAM-S (Sports) (all eligible vehicles) • Sports cars and sedans/coupes with seating originally for 2 or more adults and pickups.

Although upon further review, one of the changes for this season also states:

SCCA said: CAM-C (Contemporary) (body styles from 1990-on plus CAM-T cars and CAMT cars with ABS/TCS) • Sedans/coupes with seating originally for 4 or more adults or pick-ups

So it looks like if your truck holds less than 4 people, you are CAM-S, and 4 or more people, you are CAM-C. Note that there is NO provision for pick-ups in CAM-T.

Since everyone still seems to be missing it.

Why would they choose to separate trucks by number of passengers though? Wouldn't it make more sense to let them run in whatever class their specs merit? So they're placed in the class based on the curb weight, wheelbase and year requirements.

Maybe they were planning for K5 Blazer on a C5 Corvette chassis sort of antics.

In reply to Chadeux: Do you think that would weigh less than 3200lbs though? C5s started at 3100-3200lbs anyway. Taking the fiberglass body off of a C5 and replacing it with a steel, full sized SUV body seems like it would only increase the weight. Personally, I don't see why anybody would have a problem with vehicles with similar power/weight competing in the same class.

Even if that thing were under 3200lbs, it would be classed in CAM-S with much lighter, faster stuff and it probably wouldn't be competitive

I mean, it's a pro-touring-ish thing that ended up on the internet, it probably weighs at least 4000lbs.

I found the height/track width chart in case anyone else was looking for it or doesn't have the rules in front of them.

http://www.autocross.us/forums/topic/5569-excluded-from-stock-in-scca-rule-book/

In reply to The_Jed:

I don't think that chart is correct. AFAIK, for SCCA autocross, it's a 1:1 relationship. Can't be taller than its track width, although a safety steward does have the right to accept it if it's outside the rules and he feels it's safe enough.