E39 BMW vs. C5 Audi A6

Buy-in, driving experience, maintenance, reliability, DIY-ability and anything else you can think of.

Is this apples-to-apples? Do you have a preference?

Learn me?

Had dinner with a bunch of Koni gear heads at SEMA last week and this very subject came up. It was overwhelmingly voted BMW from the ownership standpoint.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

Good to know it's not a strange question.

Do you remember any specifics?

This might be useful to you

http://thegarage.jalopnik.com/four-reasons-why-you-need-to-buy-a-bmw-e39-540i-right-n-1659284463

I briefly drove an E39. I was let down because I had built them up so highly in my mind. It would have taken more seat time to become accustomed to it.

I haven't driven any Audi, ever. I need to change that.

E39 encompasses a lot of engines ....

Which one are you looking at?

Ive heard the 6 cylinder cars are better dds, because the tc guides dont fail and they have a rack instead of a gearbox.

Id want the 540 though. You know V8... TORQUE. Camaro muatang mindset, cant buy the 6 when there is an 8

In reply to Slippery:

The biggest I6! M52 is my guess.

ebonyandivory wrote: In reply to Keith Tanner: Good to know it's not a strange question. Do you remember any specifics?

I've not driven a 6 cylinder E39. Despite what everyone tells you and Tavarish claims, the 540i Sport is not an M5 substitute. There's a significant difference in speed, composure, interior appointments and suspension. And yes, fuel economy. But the non-Ms are certainly easier to live with.

As for the Audis, I don't remember specifics. Sorry. It was a long week.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

No. I think you for your replies!

Even though I have a love affair with I6's, the more I look into the V8's, the more I want one.

The sounds they make are hard to resist.

They drive very differently. The BMW has the more traditional enthusiast-oriented feel, what with being F/R, but unless you go with the M5 it's got an open rear diff which is somewhat disappointing. The C5 gets a Torsen center diff in all quattro forms (don't buy a FWD Audi -- just don't), and will do the Audi thing where you stand on the gas at the apex and it just accelerates madly out of the corner (best done with a lot of power).

The Audi has the nicer interior, the BMW is slightly less complex and has less stuff to break, although neither of them is what I'd call "reliable". They're 15+ year old German luxury/sport sedans, you have to expect a ton of deferred maintenance at this point.

I'd skip the base model engine in either of them (528s or 2.8 A6s... blech). The 2.7T will make a ton of power and is a very strong motor, but access is limited and it's a PITA to get at the turbos/etc. A C5 S6 is a lot less expensive than an E39 M5, but not as fast. I think the C5 S6 is the best street car of the bunch, but the only one I'd be willing to take to the track is the E39 M5.

"Quattro FTW":

Oh, one other thing, the C5 S6 comes only as an Avant. V8 wagons are awesome, and there are manual transmission retrofit kits available if you're sufficiently ambitious. An E39 M5 is a future collector car and priced accordingly, the C5 S6 is a lot less expensive.

I still have PTSD from the 100LS I owned in the late '70's, so nyet to Audi for me.

I almost bought an E39 not long ago and did extensive research including interviews with several BMW techs. The consensus was that the 530i was the one to have as a daily driver.

There are 5-speed cars out there but the majority of cars are automatics. The GM automatic is a much less expensive rebuild than the ZF.

The self-leveling headlamps were problematic and expensive, otherwise just normal BMW stuff: weak cooling systems, dead pixels, etc.

Nice highway cars but I ended up with another 3-series.

Keith Tanner wrote:

ebonyandivory wrote: In reply to Keith Tanner: Good to know it's not a strange question. Do you remember any specifics?

I've not driven a 6 cylinder E39. Despite what everyone tells you and Tavarish claims, the 540i Sport is not an M5 substitute. There's a significant difference in speed, composure, interior appointments and suspension. And yes, fuel economy. But the non-Ms are certainly easier to live with. As for the Audis, I don't remember specifics. Sorry. It was a long week.

I would prefer the Audi for its ease of repair, much more DIY-friendly control systems, and you don't have to remove the cylinder heads when the air injection passages plug with carbon, set secondary air fault codes, and cause you to fail emissions. (If you have the V8, which I am assuming is the BMW being considered because why not?)

Plus I think Audis drive a lot nicer than BMWs. The weighting of the controls and their response is more pleasant to me.

bludroptop wrote: I still have PTSD from the 100LS I owned in the late '70's, so nyet to Audi for me.

The 77 Mustang sucked too, so I'll make sure to not consider a new one at all. Makes perfect sense.

Great cruisers, this one was a Sport Touring so it had a 5spd and it was engaging to drive. I did 23k in about 9 months with it before it met its demise in my hands. I've had four touringss and they are all good cars to use.

MDJeepGuy wrote:

bludroptop wrote: I still have PTSD from the 100LS I owned in the late '70's, so nyet to Audi for me.

The 77 Mustang sucked too, so I'll make sure to not consider a new one at all. Makes perfect sense.

Bold emphasis added. You buy whatever the berkeley you want. The "T" in PTSD stands for "traumatic" and I don't use that term lightly.

E39 by far will be a better car. I'm biased from my E39 ownership. You wont find an M5 cheap as they are going to be collector cars. You can get a 540, but likely it will have an autotragic. Of course the 6 has better steering, but its a tradeoff for the massive torque of the v8. If you can do maintenance on your own the V8 isn't that bad, just more complicated.

In any case I stay far away from VAG in terms of old touring cars. The e39 is very user friendly in comparison

I'm an Audi guy. But most here would prefer the bmw. The bmw' engines are either anemic and reliable or powerful and not so reliable. I also think the bmw has a higher maintenance cost with mote regular consumables but is overall more reliable.

Can't really comment on the Audi, I've put nearly 100k (nearing 200k total) and done virtually all the wrenching on my 2001 525i. It's not a difficult car to work on generally speaking, and when everything is right it's a great all-around DD. As with any German car of this vintage, expect a fair bit of maintenance to keep it that way.

Personally, I would only own an I6 car, but I have a play car for fun, so my priority for my DD is economy and ease of maintenance, not power. Automatics suck the life out of the I6, so a manual box is mandatory in my book. 525i is a bit underpowered unless you are willing to flog it the way the Bavarian elves intended; the 530i adds some 40hp, making it much happier in the midrange. Finding a sport package car is worth it - I bought my 525i instead of holding out for a 530i because it was a sport. With snows it's plenty capable in winter.

In reply to 02Pilot:

I'd disagree on the sport package. At this point the suspension (sport or standard) is due for replacement anyway. Some models did get special trim pieces with the package though.

Excellent huge E39 buyers guide here

eebasist wrote: In reply to 02Pilot: I'd disagree on the sport package. At this point the suspension (sport or standard) is due for replacement anyway. Some models did get special trim pieces with the package though. Excellent huge E39 buyers guide here

The seats alone are worth looking for a sport one.

In reply to eebasist:

While some of the suspension will be due for replacement, the sport package was more than just a spring & shock package. The wheels were upgraded to 17"s, and as you noted there are trim upgrades as well (big stuff like the steering wheel, not just cosmetics). If you can find a Sport Premium you really get a lot of nice upgrades over stock.

'97-'01 will have the m52 in it and ergo, all the things that can be done to a classic m52 apply ( I think). That would actually be the one I would buy if I were in the market. Later 01+ will have the m54 in either 2.5 or 3.0 guise. Drive a 540 first before you buy it. On paper I thought it was going to be the shiznit, but once I test drove my cousin's m-sport version, I was kinda disappointed. The recirculating ball steering makes for some very vague turns and while the v8 made nifty sounds, that's not enough of a selling point for me. The m5 is a whole 'nother category and their prices reflect that. It's really the creme de la creme of the lineup, destined to be a future classic, and are priced accordingly (but not stratospherically).

I'm looking for a very good GT type car. Something I can be in for long drives but sporty enough to be interesting and the ability to ignite the tires and drift it for the hell of it would be nice (not on public roads, I'm not a TOTAL moron ya know!)

I like to post up comparisons on similar vehicles every now and again. Especially when I am actually looking for one the two