kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Dork
11/24/22 10:11 p.m.

In reply to alfadriver :

When I watched the vid I was thinking the bikini sized fenders shown wouldn't be very effective.

 I think an elongated section extending well back and very low to seperate the water from the air and dump it back on the track would be ugly but perhaps more effective.

 Of course I'm a carpenter not an air whisperer so probably got it wrong :)

loosecannon
loosecannon SuperDork
11/25/22 8:31 a.m.

I don't think the idea of covered wheels for heavy rain is going to work. There are too many problems with having to fit them and remove them for mixed conditions. I think a better idea is to just make a better, and taller full wet tire. Making them taller will raise the cars up and reduce ground affect and if they are also narrower, the tire will not have to displace as much water. 

jmabarone
jmabarone Reader
11/28/22 8:44 a.m.
alfadriver said:

Just saw a thing on The Race that apparently the FIA/F1 is considering rear wheel fenders for rainy weekends.  So the spray is more subdued.   Hm.

Nascar has had mesh mudflaps on the rear for road courses for a couple years.  Glad that technology is trickling down to F1.  

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner MegaDork
11/28/22 3:15 p.m.
loosecannon said:

I don't think the idea of covered wheels for heavy rain is going to work. There are too many problems with having to fit them and remove them for mixed conditions. I think a better idea is to just make a better, and taller full wet tire. Making them taller will raise the cars up and reduce ground affect and if they are also narrower, the tire will not have to displace as much water. 

Yeah, the big roostertail of spray isn't from the tires, it's from the ground effect vacuuming the surface and launching the water into the air. Although I would look forward to seeing the crews mount/dismount them in 2 seconds in a pit stop.

Making the wet tires taller could have some interesting side effects. Decreasing ground effect would certainly make the drivers clench more, but I wonder what it would do to aero on top as well? Also, what about clearance?

Purple Frog (Forum Supporter)
Purple Frog (Forum Supporter) Dork
11/28/22 7:42 p.m.

Beware of unintended consequences.  Where is the water going to go that the front fenders trap?  If it falls to the pavement in front of the rear tyres... oops.

Keith is correct.  Having driven high performance formula cars in the rain, the diffuser is what puts up a large amount of spray in a fairly wide pattern.  

Rain tires that are a different diameter than the drys cause all kinds of problems.  Been there, done that.

loosecannon
loosecannon SuperDork
11/29/22 7:49 a.m.

Binotto has resigned, Ferrari is berkeleyed. I sure hope Mercedes can come out swinging next year

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
11/29/22 9:31 a.m.

In reply to loosecannon :

They seem to have a broken system. Start with a fast car, and almost finish 3rd. For both reliability and poor call reasons. 
 

Who is the source of that, I wonder.  

MiniDave
MiniDave Reader
11/29/22 1:07 p.m.

Talk is that Vasseur will be appointed, he's LeClerc's champion so that could fit, might not be a good thing for Sainz tho......

Too bad about Binny tho, I liked him and I think one more year to get things sorted would have been the ticket.

I do think Merc will come out swinging next year and the Reds Bull will have their hands full with them. No idea where Ferrari will end up, but if Vasseur is the answer, why isn't Alfa further up the grid?

Talk was Brawn would come back to Ferrari, but's he's adamantly said he's retired and just going to spend time on his sofa.

codrus (Forum Supporter)
codrus (Forum Supporter) PowerDork
11/29/22 2:20 p.m.
MiniDave said:

Talk was Brawn would come back to Ferrari, but's he's adamantly said he's retired and just going to spend time on his sofa.

He's said that before, but he was 15 years younger at the time.

 

vozproto
vozproto New Reader
11/30/22 11:20 a.m.

On Binotto leaving, I say good riddance. 

The trajectory of their season started out strong, followed by whimpering their way down through the field with unacceptable numbers of mismanaged races, botched strategies, and offering pointless soliloquies to their drivers mid-race. 

The only exceptions to their downward spiral were when their drivers took matters into their own hands to tell the team something to the effect of "STFU I'm driving", or "No. Your strategy doesnt make sense. Piss off."

I'm excited to see what the team looks like with the season starting off with two drivers each having at least one win under their belt.

codrus (Forum Supporter)
codrus (Forum Supporter) PowerDork
11/30/22 12:29 p.m.
vozproto said:

On Binotto leaving, I say good riddance. 

Whoever shows up next year will be 5th guy in charge of Ferrari in the last 10 years (Domenicalli, Mattiacci, Arrivabene, Binotto, new guy).  Firing your team principal every couple years just doesn't work.

 

Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter)
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
11/30/22 12:43 p.m.

So, Ferrari are going to fall further behind with yet another management overhaul coming for next year leading to a lack of consistency and direction in leadership. Will they manage to keep third in constructors behind RB and Merc next year? or will Alpine and/or McLaren jump past them by staying the course instead of throwing the baby out with the bathwater yet again?  When will they learn?  Mercedes started the year off as a mess.  No public shaming, no slamming one Engineering team or another, no public spats between different people and management.  Instead they put their heads down, looked at what was wrong, and quietly went about fixing it.  Until Ferrari learn that lesson, and get a lead driver who doesn't throw away so many points, they will never return to true championship contenders.

vozproto
vozproto New Reader
12/1/22 11:51 a.m.
codrus (Forum Supporter) said:
vozproto said:

On Binotto leaving, I say good riddance. 

Whoever shows up next year will be 5th guy in charge of Ferrari in the last 10 years (Domenicalli, Mattiacci, Arrivabene, Binotto, new guy).  Firing your team principal every couple years just doesn't work.

 

From my undersatnding though, Domencalli gave it a good 6yr run. And then Mattiacci and Arrivabene were successful businessmen who happened to be Italian, with no real racing blood. 

Binotto was a great pick as he is versed in the engineering side of things. But (speaking as an engineer) not all engineers make good leaders. Between the soliloquies with drivers mid-race and all the botched strategies, it is obvious that he doesnt know how to run that team. Sure that is easy for me to say from behind a keyboard on a Monday morning... but then again, I'm not vying for the principal position. lol 

They need to prioritize finding the RIGHT guy for the position over them being Italian. 

triumph7
triumph7 HalfDork
12/1/22 12:28 p.m.
vozproto said:
codrus (Forum Supporter) said:
vozproto said:

On Binotto leaving, I say good riddance. 

Whoever shows up next year will be 5th guy in charge of Ferrari in the last 10 years (Domenicalli, Mattiacci, Arrivabene, Binotto, new guy).  Firing your team principal every couple years just doesn't work.

 

From my undersatnding though, Domencalli gave it a good 6yr run. And then Mattiacci and Arrivabene were successful businessmen who happened to be Italian, with no real racing blood. 

Binotto was a great pick as he is versed in the engineering side of things. But (speaking as an engineer) not all engineers make good leaders. Between the soliloquies with drivers mid-race and all the botched strategies, it is obvious that he doesnt know how to run that team. Sure that is easy for me to say from behind a keyboard on a Monday morning... but then again, I'm not vying for the principal position. lol 

They need to prioritize finding the RIGHT guy for the position over them being Italian. 

I'm finding the suggestion of Vettel to be interesting.  He's proven that he understands strategy and has shown some leadership skills BUT it's an awful big jump.

NY Nick
NY Nick Dork
12/1/22 1:40 p.m.

In reply to triumph7 :

I am all in for Vettel and he should hire a German Umpa Band to play polka and serve Schnitzel in hospitality. That may shake the brass at Ferrari but it will establish his dominance in the relationship. smiley

MiniDave
MiniDave Reader
12/1/22 1:40 p.m.

Well, now you're just being silly......

Ross Brawn says they're working on allowing movable aerodynamic parts for the 2026 rules updates/changes (yes I know, DRS is moveable aero) but this time something that somehow can be manipulated to slow the lead car down?

Huh?

CAinCA
CAinCA HalfDork
12/1/22 2:25 p.m.
MiniDave said:

Too bad about Binny tho, I liked him and I think one more year to get things sorted would have been the ticket.

 

It seems like every time Ferrari are starting to come back they switch management and direction and wind up on the back foot again.

loosecannon
loosecannon SuperDork
12/2/22 9:10 a.m.
MiniDave said:

Well, now you're just being silly......

Ross Brawn says they're working on allowing movable aerodynamic parts for the 2026 rules updates/changes (yes I know, DRS is moveable aero) but this time something that somehow can be manipulated to slow the lead car down?

Huh?

My immediate thought after reading the story was that all they should do is allow DRS only when passing for position. Currently they have DRS when 1 second behind any car, including lapped cars. It would make it harder to get ahead once lapped traffic is encountered.

06HHR (Forum Supporter)
06HHR (Forum Supporter) Dork
12/2/22 12:01 p.m.
jmabarone
jmabarone Reader
12/5/22 8:00 a.m.
loosecannon said:
 

My immediate thought after reading the story was that all they should do is allow DRS only when passing for position. Currently they have DRS when 1 second behind any car, including lapped cars. It would make it harder to get ahead once lapped traffic is encountered.

Not a bad suggestion, but what about a DRS use limit?  Not necessarily "10 DRS laps per race" but a lockout where you can use it for 2 laps then have to take off 1 lap.  Sort of how the ERS works where they cannot harvest as much as they can use.  

NorseDave
NorseDave HalfDork
12/7/22 1:38 p.m.

Hyundai to F1 ??

 

rob_lewis
rob_lewis UberDork
12/7/22 2:41 p.m.
NorseDave said:

Hyundai to F1 ??

 

Good to see the winter break doldrums are still kept entertaining by potentially wild theories and thought exercises!!  :D

-Rob

Iusedtobefast
Iusedtobefast Reader
12/7/22 3:43 p.m.

Hyundai will just have to remember to put The Club on the steering wheel when they park after the race...

JimS
JimS Reader
12/7/22 5:23 p.m.

Eliminate DRS. Earn your positions. Unfair advantage. If you can't catch someone and pass them, too bad. 

Advan046
Advan046 UberDork
12/7/22 6:37 p.m.

End of Line

 

F1 2023 thread

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