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Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 12:25 a.m.

(Sorry, totally stealing the thread title from the old-school cars/cameras thread).

How about a thinkpad 360cs (sold from 1994-1995) with a broken screen tuning a 30 year old electromotive ECU on a 41 year old fiat?

Some of the files on the computer (this laptop came in the passenger footwell of the car). 

There's more in my build thread but I thought this was fun enough for its own separate thread. Enjoy!

Turbo_Rev
Turbo_Rev New Reader
4/26/22 12:41 a.m.

These are heretofore unknown levels of hipster silliness. 

 

And it's pretty great, I must say.

preach (dudeist priest)
preach (dudeist priest) Dork
4/26/22 5:52 a.m.
Turbo_Rev said:

These are heretofore unknown levels of hipster silliness. 

I just snorted Pabst Blue Ribbon onto my manicured mustache and on to my vintage flannel shirt.

Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter)
Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter) SuperDork
4/26/22 6:12 a.m.

I feel like this is a nightmare I had recently. I am certain I can install and tune a different system in the time it would take me to re-learn and trick an old Tec into doing what I wanted to. cool

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
4/26/22 7:06 a.m.

In reply to Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter) :

The only real hard part is that it's DOS and not Windows based.  The TEC is pretty simple, but the dos part sucks- the data acq is worse.  But you can find a WinTec chip to program some of these old machines.

dean1484
dean1484 MegaDork
4/26/22 7:16 a.m.

No photos at the moment but my MS2 that is going in to the Porsche project has been around 15 years I think?  I got this one used in 2009.  It has out lived three tuning laptops. 

maschinenbau
maschinenbau UltraDork
4/26/22 8:21 a.m.

Robbie right now:

Ryan Beckford Hackerman HD Template | Ryan Beckford | Know Your Meme

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 8:22 a.m.
preach (dudeist priest) said:
Turbo_Rev said:

These are heretofore unknown levels of hipster silliness. 

I just snorted Pabst Blue Ribbon onto my manicured mustache and on to my vintage flannel shirt.

Suspenders ok though? 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 8:25 a.m.
maschinenbau said:

Robbie right now:

Ryan Beckford Hackerman HD Template | Ryan Beckford | Know Your Meme

That's also what I do for work, so...

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 8:28 a.m.

The laptop currently runs windows 95 and has a sticker on it that says "year 2000 tested ok" with a date of 4/98 or so written in.

Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter)
Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter) SuperDork
4/26/22 10:57 a.m.
dean1484 said:

No photos at the moment but my MS2 that is going in to the Porsche project has been around 15 years I think?  I got this one used in 2009.  It has out lived three tuning laptops. 

That unit is still surprisingly relevant and useful today.

J.A. Ackley
J.A. Ackley Senior Editor
4/26/22 11:29 a.m.

Wow. They don't make them like that anymore.

APEowner
APEowner SuperDork
4/26/22 11:43 a.m.

You call that old school?  Back in my day we had to pull the EPROM, erase it with UV light and program it in a burner if we wanted a custom tune.  And, we had to figure out what the values in the different fields did through experimentation.

 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 12:06 p.m.
APEowner said:

You call that old school?  Back in my day we had to pull the EPROM, erase it with UV light and program it in a burner if we wanted a custom tune.  And, we had to figure out what the values in the different fields did through experimentation.

 

That doesn't sound very 'standalone' to me. That sounds more like tricking a factory ECU into doing what you want it to.

If it helps, this standalone programming uses "Gama" which is the inverse of lambda. Same idea (1 is good), but higher number means richer and lower means leaner. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 12:07 p.m.

Here's a real question though for all you tuners out there. What do you use for knock sensing? I'm going to setup a knock sensor on the motor and try to listen to it while tuning through some headphones. 

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
4/26/22 12:59 p.m.

In reply to Robbie (Forum Supporter) :

To start with, your ear will be best.  Not with the knock sensor, but with a microphone.  While the knock signal is confirmed with cylinder pressure transducers, most of the acceptable amounts are done with a microphone hanging over the engine.

If you can have a trigger, and the ECU can also record the knock signal, you can just drive, and when you hear knock- hit the trigger and mark it on a data log.  The sound is so very different that it's easy to pick out.

APEowner
APEowner SuperDork
4/26/22 1:07 p.m.
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:
APEowner said:

You call that old school?  Back in my day we had to pull the EPROM, erase it with UV light and program it in a burner if we wanted a custom tune.  And, we had to figure out what the values in the different fields did through experimentation.

 

That doesn't sound very 'standalone' to me. That sounds more like tricking a factory ECU into doing what you want it to.

If it helps, this standalone programming uses "Gama" which is the inverse of lambda. Same idea (1 is good), but higher number means richer and lower means leaner. 

True.  I was trying (and apparently failing) to be funny.

Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter)
Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter) SuperDork
4/26/22 1:11 p.m.
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:

Here's a real question though for all you tuners out there. What do you use for knock sensing? I'm going to setup a knock sensor on the motor and try to listen to it while tuning through some headphones. 

Nothing. Really. Knock is an indication that you aren't using race fuel of sufficient octane for what you are doing. Easily solved problem laugh

I have a self-made knock ear (copper tube, beaten flat, folded at the end, bolted to the block, to a fuel hose into a set of earmuffs) when I need to tune on lawnmower fuel.

Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter)
Paul_VR6 (Forum Supporter) SuperDork
4/26/22 1:50 p.m.

Out of curiosity, I did a little digging. Found some 3.5" floppy discs with tunes for a CBR600RR on some old ass Bosch motorsports ECU. laugh

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/26/22 3:11 p.m.
APEowner said:
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:
APEowner said:

You call that old school?  Back in my day we had to pull the EPROM, erase it with UV light and program it in a burner if we wanted a custom tune.  And, we had to figure out what the values in the different fields did through experimentation.

 

That doesn't sound very 'standalone' to me. That sounds more like tricking a factory ECU into doing what you want it to.

If it helps, this standalone programming uses "Gama" which is the inverse of lambda. Same idea (1 is good), but higher number means richer and lower means leaner. 

True.  I was trying (and apparently failing) to be funny.

Hahahaha my bad!

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) MegaDork
4/26/22 5:45 p.m.
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:
APEowner said:

You call that old school?  Back in my day we had to pull the EPROM, erase it with UV light and program it in a burner if we wanted a custom tune.  And, we had to figure out what the values in the different fields did through experimentation.

 

That doesn't sound very 'standalone' to me. That sounds more like tricking a factory ECU into doing what you want it to.

If it helps, this standalone programming uses "Gama" which is the inverse of lambda. Same idea (1 is good), but higher number means richer and lower means leaner. 

Equivalence ratio, like GM uses? 

vwcorvette (Forum Supporter)
vwcorvette (Forum Supporter) UberDork
4/26/22 5:50 p.m.

I still break out the Toshiba laptop from 2000 running Windows ME for doing diagnostics on Mk4 VWs using Vag-Com. Still works fine. Uwe was shocked it still worked. Suggested upgrading to a newer netbook that I have and get a new dongle.

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/9/22 1:44 p.m.

Quick update here, I was able to successfully connect to the ECU yesterday using a much newer laptop (with working screen and battery, haha) using a DOS emulator. 

Currently I still need to use a computer with a serial cable port, but that was absolutely a step in the right direction for stability and usability.

CrustyRedXpress
CrustyRedXpress HalfDork
5/9/22 1:55 p.m.

Man, I thought I was badass using windows xp to tune some obd0 ECUs from the early 90s. Nice work!

When I needed a serial port a USB>Serial connector worked fine. YMMV...

GCrites80s
GCrites80s Dork
5/10/22 12:13 p.m.
APEowner said:

You call that old school?  Back in my day we had to pull the EPROM, erase it with UV light and program it in a burner if we wanted a custom tune.  And, we had to figure out what the values in the different fields did through experimentation.

 

Oh god, so many of the parameters don't do anything noticeable. Especially not instantly.

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