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nderwater
nderwater UltimaDork
5/16/19 1:54 p.m.

When I purchased my 2010 Jaguar XK 5.0 about a year and a half ago, I understood that it was an older used car and that with over 50,000 miles on the odometer a major service was due in the not-so-distant future. The XK is my first Jaguar and my first time owning a V8 or a used car with direct injection; I must say that I've been a bit taken aback with how much this car has cost to service:

Here's how my "60,000 Mile Service" has cost $7,500 (and counting! additional issues keep coming up)

- Replace oil and oil filter
- Replace air filters and cabin air filter
- Replace fuel filter
- Replace serpentine belt and tensioner
- Replace cracked air intake hose
- Replace brake pads, pad sensors, rotors and brake fluid
- Replace transmission fluid and fluid filter assembly (under strong advisement)
- Replace water pump, misc. coolant hoses and coolant; required replacing intake manifold gaskets (after critical leak)
- Replace fuel injectors (after being stranded)
- Replace engine mounts (cracked)

This list represents roughly $4,000 in OEM Jaguar parts and fluids plus over 30 hours of Jaguar Specialist labor at $110 per hour. What an eye-opening experience this has been so far.

stanger_missle
stanger_missle SuperDork
5/16/19 2:12 p.m.
nderwater said:

 What an eye-opening experience this has been so far.

I fell like this is a nice way of exclaiming "What the berkeley have I got myself into?!"

Other than the transmission, cooling system and fuel injection system parts, everything else seems to be normal maintenance items.

If you didn't have those aforementioned issues, do you think you'd own another modern Jag?

_
_ Reader
5/16/19 2:16 p.m.

I feel like much of that could’ve been replaced with an afternoon in the garage, even if it’s a jag. The fuel stuff and water pump, yeah, let someone else bloody their knuckles. Air and oil filter? You must have money to burn, or be aging. 

Side rant: it’s always cracked me up how the simplest things break on cars like this. 60k, and the air intake tubing didn’t make it? Same with the motor mounts? Is the car made from aged cheddar? 

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
5/16/19 2:16 p.m.

It'd be interesting to see what the individual services are. At my local BMW indy guy.

An oil change is right at $105 I believe. OE filter and AMSOIL 5w-40.

Oil Filter Housing Gasket was $475

Replace spark plugs, air filter, cabin air filter was about $450.

Valve Cover gasket when needed will be about $650. If it needs a new valve cover the job jumps to almost $1100.

Replace belt tensioner, belt, and pulleys when needed will be about $450.

 

The only other two big ones I haven't asked about are replacing the electric water pump and hoses. Or replacing the oil pan gasket when/if it starts leaking.

MTechnically
MTechnically Reader
5/16/19 2:17 p.m.

In reply to nderwater :

Part of this post makes me shake my head in disbelief in the cost at such low mileage, but then I remember that I have an E39 M5 waiting to take me home from work today. The reality is that if I went to the dealership for all the work it needs I'd probably be right up there with you.

This only makes me more resolute in my decision to do absolutely as much work as possible and source my parts from OEM suppliers. You can save so much money and that doesn't just apply to European super saloons. 

Right after my daughter was born Mrs. MTechnically's CX-5 needed front brakes. In a moment of sleep deprived decision making I had a shop take car of it. $600 later we had fresh pads and rotors on the car, and I determined that I'd never do that again.

If you've got the money to make problems go away than more power to you, but for the regular enthusiast sweat equity pays dividends.

Daylan C
Daylan C UltraDork
5/16/19 2:17 p.m.

I'm over here trying to find where the extra $3,000 in parts went. Glad I still play with E36 M3boxes.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
5/16/19 2:19 p.m.
_ said:

I feel like much of that could’ve been replaced with an afternoon in the garage, even if it’s a jag. The fuel stuff and water pump, yeah, let someone else bloody their knuckles. Air and oil filter? You must have money to burn, or be aging. 

As an example, I'm perfectly capable of changing the oil in my 135i. However, then I have to jack the car up, pull the undertray, let it drain, clean up any spills, etc. Drain plug back in, 7 quarts in, start up and check for leaks. Undertray back on, lower the car down, and now I have a bunch of used oil to dispose of and only my car to use to take it to the store. 

Or I can drive to my Indy guy, use my laptop to work in the waiting area. And only spend about $20 more than if I did it myself. And now I haven't taken any evening/weekend time from my girlfriend and dogs. 

MTechnically
MTechnically Reader
5/16/19 2:28 p.m.
z31maniac said:
_ said:

I feel like much of that could’ve been replaced with an afternoon in the garage, even if it’s a jag. The fuel stuff and water pump, yeah, let someone else bloody their knuckles. Air and oil filter? You must have money to burn, or be aging. 

As an example, I'm perfectly capable of changing the oil in my 135i. However, then I have to jack the car up, pull the undertray, let it drain, clean up any spills, etc. Drain plug back in, 7 quarts in, start up and check for leaks. Undertray back on, lower the car down, and now I have a bunch of used oil to dispose of and only my car to use to take it to the store. 

Or I can drive to my Indy guy, use my laptop to work in the waiting area. And only spend about $20 more than if I did it myself. And now I haven't taken any evening/weekend time from my girlfriend and dogs. 

Oil changes are probably the one case where it makes sense for someone else to do it. The cost to convenience ratio is pretty compelling.

Brake jobs are absolutely not worth it if you are even slightly mechanically inclined. There's plenty of other examples where you can save hundreds if not thousands of dollars by just doing simple stuff. Other times it really is better to let a pro with the experience and the tools deal with it. I'd say $450 for the filter housing gasket is absolutely worth it after doing it once myself.

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
5/16/19 2:47 p.m.

One wonders if the same thing would happen if the car was young.  All of that work for something that should be well, well, well under it's emissions cert mileage- and all but a few items are emissions related.  Which is to say, Jag should be making sure that they last 150k miles with no issues, or they get fixed on THEIR bill.

JohnInKansas
JohnInKansas SuperDork
5/16/19 2:59 p.m.

Wonders to self: could a car be totalled out for routine service costs?

Just for grins, I looked it up on KBB. Specing a center-of-the-range model in good condition says the private party value is $13-15k in my area...

Holy cow that's a strange thought. Go in for an old change, leave on a wrecker and shopping for a new car.

_
_ Reader
5/16/19 3:05 p.m.
z31maniac said:
_ said:

I feel like much of that could’ve been replaced with an afternoon in the garage, even if it’s a jag. The fuel stuff and water pump, yeah, let someone else bloody their knuckles. Air and oil filter? You must have money to burn, or be aging. 

As an example, I'm perfectly capable of changing the oil in my 135i. However, then I have to jack the car up, pull the undertray, let it drain, clean up any spills, etc. Drain plug back in, 7 quarts in, start up and check for leaks. Undertray back on, lower the car down, and now I have a bunch of used oil to dispose of and only my car to use to take it to the store. 

Or I can drive to my Indy guy, use my laptop to work in the waiting area. And only spend about $20 more than if I did it myself. And now I haven't taken any evening/weekend time from my girlfriend and dogs. 

That only makes sense if it is indeed $20 extra dollars AND the shop is using quality oil and filter. The arguement could be said “why not take it Jefe Lube?”, which we would all groan over because we know they use cheap oil and filters, even though you’re saving 50$ over anywhere else, and that precious peace of mind. 

My peace of mind is knowing stuff was done right the first time. 

Snrub
Snrub HalfDork
5/16/19 3:06 p.m.

Wow.

Some of those parts are available on Rock auto at normal-ish prices; brakes, water pump, injectors, valve cover gasket, but some of them are not; belt, hoses, intake.

$110/hour isn't terrible, but it adds up in a hurry. The ability to price optimize parts is another big advantage. I could pay someone to do all the work on my cars, relative's cars, etc. but I couldn't justify the price to myself and continue with racing, etc. It's just too much.

Lof8
Lof8 Dork
5/16/19 3:19 p.m.

I had a friend text me recently about how many "awesome prices on used Jags, BMWs and even Bentley luxury cars" he was finding on FB marketplace.  I told him expensive repairs and deferred maintenance are the reason for these cheap prices.  The previous owners don't want to pay the bills.  "Don't buy one!"  He didn't listen, bought a 2011 BMW 750.  A month later:

Ranger50
Ranger50 UltimaDork
5/16/19 3:20 p.m.

Wow. Most everything there is “driveway-able” over just a few weekends. Some of that list looks like bill padding. Clearly it drove in with all that crap broken... it can leave broken to be fixed at a later date. The first 6 or 7 things I would do at home at my leisure, along with the “cracked” motor mounts...

JMO ymmv.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
5/16/19 3:23 p.m.
_ said:
z31maniac said:
_ said:

I feel like much of that could’ve been replaced with an afternoon in the garage, even if it’s a jag. The fuel stuff and water pump, yeah, let someone else bloody their knuckles. Air and oil filter? You must have money to burn, or be aging. 

As an example, I'm perfectly capable of changing the oil in my 135i. However, then I have to jack the car up, pull the undertray, let it drain, clean up any spills, etc. Drain plug back in, 7 quarts in, start up and check for leaks. Undertray back on, lower the car down, and now I have a bunch of used oil to dispose of and only my car to use to take it to the store. 

Or I can drive to my Indy guy, use my laptop to work in the waiting area. And only spend about $20 more than if I did it myself. And now I haven't taken any evening/weekend time from my girlfriend and dogs. 

That only makes sense if it is indeed $20 extra dollars AND the shop is using quality oil and filter. The arguement could be said “why not take it Jefe Lube?”, which we would all groan over because we know they use cheap oil and filters, even though you’re saving 50$ over anywhere else, and that precious peace of mind. 

My peace of mind is knowing stuff was done right the first time. 

Even with though with cheaper cars and when I was younger I never personally had a problem with the cheap oil change places, I wouldn't take my car there. 

And yes, my BMW specialist (who it's also not uncommon to see Ferrari's, Lambo's, Aston's in his shop.......he had a Saleen S7 in the other day for service) is using an OE filter and AMSOIL. He has everything priced out at his price vs what I can buy stuff for. 

It's $20 definitely well spent especially when you consider it takes me 10-11 months to hit 5k miles for the next change. 

frenchyd
frenchyd UberDork
5/16/19 3:36 p.m.
nderwater said:

When I purchased my 2010 Jaguar XK 5.0 about a year and a half ago, I understood that it was an older used car and that with over 50,000 miles on the odometer a major service was due in the not-so-distant future. The XK is my first Jaguar and my first time owning a V8 or a used car with direct injection; I must say that I've been a bit taken aback with how much this car has cost to service:

Here's how my "60,000 Mile Service" has cost $7,500 (and counting! additional issues keep coming up)

- Replace oil and oil filter
- Replace air filters and cabin air filter
- Replace fuel filter
- Replace serpentine belt and tensioner
- Replace cracked air intake hose
- Replace brake pads, pad sensors, rotors and brake fluid
- Replace transmission fluid and fluid filter assembly (under strong advisement)
- Replace water pump, misc. coolant hoses and coolant; required replacing intake manifold gaskets (after critical leak)
- Replace fuel injectors (after being stranded)
- Replace engine mounts (cracked)

This list represents roughly $4,000 in OEM Jaguar parts and fluids plus over 30 hours of Jaguar Specialist labor at $110 per hour. What an eye-opening experience this has been so far.

The cost of dealerships doing the work. Pretty much the same deal for any high end car, Mercedes Bentley, Maserati,  etc etc. 

that’s why independent shops can be 35/40% cheaper but may not be as well trained. 

Then owners take cars to local service shops and save even more. Right up to the point where it doesn’t get repaired right and turns into junk.  

That’s also why high end cars depreciate so quickly. 

Dave M
Dave M Reader
5/16/19 3:49 p.m.

I mean, I'm all for paying the man to do water pumps, or really most serious coolant work, because I hate it with a passion and I get bubbles in my system half the time.

Paying the man at a Jag dealer? Nope.

Tyler H
Tyler H UberDork
5/16/19 4:19 p.m.

Owning a grassroots Eurotrash car requires self-maintenance to make financial sense. European suppliers can't make anything out of rubber or plastic that lasts.  Figure all that stuff needs done every 60-80k miles and you won't be disappointed.  

The only way I get to drive euro cars is doing almost everything myself and valuing my labor at zero.  

All that said, if you buy a nice example that isn't neglected and proactively maintain it, they aren't as bad as the internet would have you believe.  I typically use BMWs or Porsches as a third car.  I might put 10k miles on in 3 years.  

It comes down to economies of scale.  Japanese, Korean, and American cars sells magnitudes more examples and thus the engineering is better and the parts are cheaper.  Euro luxury cars sell far fewer examples and the parts cost a lot, have less engineering R&D, and trained labor is scarce and commands higher prices.  

Even if you don't own a wrench or aren't inclined to do your own work, you can minimize your expense by establishing a relationship with a good indie shop.  A good indie will know the platform and recommend what your really need and work with you to prioritize what's important.  Get a parts list from them and buy your own parts from a quality source like FCP Euro and bring them in when you schedule the service.  That might cut the bill by a third or more.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
5/16/19 4:27 p.m.
Tyler H said:

Owning a grassroots Eurotrash car requires self-maintenance to make financial sense. European suppliers can't make anything out of rubber or plastic that lasts.  Figure all that stuff needs done every 60-80k miles and you won't be disappointed.  

The only way I get to drive euro cars is doing almost everything myself and valuing my labor at zero.  

All that said, if you buy a nice example that isn't neglected and proactively maintain it, they aren't as bad as the internet would have you believe.  I typically use BMWs or Porsches as a third car.  I might put 10k miles on in 3 years.  

It comes down to economies of scale.  Japanese, Korean, and American cars sells magnitudes more examples and thus the engineering is better and the parts are cheaper.  Euro luxury cars sell far fewer examples and the parts cost a lot, have less engineering R&D, and trained labor is scarce and commands higher prices.  

Even if you don't own a wrench or aren't inclined to do your own work, you can minimize your expense by establishing a relationship with a good indie shop.  A good indie will know the platform and recommend what your really need and work with you to prioritize what's important.  Get a parts list from them and buy your own parts from a quality source like FCP Euro and bring them in when you schedule the service.  That might cut the bill by a third or more.

If you buy your own parts, the shop 99.99999% is NOT going to warranty the work. Just something to note.

 

Alfaromeoguy
Alfaromeoguy Reader
5/16/19 4:45 p.m.

$450 for a oil filter  gasket? Can I see one,please 

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
5/16/19 4:49 p.m.

"Don't ever spend your life savings to buy a Jag.  You will never get to drive it."

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
5/16/19 4:51 p.m.
Alfaromeoguy said:

$450 for a oil filter  HOUSING  gasket? Can I see one,please 

No, you can't.  Thats why it costs so much money to replace.

nderwater
nderwater UltimaDork
5/16/19 4:56 p.m.
_ said:

I feel like much of that could’ve been replaced with an afternoon in the garage, even if it’s a jag. The fuel stuff and water pump, yeah, let someone else bloody their knuckles. Air and oil filter? You must have money to burn, or be aging. 

I took the car to an indy Jag specialist (Not the dealer!) because the injector failure had many of the symptoms of an engine failure.  Learned a lot on that one.  While the car was at the shop I asked them to go ahead and do the 60K service and change brakes so that I could have the car back on the road again ASAP.  I'm typically a DIY guy, so it didn't dawn on me that they would be ordering the parts from a Jag dealer at dealer prices.

The transmission service on these 'sealed' ZF transmissions is a complicated procedure that requires reprogramming, so I left that to a ZF specialist.  Later the car had a coolant leak I couldn't find, so back to the Jag shop it went for that as well.

These days I have four small children, a full time job, and I help my wife some with her home-based business.  I don't have the luxury of free time or that I once had for DIY work, and frankly, I never really enjoyed it that much either.  I was the guy who's 'simple' projects always took 4x as long as expected and who always seemed to leave drips of blood in the engine bay.

Toyman01
Toyman01 MegaDork
5/16/19 5:06 p.m.

That is mind boggling to me.

For $7500 I could buy a car that wouldn't need that much in repairs for the next 200k miles. 

Cooter
Cooter SuperDork
5/16/19 5:09 p.m.
Toyman01 said:

That is mind boggling to me.

For $7500 I could buy 5 cars that wouldn't need that much in repairs for the next 200k miles. 

FTFY

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