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NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
2/12/22 4:51 p.m.

As I was driving around in the sea of F150s today, I had to stop for fuel and found out that a Nissan Versa now eats  most of a $100  bill to fill the tank in Canada. Yea gas is spendy here at $1.60/liter and most likely to go higher.

 

So Ford being pretty much a one-trick-pony company,  in the face of inflation and probable interest rate hikes, how long will/can people keep buying F150 trucks? Its not like Ford has any big sellers in the car department that they can fall back on either. Is there enough legit commercial need for F150 trucks to keep the demand up?

1988RedT2
1988RedT2 MegaDork
2/12/22 4:59 p.m.

I believe that the F-150 has been the best-selling "car" in America for quite some time now.  If I were a gambling man, I might bet that heads will roll before F-150 owners willingly give them up.

Slippery
Slippery UberDork
2/12/22 5:02 p.m.

I mean, what's the alternative if you want a pickup? I don't see truck owners trading in for Honda Fits and most of the people that buy those vehicles usually stick to the brand. 

Gas for me here was $3.75/gal for 93 Octane. 

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
2/12/22 5:07 p.m.

I think you've confused Ford with Chrysler. 

Toyman!
Toyman! MegaDork
2/12/22 5:18 p.m.

The F Series is the second most sold vehicle of all time right behind the Corolla. They were also the #1 selling vehicle last year. 

I don't see that changing anytime soon. 

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
2/12/22 5:27 p.m.

Let's see... hugely popular F-150, one of the first to market with an electric version, well-received electric crossover to join the fleet of other little crossovers.

I think they're going to be fine. 

pkingham (Forum Supporter)
pkingham (Forum Supporter) Reader
2/12/22 5:38 p.m.

Don't forget the Maverick if you really want a pickup and want car-like fuel economy.

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa PowerDork
2/12/22 5:45 p.m.

Over the past year Ford stock went from somewhere around $7 per share to a hair over $25.  Now it's somewhere around $18 per.

In the same time frame GM went up $10 and then dropped down to below what it was trading at (now at $48ish)

Stellantis went from $16 to almost $22, and is now at $18ish.

 

Of the "big three" I'm not worried about Ford.

Captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
Captdownshift (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
2/12/22 6:18 p.m.

The price of a loaded F150 for what you get is likely the larger concern. The R1T is just a better package for 90% of users at the $70-100k price point. 

NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
2/12/22 6:40 p.m.

I don't doubt that many people adore the F150.  But do people know you have to pay for them?

My point being, is that I don't see how much longer people will be able to afford (interest rates) and feed (fuel maintenance and insurance) these trucks in the face of other daily cash-flow priorities. Most other vehicle vendors are either positioned to catch the switch to cars if the E36 M3 hits the fan ( Japan again) or have a non-truck line that is already generating income ( GM and Europe). Ford seems to have put all of its eggs in one basket  labeled "Trucks".  While the planet WANTS trucks, how many really NEED trucks when deciding between mortgage and truck payments/expenses

 

Maybe a solution to low wages, nut-job housing cost, higher taxes, people not working, inflation and higher interest rates is just around the corner and I don't see it yet. Brighter financial minds than mine abound.

 

 

 

Sidewayze
Sidewayze Reader
2/12/22 6:59 p.m.

For the vast majority of owners a truck actually makes very little sense, but that hasn't kept them from selling like crazy. 

 I'd say at this point most North Americans are so invested in truck culture that they really wouldn't have any sense of self left if they had to drive a car.  

Captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
Captdownshift (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
2/12/22 7:13 p.m.

In reply to Captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

I will also reply to myself and say that if you order a loaded up F-150 you're not going to be waiting until May-June of 2023.

dps214
dps214 Dork
2/12/22 7:41 p.m.
Slippery said:

I mean, what's the alternative if you want a pickup? I don't see truck owners trading in for Honda Fits and most of the people that buy those vehicles usually stick to the brand. 

Gas for me here was $3.75/gal for 93 Octane. 

How about a hybrid mini truck that gets 40mpg and costs $25k?

Oh wait, Ford makes that too and they're selling a ton of them. They'll be fine until the whole economy collapses, and then everyone's going bankrupt not just them.

NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
2/12/22 8:12 p.m.

In reply to dps214 :

They'll be fine until the whole economy collapses, and then everyone's going bankrupt not just them.

But that is my point,  no matter how bad it gets, some car brands will survive due to being diversified. Ford is known ONLY for "trucks" and if they fall out of  affordability, I see them as being the worst positioned of the transportation builders to survive. 

Just a thought, affects me in no way but keeps the conversation going and my post whoring on-point. 

californiamilleghia
californiamilleghia UltraDork
2/12/22 8:15 p.m.

anyone know what cars Ford is building in Mexico and Brazil that they could bring here if needed ?

frenchyd
frenchyd UltimaDork
2/12/22 8:28 p.m.

You focus on one number and decide the world is coming to an end?  
   I do happen to agree with the troubles mentioned.  However I don't know anyone who buys a new truck and junks it the next year. 
     I bought a Chevy pick up and got 371,000 miles 20 years of extremely hard work out of it.  Other than normal maintenance I spent $1000 on repairs.  So it cost me $1000 a year to own and $50 a year to repair.  
   My 2016 Ford is approaching 76,000 in 5 years with $0 in repairs.  If it lasts as long it will cost me $1700 a year to own.  It's got 2 things going for it my Chevy didn't.  One it's aluminum so rust  (Which killed my Chevy) is less likely. And 2 it's flex fuel. Gas costs me between $2.49. And 2.69 a gallon.  Yeh! my mileage goes down 2 mpg.  But I'm still ahead about $20 a tank full  over regular. 

Noddaz
Noddaz UberDork
2/12/22 8:32 p.m.

Ford not having an entry level car could be a future issue.

With no entry level model how would you "step up" when it is time for a new, better vehicle?

Or has the market changed that much?

I work at an Acura Dealer and I do know still move from lower models to upper models in Acura.

 

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
2/12/22 8:44 p.m.

In reply to Noddaz :

Ecosport should be considered entry level.   Or more accurately, the cheap one.  

Back many years ago, gas was over $4/gal.  And the F150 was still the #1 seller.   So....

The sucky thing of the development of the entire market has been the mass exodus of selling cars.  I honestly hate that.  But Ford isn't the only one who barely has any cars to sell anymore.

frenchyd
frenchyd UltimaDork
2/12/22 8:47 p.m.

In reply to NOHOME :

Trucks last longer than cars.  So the cost per year is lower.  Oh sure, if your ego demands a new vehicle every year, you'll lose. But stupid people always lose. 
    You have to look at the bigger picture.  
Gas too expensive? Well $40,000 will get you a Ford F-150 EV.   Next you're going to say you need more than 230 mile range.  Do you?  How much of your average week is over 1600  miles? That's 83,000 miles a year.   If you have 15 minutes  in your day for lunch and a toilet break you can add another 150 miles a day.  That's 2660 a week  or 138,000 miles a year.   So maybe you don't get all 230 miles?  That's    4&1/2 hours of driving each day  add the quick charge    That's 7& 1/2 hours of driving    Every day 7 days a week 

  
      And Ford is coming down real hard on dealers who over price new sales. 
    
           
       

frenchyd
frenchyd UltimaDork
2/12/22 8:52 p.m.
Noddaz said:

Ford not having an entry level car could be a future issue.

With no entry level model how would you "step up" when it is time for a new, better vehicle?

Or has the market changed that much?

I work at an Acura Dealer and I do know still move from lower models to upper models in Acura.

 

How many automobile companies are getting rich on entry level cars?  
   You know what is selling? SUV's. OK entry level SUV's will help brand loyalty. Right up to the point where something better comes along.  Just like Japanese cars did in the 1970's. 
  Japan isn't getting rich off those either anymore. 
  China?   Well a lot of those Buick's  are made in China now.  
What's next?   

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) SuperDork
2/12/22 8:55 p.m.

In 2008 Ford didn't need or take any bailout funds.  Ford has cash the other auto makers do not.  Ford has the most popular sporty car too and sells a lot of Mustangs.  Ford also does a great job of getting a king life out of every major chassis redesign.  Since 1979 the Mustang has been delivered on variations of two chassis designs.

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
2/12/22 9:05 p.m.

For my last full year of work, I'm getting a profit sharing check.  If we were really in trouble, I don't think they would be giving them out.  It's going to be a while until car sales catch up to gas price issues.  Hopefully, those chip plants being put together in the US don't have any delays.

NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
2/12/22 9:06 p.m.
Noddaz said:

Ford not having an entry level car could be a future issue.

With no entry level model how would you "step up" when it is time for a new, better vehicle?

Or has the market changed that much?

I work at an Acura Dealer and I do know still move from lower models to upper models in Acura.

 

I brought this up on this same board around 2005 or so. Mentioned that GM was going to go bankrupt because they  were not making FUN  affordable and dependable cars for young people. GM in fact had cut the roots off the tree and were living off a dying pool of customers from the 60s. Having quality as "Job None" was not helping either.

I got major roasted on this board. 

They did go bankrupt.  But they are still around.  

Datsun310Guy
Datsun310Guy MegaDork
2/12/22 9:14 p.m.

I just toured the Ford F150 River Rouge plant last December. 

This is what the tour guides told me:

1. They are only making F150's with an order.  Nothing is being built for dealer stock. 

2. Ford's ten hour shifts give you 300 trucks X 2 shifts a day.  The weekend is a single shift and nets 300 a day so the total is about 3,600 trucks a week.

3. My buddy ordered one last year and just got it in January - he said it was a 5 month wait and he paid sticker.

I'm not convinced there is trouble unless we start hitting $5-$7 a gallon........

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) UltimaDork
2/12/22 9:31 p.m.

Ford has the lowest cost hybrid available in the Maverick and that's an entry level vehicle. The drive train will work in SUVs from the Ecosport all the way up the chain. If interest rates and gas prices take off there will be a proliferation of hybrid drive trains in full size trucks, as well as electric versions . America's love affair with trucks will continue unabated, and the higher price of fuel will just get "accepted" as it does in Canada. In 2021 16.8% of all Canadian vehicle sales were full size pickups from Ford ,GM and Ram, plus some mid-sized models despite the traditionally higher cost of fuel there. I'm not worried about Ford's vehicle mix at this point, they'll cope.

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