Is it possible to autox & track a nice car and keep it nice?

Short story long, I've owned some cool cars and done a little autocrossing but always felt like I was beating on my otherwise near mint car. I had a 93 FD RX-7 with 40k miles and it was very very nice. It was a dream car for me and I enjoyed fixing all the reliability issues but always left the Autox feeling like I took advantage of it, needed to apologize and make it up to the car. After that a low mile manual trans IS300, same basic story, springs, Konis, BC cams, a little Autox, guilty, cleaned/waxed a bunch, eventually sold. Then I bought, owned for 3 years, and sold an 03 Z06 with 15k miles. Also near mint. Totally stock but kept almost Concours clean. I have this mental problem (not a real problem) when I go car shopping I research until I decide that I must buy the best, nicest one I can afford (generally a good suggestion), then I get the car, and am reluctant to drive it aggressively. So it sits in the garage, I wax it and keep it meticulously clean. Then I get bored with it and sell it. Groundhog day is here again. I have done this three times over the last decade, FD, IS300 5-spd, Corvette Z06. I've been thinking seriously about buying another C5 Z06 and I have been going back and fourth for weeks. If I buy it, am I going to be able to get past this mental block and just enjoy the damn thing. I think I would appreciate these cars a lot more if I had some history with them other than keeping them clean. I know there are some really high dollar cars out there that get used, track driven, and well cared for. Is it a kiss of death to a cars excellent condition?

Does anyone else suffer from this ailment of owning nice cars and not being able to enjoy them? What the heck is wrong with me? I don't want a beater to race. I want something sweet that I can use and also keep near mint because that is what I like to do. Is this possible or is any autoX'ed/tracked car going to age like a celebrity?

The definition of crazy is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Like the old safety steward at Watkins Glen used to tell us in the "flagger talk"... "Ya got a lot of nice cars out there. Ain't nothing you are going to do to them today to make 'em any nicer."

Even the few guys I know who did their first couple track days in a Ferrari change to a beater (for them) after a few weekends.

The good news is - if you buy the best mechanical car you can find with a beat interior or dinged up body... you save $$$ for all the tires and brakes you are going to need.

Good luck.

I find street miles are much harder on a car cosmetically than anything else. If you dive things, they age. You can mitigate that by reducing commuting and driving in the rain and things like that, but you're going to pick up stone chips and the like. If I know I'm going to be commuting in something I'll purposely buy an example with a few dings (at a lower cost) so I don't feel bad about parking it at my kids school or at the grocery store.

How's the saying go? "Don't track it if you aren't willing to walk away from it"

It's entirely possible though. Some of the people I autocross with have absolutely beautiful cars that still look factory new, but they beat on them like they're the redheaded stepchild of a rented mule when they get waved to start. And it's not always the stereotypical old guy in a Porsche, there's a mid 90s civic and a couple of older CAM cars that still look fresh off the showroom floor every time they arrive.

If you actually enjoy the cleaning and detailing work, it's entirely possible, at least to me someone whose cars get washed when it rains.

Huckleberry wrote: The good news is - if you buy the best mechanical car you can find with a beat interior or dinged up body... you save $$$ for all the tires and brakes you are going to need. Good luck.

Your new favorite Craigslist search term is "Hail".

I think it's possible in autox, but track days are probably harder on cars. Not a lot of WOT at autox, and if you smooth it isn't quite like beating on it. I knew a bunch of people with nice cars that stayed nice during autox. All of the (admittedly minor) damage to my rx8 has been from driving in Boston, all road debris and pothole related, not autox. That being said autox is still hard on tires and brakes and other things, but tracking is probably worse for a car.

You can. But you'll never run it as hard as a track rat. There is freedom in no-berks-given.

For several years I daily drove a Corvette that I also autocrossed and showed. It was exhausting trying to keep the car clean, and I wouldn't do it again, but I loved the car and wanted it to be nice at all times. With the benefit of hindsight, I must have been nuts.

My s2000 was in an accident in 2013 and I had the entire car painted afterwards. It was the first car I had with excellent paint. I spent sooooo much time trying to keep it clean and buff out cone marks all the time. Just a couple weeks ago I had the front bumper repainted where some cone hits actually cracked the paint. It was a lot of worry trying to keep it looking good. The car I'm buying to replace it won't be a cream puff so I won't care so much about aesthetics.

Race cars get dirty, bumped, scratched, dinged, dented and crumpled. To maintain a semblance of a car some rules basically say it needs to look ok at 50 feet and fifty miles an hour. So perhaps change your definition of "nice" to a twenty footer and you're golden. To a lesser degree autox cars may eat a few cones, collect some chips and put some extra strain on tires, suspension and brakes.

Fwiw, I appreciate a car with a few scars more than those prepped for a parking competition.

It is-- we have a support group that meets Thursdays. Alternates among different members garages.

My Z4 is a 3 season daily driver that's been doing track days since 2010, and it's now pushing 104,000 miles. It gets cleaner all winter, and I have enough of a problem that I've used the lift to clean the underside of the car.

What you want really isn't that different from what the vintage racers do.

I'm a little conflicted about preserving the look of a significant race winner looking like it did when upon winning a race versus having it look like a concours car. When I asked a collector / vintage racer I met about that, he said that he felt a clean car is a safe car. I think he's got a point on that.

Keeping it clean will certainly help in keeping on top of the little things that you might not otherwise find.

Get a race car. All my race cars have had battle scars. Having something that you can have fun with and not care if you get a ding or dent is much better than sitting in the paddoc next to a pristine car. How a car looks has no bearing on how fast / fun it is. There was a guy that use to show up with a Volvo that was dented and dinged. It had multiple color doors hood and fenders. It was one of the fastest cars out on track. I got a closer look at it one day and the suspension brakes and the motor were where all the time was spent.

Possible? Yes. Cheap? Hell no! Buy a car that looks just OK and keep it looking just OK.

The forte took much more damage on the street than at auto-x's. Sure, the cone scuffs were a PITA to get off at times, but if you put a fresh coat of wax down first, it makes it easier.

I am extremely OCD about detailing my Mustang, and it gets autocrossed quite frequently in the summers.

It is absolutely possible to keep a car nice and autocross it.

It is much more difficult to do track days and keep a car nice, however...

You can have a race car, or you can have a show car. Trying to do both in one vehicle is just going to drive you nuts.

Your problem is you owned a near-mint C5Z. Go buy a beater one with battle scars like the one in the "are you a dumbass" thread which sold below $14K. Then just refresh the mechanical bits.

I admit there is nothing in my brain that understands this. To me a car is to have fun with. I guess if your idea of fun is polishing something and making it sparkle than go for it. I want to flog the crap out of it and give no berks.

Yes you can have a car you use on track and keep it nice. It's more work than having a pretty car you only have to remove fingerprints from and more work than a track rat you leave in the trailer. But it can certainly be done. I did it for many years with my Firebird before taking it apart for it's current rebuild. No Auto-X with it because I don't think it's the right tool for the job but I used it for Drags, Land speed races, HPDE track days and the street while keeping it nice enough for shows and magazine photo shoots.

Woody wrote:

Huckleberry wrote: The good news is - if you buy the best mechanical car you can find with a beat interior or dinged up body... you save $$$ for all the tires and brakes you are going to need. Good luck.

Your new favorite Craigslist search term is "Hail".

DW keeps suggesting I replace the hood on the Miata because this one has some hail damage. I keep thinking that will just make me feel better when I eventually sawzall vent holes in it.

My E36 and Crammit were both pretty nice (at least relative to their age and the other cars I've owned) at the time I bought them, then degraded under my ownership. I attribute that to street driving, and particularly street parking in the BMW, more so than auto x. I was definitely conscious of this during my ownership, but at the same time I wasn't going to change how I was using the cars just to keep them nice. And while I didn't neglect them, I'm also certainly not the type to spend hours and hours polishing and waxing a car - that just ain't my bag baby.

Anyways, all of that to say I basically think a 20 footer is about perfect for me. I don't mind a bit of character, but overall it should look OK, without me having to fret every time I park it or drive it. I'm not a show'n'shine type guy, my cars are meant to be driven, and driven hard. I like the way a coworker once put it:

"It's like not berkeleying your wife to keep the Bob Costas tight for the next guy."

While my E36 M3 isn't going to win any concours events, it still presents nicely--even after 175K miles. I've autocrossed it, tracked it, and driven it all over creation. Unlike the OP, I feel guilty when I don't run the car hard----- it DESERVES to be run at WOT to the redline.......it likes it!

Granted, the car has never been parked within 100 yards of a grocery store entrance, it gets washed EVERY time it travels beachside (salt in the air) , and has generally led a pampered life. It also always has fresh wax and when not in motion, it lives under a cover.

I don't see keeping the car clean and nice as work--- I enjoy detailing the car, finding it's (many) little imperfections, and fixing what I can--- as soon as I notice the issue. Yes, I wash the underside, polish the muffler (hey, it's shiny!) and get a little OCD when it comes to taking care of it, but I enjoy the work. Of course, it's an old car now.....so the work is never totally finished.

It is possible, as long as you aren't tracking the car every weekend. For an occasional auto-cross, track-day car......it's totally do-able.

It is possible to track your car and keep it looking nice. It can be done, but you need to have a paint booth at your house.

You have hail damage on your Miata's hood? You know why golf balls have dimples? Better aerodynamics, it is the same thing with your hood, speed dimples.

Not me. A car gets me where I need to go, carries my stuff, transports my kids and let's me have a blast at the autocross. I'll keep it clean within reason, but I buy it to use it. If it was built to go fast, I will go fast. If it was built to go off road, that's where I will take it. Modern cars are amazingly well engineered, I see no harm in testing their limits daily.

Appleseed wrote: You can. But you'll never run it as hard as a track rat. There is freedom in no-berks-given.

Except for the fact that upside down in a gravel trap is really slow.

I think you can track a car and keep it nice. You have to not be an idiot. If you're worried about paint, then maybe you don't park yourself on someone's rear bumper. Keep it on the pavement, which is the faster technique anyhow. Take a bit of care when working on it instead of being a hack. It's not always cool to take care of your stuff in some circles, but it works. And coincidentally, this extra care and attention will actually keep the car running better.