Wow, thanks for all the information guys! I'm going to go through this more tonight. I had no idea the thickness of welding wire can make that big of a difference. I think I'm currently running some .030 lincoln wire, but its been awhile since I've used it so would have to double check.
My HF welder unfortunately doesn't have any hook ups for gas. I'm looking into either a Lincoln or Hobart MIG welder. Really depends on which one I can get for a better price.
If you have been stumbling around with a 110 flux core welder just switching to Lincoln will make you feel like an amazing welder. I was used to running nice old powerful industrial machines, borrowed a HF 110 flux for some body work, it was a struggle. That told me what I wanted to know, picked up a Lincoln 180C for home use, much easier to use.
180C = Commercial $1500 Bought mine from a welding supply for $550 as a reboxed demo model with full warranty.
180HD = Home Depot $799
Same power, one has less plastic.
I am fundamentally self taught and people have covered everything pretty well.
For me Mig is really all about matching your pace of gun movement to the way the machine settings interact with your metal thickness (and having clean enough base metal). Machine settings should be within reason based on the welder recommendations for wire feed and amperage. You then use the torch angle and feedrate to get a good weld. It's definitely a learned skill but once you learn for 1 thickness and weld type you can more easily adjust for other thicknesses and weld joints (Butt/overlap/fillet/plug etc ).
Quality equipment doesn't hurt at all I've settled on a Hobart as being the intersection of value and quality that works best for me.
I've done 2 builds on the forum that show some of my work but none of them really go into welding techniques in great detail it's just something I do a lot of during them.
Just ordered a Hobart Handler 140 (based on this forums help!) on amazon that was delivered yesterday.... I am in the same boat with a wrangler frame to unberkeley.
One thing I haven't seen mentioned is shorter classes. Most community college course I looked at were more in depth than what most people want/need. Local welding gas supply companies, like Airgas usually offers 1/2 day, 1 day or two day courses which is probably sufficient for most people.
It just takes practice. Learning how to prep the metal and the welder is much of it. The parts I forget over time are the fine adjustments to wire speed, gun angle and motion of the gun. Pick up some scrap of various thicknesses, weld it until the welds look clean, then put it in a vise and try to break it apart. It's easier to judge penetration with thin metal, but harder with something like angle iron.
I'll be the odd man out here. I had hacked around with a flux core welder for a number of years and then bought an old Craftsman MIG with a bottle. That was a big step forward. Then, because I'm a senior and seniors get free tuition at our local community college, I took the introductory welding course. Having a couple of expert welders as instructors was really beneficial and shortened the learning curve. Everything everyone has said here is sound advice, but if you can find someone who knows how to weld and can mentor you it will be helpful.
In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
0.023 wire is readily available. I used it almost exclusively to weld up the chassis for my Corolla. That's for tubing that's 1/8 wall.
Anyone tried out the new Eastwood 180 inverter powered MIG?
When I was about 20 I bought a Clarke Flux/Mig welder because it was the cheapest thing going at the time and I wanted to learn. My thought process was that I'd get a "good" welder later. 30ish years later and multiple cars and other projects successfully welded together and that Clarke is still rocking. The majority of the time I still use it in flux mode because Im too lazy to keep my gas bottles filled.
Most of the work you've mentioned is sheet metal, if you've done that the rest is easy. With sheet you cant run beads and have to work slow and easy to prevent blow through. With heavier materials you can get in there and lay a solid bead easy.
Thanks guys! Going through this thread is giving the confidence I need to invest in a MIG welding setup and start practicing and learning. I figure its a really useful skill to have when messing around with 90s and older vehicles...and just in general.
Quick question; is it necessary to buy a welder that is only MIG, or would one that says flux core/MIG be fine? I'm looking at the Lincoln 140 amp welder and Hobart 140, and they both look to say flux core/MIG. I'm guessing that since it can do both, it would be fine and function just like other MIG welders when using gas?
Japanspec said:Quick question; is it necessary to buy a welder that is only MIG, or would one that says flux core/MIG be fine? I'm looking at the Lincoln 140 amp welder and Hobart 140, and they both look to say flux core/MIG. I'm guessing that since it can do both, it would be fine and function just like other MIG welders when using gas?
I'm hardly an expert, but my impression is that basically all MIG machines can do flux core as well. You just change the wire and leave out the gas bottle.
In reply to Japanspec :
You are correct: MIG can use gas OR flux core.
codrus (Forum Supporter) said:I'm hardly an expert, but my impression is that basically all MIG machines can do flux core as well. You just change the wire and leave out the gas bottle.
There's also dual shield wire for MIG, which is a flux core wire that's meant to also have shielding gas used with it.
As far as switching between flux core and gas shielded MIG, typically you also reverse the polarity of the machine.
rslifkin said:codrus (Forum Supporter) said:I'm hardly an expert, but my impression is that basically all MIG machines can do flux core as well. You just change the wire and leave out the gas bottle.
There's also dual shield wire for MIG, which is a flux core wire that's meant to also have shielding gas used with it.
As far as switching between flux core and gas shielded MIG, typically you also reverse the polarity of the machine.
This^^^ can be VERY important. I started welding infrequently as a teenager in the 70's using Oxy-acetylene and stick arc welders. Fast forward 20 years or so and I struggled with my first MIG welder for weeks until I found out that when I switched from the flux core wire that came with the machine to gas shielded wire I needed to switch the polarity.
Great thanks for the information guys! I appreciate the tip on reversing polarity, I will keep that in mind to avoid the same issue NOT A TA went through...
pkingham (Forum Supporter) said:For training, you might check your local community college. One of the ones near me has a great welding education program, and I've taken a couple courses. Lots of hands-on welding time with instruction and feedback.
This is the path I followed when I felt the need to resume welding. Before the community college class, I last welded in high school auto shop. 15 years later, I got back to playing with cars and needed to weld again. Signed up for the introduction to welding/beginner welding course in their vo-tech program and learned a lot.
CWR67 said:pkingham (Forum Supporter) said:For training, you might check your local community college. One of the ones near me has a great welding education program, and I've taken a couple courses. Lots of hands-on welding time with instruction and feedback.
This is the path I followed when I felt the need to resume welding. Before the community college class, I last welded in high school auto shop. 15 years later, I got back to playing with cars and needed to weld again. Signed up for the introduction to welding/beginner welding course in their vo-tech program and learned a lot.
Sounds like it might be worth it to take just an intro class for welding. Hopefully I won't be the odd one out surrounded by high school graduates...
I learned on a HF flux core. I started easy first making a dual battery tray for my CJ-7. Later after I gained some confidence I bought a Hobart 175 and really started making stuff. Flat skid for the Jeep, rocker protection, and a roll cage that I personally tested and lived.
Scrap metal and my 3# hammer and vice took the brunt of the learning curve. When I finally was able to manipulate the puddle it felt like an epiphany.
That said, I just started research into getting a certificate for welding from a local community college. I figure it might be a good side gig when I retire and will teach me TIG.
Japanspec said:CWR67 said:pkingham (Forum Supporter) said:For training, you might check your local community college. One of the ones near me has a great welding education program, and I've taken a couple courses. Lots of hands-on welding time with instruction and feedback.
This is the path I followed when I felt the need to resume welding. Before the community college class, I last welded in high school auto shop. 15 years later, I got back to playing with cars and needed to weld again. Signed up for the introduction to welding/beginner welding course in their vo-tech program and learned a lot.
Sounds like it might be worth it to take just an intro class for welding. Hopefully I won't be the odd one out surrounded by high school graduates...
You won't be. There'll likely be other mature adults there taking retraining, along with the high schooler working to get his welding ticket. I was in my 60s and didn't feel the least bit out of place. I did check with the college registrars office to be sure I wasn't taking a class spot while there were young people on a wait list. The class wasn't even full during the day, evening classes were.
Building a roll cage and testing it yourself...that is some intense stuff! Glad you got out okay though. Seems like you're a pretty good welder.
Deadskunk, thanks for the tip on checking with the college registrars office on taking up a class spot for someone who really needs it. I make a living doing IT, so I definitely don't need the training as much as someone who plans to take this up as a living.
DeadSkunk (Warren) said:In reply to AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) :
0.023 wire is readily available. I used it almost exclusively to weld up the chassis for my Corolla. That's for tubing that's 1/8 wall.
I am a fellow welding noob in a similar position to the OP. IMO if you're doing mostly thinner materials do not hesitate to jump directly to .023/.024 wire.
I bought a used Hobart Handler 140 a couple years ago and it came with a nearly full 10# spool of .030 wire. I've been practicing on and off, worked on a few projects, but have really struggled with thin stuff. Always burning through, can't seem to get the travel speed right, etc. Finally decided to order a spool of .023 wire (and the appropriate gun liner and tips) a couple weeks ago, and it's a whole new world when it comes to welding thinner material! Unbelievably more forgiving, wish I had switched years ago.
In reply to therieldeal :
Odd, cause I probably wrote the same advice years ago. But somewhere along the way, I ended back at 0.035 for all my welding.
Time on the trigger, heat setting and wire diameter can all be adjusted to give the same result.
As to becoming a home trained welder. I would say that a "Welder" requires an education plus time on the tools. If you just want to learn a process that works to stick metal together, then it is not that hard to do.
In reply to NOHOME :
Interesting. One of the things that I noticed right away was that initially striking the arc seems less violent with the thinner wire (with the same heat settings). It seems less apt to create a large ball at the end of the wire when I stop, too... man is it annoying trimming those off constantly. I still wish I had started here and then worked my way up to using larger wire for thicker materials. However, my opinion does remain that of a noob. 
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