Ovid_and_Flem
Ovid_and_Flem SuperDork
10/17/18 11:08 a.m.
maschinenbau said:

I like CAM, but how about WAR?

  • Add up the scores/finishing places of all CAM cars
  • Add up the scores/finishing places of all classic Japanese and German cars (Classic Axis Muscle?)

It's team-based, up to an entire half of the field gets an award, and could result in some cool liveries. 

CAM vs CAxM

edit: Okay on second thought, go easy on the Axis liveries...

The Nelson clan will likely end the event with a pair of atomic bombscool

Stampie
Stampie UberDork
10/17/18 11:14 a.m.
maschinenbau said:

I like CAM, but how about WAR?

  • Add up the scores/finishing places of all CAM cars
  • Add up the scores/finishing places of all classic Japanese and German cars (Classic Axis Muscle?)

It's team-based, up to an entire half of the field gets an award, and could result in some cool liveries. 

CAM vs CAxM

edit: Okay on second thought, go easy on the Axis liveries...

Why are the Italians always left out?

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
10/17/18 11:17 a.m.

In reply to hobiercr :

I won't kick anyone out of the Gastropods for any reason. We may limit someone's ability to take home a snail trophy, but everyone gets to be in the club who wants to be. New thread incoming on that. 

Are we ready to start a new $2019 CAM thread to hash out the details on that? Someone who is bringing a car should start it. Pimpm3? 

pimpm3
pimpm3 SuperDork
10/17/18 11:24 a.m.
Stampie said:
maschinenbau said:

I like CAM, but how about WAR?

  • Add up the scores/finishing places of all CAM cars
  • Add up the scores/finishing places of all classic Japanese and German cars (Classic Axis Muscle?)

It's team-based, up to an entire half of the field gets an award, and could result in some cool liveries. 

CAM vs CAxM

edit: Okay on second thought, go easy on the Axis liveries...

Why are the Italians always left out?

There morning runs count for the axis.  Afternoon runs count for allies.

pimpm3
pimpm3 SuperDork
10/17/18 11:25 a.m.
mazdeuce - Seth said:

In reply to hobiercr :

I won't kick anyone out of the Gastropods for any reason. We may limit someone's ability to take home a snail trophy, but everyone gets to be in the club who wants to be. New thread incoming on that. 

Are we ready to start a new $2019 CAM thread to hash out the details on that? Someone who is bringing a car should start it. Pimpm3? 

Sounds good to me

Ovid_and_Flem
Ovid_and_Flem SuperDork
10/17/18 11:29 a.m.

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

As to making an American Muscle class I will just add that in my little Peckerwood redneck corner of the South I've noticed that the vast majority of newcomers to our local autocross events are muscle muscle car cam guys.. the fact that the challenge includes both drag racing and autocross lends me to think that an American Muscle class would attract a lot of backyard builders. Guys that have no interest in building import cars for drag racing or autocross.

Toyman01
Toyman01 MegaDork
10/17/18 11:37 a.m.

We used to do a annual Axis vs Allies autocross. The Abomination was so confused being a LBC with a Japanese drivetrain. 

Then someone got offended...

stafford1500
stafford1500 HalfDork
10/17/18 11:39 a.m.
Ovid_and_Flem said:

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

As to making an American Muscle class I will just add that in my little Peckerwood redneck corner of the South I've noticed that the vast majority of newcomers to our local autocross events are muscle muscle car cam guys.. the fact that the challenge includes both drag racing and autocross lends me to think that an American Muscle class would attract a lot of backyard builders. Guys that have no interest in building import cars for drag racing or autocross.

It would therefore perhaps increase the size of the event and the readership of the magazine. They sponsor to have fun and sell magazines...

John Welsh
John Welsh Mod Squad
10/17/18 11:56 a.m.

I think tapping into more Drag Racers would be great for attendance.  It might even be wise as to go so far and team/partner with a more Drag related publication.  Is there such thing, a more independent Drag Race Publication?   Maybe not publication in the traditional sense but something like BangShift1320  Also possibly opens the deep pockets of the Summit/Jegs/Speedway type retailers as advertisers.  

I have described our event to hardcore drag racers and what they are most amazed by is that we have less than 50 cars at what is essentially a "private drag strip rental event".  That means even if you don't care much about autox, for the price of entry you get pretty much unlimited drag strip time.  Back out the price of the BBQ dinner and the Banquet meal and the price that really goes toward the track rental is pretty reasonable for 4 hours (6pm-10pm) of nearly unlimited drag runs.  With 50 cars, running in 2's or 25 cars per lane it is rare that you ever have to wait 12 cars deep at drag staging.  I remember the Lincoln Mark 8 made no less tha 20 passes in 2015.  If you have ever been to a Drag Test and Tune Night these can often result in as few a 3 passes for the whole night (if your not winning) and that can be $20 for those 4 hours or less than 1 pass per hour.       

 

I guess it does exist.  Maybe this relationship needs some "messaging" 

https://bangshift.com/general-news/pacc-racings-crazy-1974-datsun-260z-runs-mid-9s-and-was-built-for-under-2000-yes-really/

GTXVette
GTXVette SuperDork
10/17/18 12:00 p.m.
stafford1500 said:
GTXVette said:

I ask again ,If you want a Tire Rule,  Why not Generals

,  if they don't have them in your size then i guess some thing could change to Accomidate

General was a sponsor of the event previously, but not this year (2018). If another tire sponsor was signed up then the magazine could probably call out a spec manufacturer tire class. Otherwise it would be easier to spec a treadware rating and let folks decide how to spend real world dollars on the brand they want.

I did not know that, well then  HOOSIERS for everyone.......

mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
10/17/18 12:04 p.m.
Stampie said:

Why are the Italians always left out?

Because it's an event for cars that run?

maschinenbau
maschinenbau Dork
10/17/18 12:04 p.m.

So folks like Allies vs Axis for 2019?

"WW$2k" sub-class. World War $2,000

Award for winning side could just be a ribbon. Buy 25 or so. I am down to head up logistics of WW2k Challenge.

I also like gastropod class. There could even been cross-over between the two. Buy a running Camaro, show up, maybe win both!

SVreX
SVreX MegaDork
10/17/18 12:10 p.m.

In reply to maschinenbau :

I’ll play. Sign me up for Axis. 

Ovid_and_Flem
Ovid_and_Flem SuperDork
10/17/18 12:10 p.m.
maschinenbau said:

Buy a running.​​​CAMERO show up, maybe win both!

FIXED IT FOR YA.

Dusterbd13
Dusterbd13 MegaDork
10/17/18 12:21 p.m.

So would a Japanese car with American powertrain be allied or axis?

 

Its named bockscar by the way after a ww2 bomber.....

Driven5
Driven5 SuperDork
10/17/18 12:26 p.m.

Wouldn't the axis-allies thing be less of a sub-class, like CAM would, and more of just an additional award for roughly half of the event competitors?  I mean, I'm pretty sure the vast majority of cars in attendance will have originally been made by a manufacturer from one of the noted countries.

maschinenbau
maschinenbau Dork
10/17/18 12:29 p.m.

Yeah I suppose it's not really a "sub-class" more of a team-based "sub-challenge". I think it'd be fun to have other cars on your team, competing together against another team. 

Continental power-train swaps are complicated...I'd say follow the body's VIN. 

Circuit_Motorsports
Circuit_Motorsports New Reader
10/17/18 12:58 p.m.

In reply to John Welsh :

I think the reason the autocross portion is more focused on is because GRM is a more autocross leaning mag.  I think more cars of differing disciplines at the event would be cool (to an extent), but I don't see how bringing in a bunch of drag racers really does anything for the event overall. As long as there is a healthy attendance and good competition, don't fix what aint broke.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
10/17/18 1:05 p.m.

Well you could actually make a rule supplement for the WW$2K.  Something along the lines of CAM.

  1. Cars should be street registerable (headlights in legal location, 2 brake lights, very basic requirements)
  2. Cars must run on 200 TW tires
  3. Interiors should be "finished"
  4. All glass must be in place (lexan may be used)
  5. Car must utilize engine and body from either the Alies (North America, Britian) or Axis (German, Japan)

This way CAM cars would be part and non American CAM type cars would be legal.  Eliminate the minimum weights and silly 2/4 passenger stuff and just be basically anything Street able on 20)TW tires.

 

maschinenbau
maschinenbau Dork
10/17/18 1:17 p.m.

In reply to nocones :

And don't forget must be Front Engine, RWD. I'll start a new thread if we think this is a good idea for 2019

pimpm3
pimpm3 SuperDork
10/17/18 1:31 p.m.

So it sounds like we have decided on CAM / American Muscle as the special class like the wagon or pickup class.   I will start a separate thread where we can hash out the rules for this class.

It also sounds like there is interest in a run what you brung class for slower stockish cars, possibly involving a treadwear limit of some sort.  The gastropods or some veriation.  Mazda deuce will be starting a thread where it can be laid out.

The WW2k thing sounds awesome! We can figure out the best way to make that manageable in a separate thread.  It sounds like maschienbau wants to run with this.

It looks like there will be several places to play in 2019 other than the normal categories...

Mike924
Mike924 Reader
10/17/18 2:00 p.m.

Looking forward to the CAM class addition. 

Took me a while to read through this discussion.  I did have one thought, although it is a bit behind.  Some one showed a picture of a Kit Car for the T-Top class pitch.  Has there been a Kit-Car class ever added to the Challenge? I have been following this since the $1500 off and on, and don't think I have seen it.  It would really open the door for the weird/wacky/almost motorsports theme.  I am also fairly sure that there are a number of unfinished builds all over the net.  

Just my thoughts, can't wait for the American Muscle next year.  

Now to find a way to let my significant other let me buy another project and get it from Canada to Florida for next year.  

 

BarryNorman
BarryNorman New Reader
10/17/18 3:21 p.m.

It would seem that a budget exempt spec tire/steel wheel(225-60, 15,16,17,18) class would encourage drag racers to compete at autocross in a level environment. And would allow autocross focused builds (those that didn't run Hoosiers) to have drag tires. Which would open up the rest of the field.

captdownshift
captdownshift PowerDork
10/17/18 8:30 p.m.

What if someone shows up in a Dodge charger? It's a 20+ year old German chassis, from an American brand that's own by the Italians. What is the Zimmerman project class are they? 

captdownshift
captdownshift PowerDork
10/18/18 9:39 a.m.

and ugh, i just came up with an idea for 2020.

Birthdays
Our Preferred Partners
CugNoT5PpSsVZ4sgMn4O6AnFb3udjK1xHtaMPdhMwde0EM7yq9Otc7D0WWKyECrC