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Woody
Woody SuperDork
1/17/10 12:27 p.m.

How do I make a Miata look like this?

I've seen a couple of different version of this sort of photo. Is it possible to disconnect the wiring, unfasten the subframe and shock bolts and lift the body off a Miata, leaving the subframes connected to the drivetrain through the PPF? Or was the car in the photo reassembled once all the parts were removed?

For the record, this is a Flyin Miata photo.

carguy123
carguy123 SuperDork
1/17/10 1:05 p.m.

I just did this yesterday to an S2000.

It wasn't all that hard. All you have to do is disconnect any wires, cables, hoses, brakes, etc. that connects the subframe to the chassis then lift the car off the suspension.

The S2000 looks to have been a little more difficult because the front A arms connect to the chassis, not the subframe so the front wheels got wobbly.

Also because the S doesn't have a Power Plant Frame and therefore it got floppy in the middle.

I used the engine hoist on the chassis in the front because it had to lift so much higher to clear the engine and 2 guys on the trunk to just lift it off and set it on a set of car skates so I could move the body around.

2.0dohc
2.0dohc Reader
1/17/10 1:40 p.m.
Woody wrote: How do I make a Miata look like this?

I'm not sure, but now thanks to you I want to build a locost. I mean that rolling "miata" just needs a few things to drive.....

ZOO
ZOO Dork
1/17/10 3:45 p.m.

Great pic -- but remember there is nothing for the suspension to wok against. I'm not an engineer, so I have no clue what would happen.

MrJoshua
MrJoshua SuperDork
1/17/10 4:10 p.m.

You can recreate that picture without much trouble. Battery cables, brake lines, and lots of hoses/wires attached to the engine must be disconnected, but it isnt that tough. Each subframe has something like 6 bolts. I think the shocks are held in by 2 bolts. The battery cable is attached to the side of the PPF so it can either be dropped from the starter and unclipped or pulled through the trunk floor and left on the PPF. At the front the battery cable needs to be removed from the relay block. You have to pull the speedo cable. Then you just remove the steering column and whatever hoses and wire attach the engine to the car and you are free.

MrJoshua
MrJoshua SuperDork
1/17/10 4:17 p.m.

Just a FYI to all of you who are getting evil cheapo Lo-cost ideas. Yes it is very very possible. The tops of the subframes are the same width and mount within 1/2" of height of each other. IIRC the tops mount holes are 30" apart and the bottom are 18" apart? So 4 straight bars front to back and you have 80% of a locost frame. You would have to sit in farther back than a miata to fit (and rest your right leg against a transmission/driveshaft) but it could be done.

njansenv
njansenv Reader
1/17/10 4:38 p.m.

Every once and a while I see photos of C5 corvette assemblies that look something like the above photo...with 4 more cylinders and wider tires. Evil thoughts abound.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy SuperDork
1/17/10 4:43 p.m.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy SuperDork
1/17/10 4:44 p.m.

what other cars can do that?

MrJoshua
MrJoshua SuperDork
1/17/10 4:52 p.m.

That Vette is REALLY cool, but it looks like someone did add some suspension parts (the flimsy yellow stuff) to make it work.

Keith
Keith SuperDork
1/17/10 5:29 p.m.

When we strip a Miata for a V8 conversion, we always pull out the whole drivetrain as shown in the first picture. The trick is to leave the shocks bolted to the body until everything else is done, then drop the car to the ground, undo the upper shock bolts and lift the car off. It's pretty quick and easy. The guys at FM have actually swapped the complete drivetrain/suspension between two cars in an evening. The recipient wasn't running at the end of the night, but if it had been a little more complete when we started it could have been :)

If you wanted to drive one, you'd have to build some towers to support the top of the shocks. That's about it. All the control arm pickup points are taken care of.

And for those thinking you could just connect the subframes together, this is how FM turns a chassis dyno into an engine dyno

jpaturzo
jpaturzo New Reader
1/17/10 5:42 p.m.

A little more bolstering in that seat and I'd drive it. 4 front wheels, its a Tyrell P34 clone!

xci_ed6
xci_ed6 HalfDork
1/17/10 6:04 p.m.
Keith wrote: <img src="http://flyinmiata.com/projects/installation_photos/img_3897.jp

93celicaGT2
93celicaGT2 SuperDork
1/17/10 7:16 p.m.

I present to you, madness.

wearymicrobe
wearymicrobe Reader
1/17/10 7:21 p.m.
93celicaGT2 wrote: I present to you, madness.

Go head and laugh but dodge actually did this then ran the car at Leguna a while back.

93celicaGT2
93celicaGT2 SuperDork
1/17/10 7:26 p.m.

Oh i'm not laughing. I would drive that as is.

ratghia
ratghia Reader
1/17/10 7:38 p.m.

It reminds me of what we refer to as a pan ride in the vw community.

video There is nsfw music in the video.

Woody
Woody SuperDork
1/17/10 8:25 p.m.

Make no mistake, I have no plans of fabricating a quick Locost by connecting the subframes.

I'm looking for a Miata as a parts donor for my formula car project. The engine and transmission aren't important to me, but if I can keep the suspension, brakes and steering intact on the subframes, it will go a long way towards planning out my suspension geometry.

I was just wondering if it would be easiest to pull the engine and transmission and then try to remove the subframes, or if it was possible to disconnect everything from underneath and lift off the body.

I'm thinking thoughts like this:

CarKid1989
CarKid1989 HalfDork
1/17/10 10:00 p.m.

guys this is why i super hate everyone one here.

in summery here is what i just read:

Miata minus miata body plus rear shock mounts (custom) some seat stuff and blah blah and you have a Miata-locost-thingy.

Sound like a sub $1000 locost.

I HATE you.

Off to craigslist....

Gearheadotaku
Gearheadotaku HalfDork
1/17/10 10:08 p.m.

Fiero's can run skinless too.

Keith
Keith SuperDork
1/17/10 10:28 p.m.

In case anyone's wondering, our "dyno car" doesn't usually have a seat. That's just a mechanic creeper seat stuck in beside the transmission to screw with peoples on the internets. Brandon won't let me "drive" the car in the shop, he seems to think it will end badly. Can't see why.

So Woody, the answer is "yes, it's easier to take the whole thing apart into two pieces". I'm pretty sure that's how the cars were assembled, I've seen reference to the PPF making the car cheaper/faster to build. Where are those detail shots from? There's some interesting stuff going on there.

stroker
stroker Reader
1/18/10 6:31 a.m.

he's thinking about tube frame monoposto using Miata suspension and a bike engine here:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/formula-grm-my-new-challenge-project/17802/page1/

which is a really interesting idea that I've been thinking about for some time. It's similar in concept to Bruce McLaren's "whoosh-bonk" methodology.

Woody
Woody SuperDork
1/18/10 6:58 a.m.
Keith wrote: Where are those detail shots from? There's some interesting stuff going on there.

I found those photos here:

Brotus7 wrote: Have you seen this build? It's a similar application to what you're talking about. http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=2142&start=25
DeadSkunk
DeadSkunk Reader
1/19/10 1:34 p.m.

I get a multitude of car magazines each month and the February issue of Vintage Racecar showed up today. Look at the Canada Class car on page33 (go to the newstand and free read!) and think about that concept and a stripped down Miata drivetrain. Anybody have any idea what a complete Miata shell weighs, compared to a simple space frame that could pick up the subframe mounting points?

ClemSparks
ClemSparks SuperDork
1/19/10 1:53 p.m.
CarKid1989 wrote: guys this is why i super hate everyone one here. in summery here is what i just read: Miata minus miata body plus rear shock mounts (custom) some seat stuff and blah blah and you have a Miata-locost-thingy. Sound like a sub $1000 locost. I HATE you. Off to craigslist....

Carkid...what if you put a sleeper cab on it?!

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