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alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
8/31/16 5:50 p.m.

Watching the Wheeler Dealer about them building an Escort rally car made me wonder what US rally cars would be. And while thinking of that, I realized that I know little about historic rallying in the US, other than the period that many of the races were part of the FIA circuit.

So- what cars were rallied back in the day?

One reason I ask is NoPermit's VW- and anyone finding a car that likes RallyCross vs. street stuff. Make a historic rally car if appropriate!

I've seen some pictures of GTV's being rallied in Europe, but that was pretty rare. Even though they make good ones- a guy I know did one of the major historic rallies with a Giula TI, and he was quite competitive when it wasn't being broken up. For the US, though, all of the Alfa racing history is on the race course- that I'm aware of.

Knurled
Knurled MegaDork
8/31/16 6:04 p.m.

Lots of all sorts of stuff. 510s, RX-ns, Rabbits, SAABs, genrally anything that moved because that is how we roll.

I've seen photos of a stage rally Toronado (pre-downsize) and a Bronco. First and second generation.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/eh6QOiISzfk

https://www.youtube.com/embed/kvo_V2NInic

captdownshift
captdownshift UberDork
8/31/16 6:32 p.m.

SCCA pro rally history group on Facebook covers 1973-2004

Plymouth arrow and dodge ram chargers are some of the more interesting entries.

vwcorvette
vwcorvette SuperDork
8/31/16 6:40 p.m.

John and Victoria Buffum. Triumph IIRC.

Libra Racing

NGTD
NGTD UberDork
8/31/16 7:11 p.m.

This site has a load of information on old stuff.

Rally Racing News

It's an old school website though.

Jeep's

510's

Corolla

Fire Arrow's

Corvair's

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
8/31/16 7:22 p.m.
captdownshift wrote: SCCA pro rally history group on Facebook covers 1973-2004 Plymouth arrow and dodge ram chargers are some of the more interesting entries.

Sadly, one needs to be a member to see that... bummer.

DeadSkunk
DeadSkunk UberDork
8/31/16 7:30 p.m.

Back in the 70s in Canada there were a lot of different manufacturers in rallying. Walter Boyce ran an SR5 Corolla, then a Lada. Taisto Heinonen ran a series of Toyota Celicas and then a TE72 Corolla. Jean Paul Perusse ran a Fiat 124 Abarth and later a Fiat 128. Buffum would show up in a 911, co-driven by his ex-wife. Datsun 510s were pretty common, as were Volvo 142s and 544s. Several Mazda RX-3s and 4s were regulars.Occasionally an old Saab would be seen. I also saw that Toronado on a winter rally one time. It bellowed along through the dark, sounding like a Can-Am car.

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
8/31/16 7:35 p.m.

In reply to Knurled:

Cool videos. And the beginning shows a VW in the rally- so suggesting to NoPermit to make a vintage rally car to rallycross with is pretty applicable.

Some other cool cars in there- RX3, and some old Corollas, too.

So then a new question- does RallyCross have a class for vintage cars? Something that has been suggested for autocross for a long time.

EvanB
EvanB UltimaDork
8/31/16 7:56 p.m.
alfadriver wrote: So then a new question- does RallyCross have a class for vintage cars? Something that has been suggested for autocross for a long time.

No, but it has been discussed before I believe. I think it is a good idea as I have a couple cars I could use.

Knurled
Knurled MegaDork
8/31/16 7:59 p.m.

In reply to alfadriver:

SCCA RallyCross? No. You run watcha brung and nobody's that stuffy. Some people have recently been whining about making a class for cars with active diffs and other people have pointed out that they can still be stomped by a half decent driver in a 2.2l Impreza so who gives a crap.

If anything the Modified classes are the "historic" ones. People generally don't alter new cars beyond what is legal in Prepared. Complementarily, the rules are such that it is almost impossible to have a car more than ten-fifteen years old in Stock or Prepared.

T.J.
T.J. UltimaDork
8/31/16 8:01 p.m.

A friend of mine from grade school fsther had a LeCar rally car

Brett_Murphy
Brett_Murphy PowerDork
8/31/16 10:12 p.m.

Don't forget the Baja 1000 cars. They should be considered rally cars for sure. Here are some examples.

Olds 442

Ranchero (probably more well known because of the Roadkill series)

Rambler

Mustang

Baja Bug (they're called Baja Bugs, after all)

Hot Rod said: We're talking about the years 1967 to 1972ish-the muscle car heyday-and it might surprise you to know that many of the race cars also had familiar names. As seen on these pages, the passenger sedan classes were loaded with Rancheros, Mavericks, Dusters, a GTO, a few older Mopars, and even some Chevelles. And that's just the muscle makes. Outside of the expected VW Bugs and Corvairs, there were also off-road-racing Pintos and Vegas, and Peter Brock ran Datsun 510s for several years, and then a 240Z. The place was thick with '50s cars, including an Edsel, and our archive photos even reveal '35 and '46 Fords slogging past the saguaros.
alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
9/1/16 6:44 a.m.
Knurled wrote: In reply to alfadriver: SCCA RallyCross? No. You run watcha brung and nobody's that stuffy. Some people have recently been whining about making a class for cars with active diffs and other people have pointed out that they can still be stomped by a half decent driver in a 2.2l Impreza so who gives a crap. If anything the Modified classes are the "historic" ones. People generally don't alter new cars beyond what is legal in Prepared. Complementarily, the rules are such that it is almost impossible to have a car more than ten-fifteen years old in Stock or Prepared.

The thinking is less about being stuffy and more about getting old cars out. When I was autocrossing, our club (Alfas) always had the oldest cars out in the Detroit area. Very few would be willing to bring their old cars out to play, even though they were built to do that.

Now if that's not an issue, great. But NoPermit has already thought about a Baja Bug (even though it seems like the wrong car for that, with the struts)- and letting it be a rally cross car would be a kick. As an example. Others have had some interesting old-ish Toyota projects- that generally are not considered vintage racers- but given what was posted- they certainly are vintage rally cars. Again, an outlet for someone to make a fun car.

92dxman
92dxman SuperDork
9/1/16 9:07 a.m.

People ran the Saab 56 as well. The upside down bathtub.

sachilles
sachilles UltraDork
9/1/16 9:42 a.m.

Don't forget Buffum's Triumphs. He brought one to the shop the other day.

outasite
outasite Reader
9/1/16 11:02 a.m.
92dxman wrote: People ran the Saab 56 as well. The upside down bathtub.

Saab 96? Autoweek/Competition Press provided news and results of the American rallies back then. Satch Carlson (columnist before falling from grace) drove a 96 he called the Hawg of Steel and a Sonett he called the Pig of Plastique in northwest rallies.

drainoil
drainoil HalfDork
9/1/16 11:37 a.m.
Knurled wrote: I've seen photos of a stage rally Toronado (pre-downsize) https://www.youtube.com/embed/eh6QOiISzfk https://www.youtube.com/embed/kvo_V2NInic

That Toronado sounds interesting.

slantvaliant
slantvaliant UltraDork
9/1/16 11:51 a.m.

Valiant:

Barracuda:

Falcon:

Mustang:

... and, if you want to count Carrera Panamericana as a rally,

Cadillac:

Lincoln:

...

NoPermitNeeded
NoPermitNeeded New Reader
9/1/16 11:57 a.m.

In reply to alfadriver:

A rally-cross inspired build would be a riot, no baja needed. Vintage rally bugs are right up my alley . I'm a huge rally fan and would love to get into the sport.

Jerry
Jerry UltraDork
9/1/16 4:08 p.m.

My dad rallied a '74 Opel Manta in the late 70s/early 80's. I'm not on great terms with him these days (cough cough) but someome on a Facebook Vintage Rally page shared two photos for me that he had. I can try to post somewhere this evening if I remember. EDIT: just scrolled up to see that page was mentioned...

modernbeat
modernbeat Dork
9/1/16 5:03 p.m.

People rallied small sedans and sports cars back in the day. And then AWD CJ Jeeps, Wagoneers and Scouts once those showed up. And then Audis. And then Subarus.

We still rally a '63 SAAB two stroke. It was a popular competition car in the '60s.

Knurled
Knurled MegaDork
9/1/16 6:14 p.m.
alfadriver wrote: The thinking is less about being stuffy and more about getting old cars out. When I was autocrossing, our club (Alfas) always had the oldest cars out in the Detroit area. Very few would be willing to bring their old cars out to play, even though they were built to do that. Now if that's not an issue, great. But NoPermit has already thought about a Baja Bug (even though it seems like the wrong car for that, with the struts)- and letting it be a rally cross car would be a kick. As an example. Others have had some interesting old-ish Toyota projects- that generally are not considered vintage racers- but given what was posted- they certainly are vintage rally cars. Again, an outlet for someone to make a fun car.

People already do this, though. Especially up in Detroit Region where it seems like people have a lot of money to play with interesting things. Old Celicas, other weird stuff like that, heck I remember an RX-2 coming out every now and then and a '66 or '68 911.

Matt_the_Wolfe
Matt_the_Wolfe New Reader
9/2/16 3:17 p.m.

In reply to Knurled:

I believe you're referring to Mr. Eddelston's 911

Knurled
Knurled MegaDork
9/2/16 4:57 p.m.

In reply to Matt_the_Wolfe:

Nope. This was in '05-06ish, something like that. Gray or silver 911. I think he was a TSD guy who got lost

I can't find records on the Detroit SCCA website any older than 2007, and the 2007 divisional at Fowlerville was the M2 debut of my black RX-7. Wow I have had that car a long time That's where I met the gentleman with the RX-2. I am pretty sure that I had the silver car when I met the man with the 911.

oldeskewltoy
oldeskewltoy UltraDork
9/2/16 6:18 p.m.

SAAB 99... back in the early 1990s

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