Mike
Mike SuperDork
5/11/19 5:00 p.m.

I just took a test drive in a Vanderhall Venice in dark grey. 1380 lbs, 180 hp turbo four. Inboard pushrod front shocks. Automatic with optional "bump shift" sequential manual mode. Front drive. Three wheels. $27k-$32k, depending on trim and options. Lots of blowoff valve noise.

Any hive experience or thoughts? I can't think of a single motorsport opportunity for it, sadly.

Grtechguy
Grtechguy MegaDork
5/11/19 5:32 p.m.

I dig it.   Except for the headlights.

LanEvo
LanEvo HalfDork
5/11/19 11:25 p.m.

I know someone from back in my Montreal days who bought a T-Rex as a track toy ... only to find out that 3-wheelers were specifically prohibited on track. For me, that would be a huge barrier 

Kreb
Kreb UberDork
5/12/19 1:05 a.m.

3-wheelers are not banned from all tracks. Properly engineered three-wheelers can be pretty competent in the handling department. It's just that there are so many craptastic ones that have poisoned the waters.

LanEvo
LanEvo HalfDork
5/12/19 7:18 a.m.

^^^  Mike mentioned motorsport, so I assumed he’d want to take it on track. From what little I know, it might be hard to find an organization that lets you run with them.

Maybe at a motorcycle track day? I’m not sure trikes are allowed there either, but people do race those crazy sidecar rigs.

nimblemotorsports
nimblemotorsports New Reader
5/12/19 8:51 a.m.

I have a 3-wheeled car, and I would like to 'root' for the Vanderhall as it looks like they have done a good job with them, but...The Slingshot is what $20k?  Which still seems high, but $30k and now I think you really must be in search of a toy car and have lots of cash to dispose of, and need something unique that is only motorcycle weather friendly.

  There are plenty of choices at $30k for classic hotrodded 4-wheeled cars.

But then I've never bought a car for over $10k, let alone a new car, so consider the source.  :)  

Mike
Mike SuperDork
5/12/19 5:18 p.m.

I feel like it could safely handle autocross. The turning radius isn't too great, but the CG is pretty darn low. SCCA autocross excludes vehicles having other than four wheels, and anyhow, the stability rule calculations are ruined by having a rear track width of #DIV/0!.

A Track Night in America could be good. I'd consider that. 

If a PCA-type org (VCA?) we're brought into existence, I'd be all about it.

If people are out there racing lawn mowers,  it certainly seems like someone should be racing three wheelers. Well, besides Ape racing:

 

irish44j
irish44j MegaDork
5/12/19 5:23 p.m.

There is one local to me I've seen a few times. I really think it looks cool in person (and I'm not generally into three-wheelers). Where the Slingshot looks totally ridiculous in every way, the Vanderhall looks pretty classy. I don't know jack about the actual driving characteristics, however. 

ErikTheSwede
ErikTheSwede New Reader
5/12/19 5:33 p.m.

I personally would just build a FFM 818 for that price. I honestly don’t understand the fascination with the 3 wheeled things. All of the disadvantages of a motorcycle with none of the advantages.

bigdaddylee82
bigdaddylee82 UltraDork
5/12/19 5:55 p.m.

I have zero desire to own a motorcycle, well that's not true, but just knowing the number of times a week someone tries to run over me in my Tornado Red, Golf, I'm not eager to be hopping on a 2 wheeler and hitting the road.

I don't  have any desire to be doing motorsports with one, at least not sanctioned, but I totally get the appeal of a Morgan, or similar.  Head North, South, or East of me, and there's plenty of 2 lane twisty hill roads, thanks to being so close to the Ozarks and Ouachitas.

I'd never get SWMBO on a motorcycle, but she'd hop in a something a little more overt on the road, with seat belts, a roll bar, and a little side impact protection, bonus points if you don't have to physically hold it upright at every stop light. wink

I'm sure I could get a similar experience from a FFR, and what gearhead doesn't want a "Cobra," but there's something really endearing about the Morgan 3 Wheeler.   I totally get it.

Unfortunaely, the Vanderhall doesn't evoke the same feels from me. 

Apexcarver
Apexcarver UltimaDork
5/12/19 6:22 p.m.

Based on slingshots rollover sensitivity, I doubt any 3 wheeler like this will be catching on for track days. It normally relies on a Bosch ESC system to prevent rolling, sticky tires wouldn't help things. Doubt the vanwall is significantly better.

 

 

Mike
Mike SuperDork
5/12/19 10:35 p.m.

In reply to Apexcarver :

Ouch.

I do think the Vanderhall would be better. After seeing that video, the question is how sure I am.

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
5/13/19 2:04 a.m.

I didn't know they could get that kind of power out of a Remington electric razor. 

hvoxi
hvoxi New Reader
5/13/19 3:20 a.m.

I like the way it looks. That rollover video reminded me of the Race of Champions incident with Pascal Wehrlein https://youtu.be/Fhz_2gSpT_Y I think he fractured a vertebrae in his neck & missed a couple of races as a result. I don't remember hearing about what happened to his passenger

maj75
maj75 HalfDork
5/13/19 7:37 a.m.

Any iteration of the Lotus 7 would be better.

pinchvalve
pinchvalve MegaDork
5/13/19 8:12 a.m.

KTM has fixed the rollover threat with one small mod:

4 wheels.

Apexcarver
Apexcarver UltimaDork
5/14/19 7:44 a.m.
Mike said:

In reply to Apexcarver :

Ouch.

I do think the Vanderhall would be better. After seeing that video, the question is how sure I am.

Only reason I can think it might be better is because (if I recall correctly) the vanderhall is fwd. Still, if I was responsible for an organization, I would just avoid being the one to test that. Plus if it has a good lsd, it may be a moot point.

Mike
Mike SuperDork
5/14/19 2:18 p.m.
Apexcarver said:
Mike said:

In reply to Apexcarver :

Ouch.

I do think the Vanderhall would be better. After seeing that video, the question is how sure I am.

Only reason I can think it might be better is because (if I recall correctly) the vanderhall is fwd. Still, if I was responsible for an organization, I would just avoid being the one to test that. Plus if it has a good lsd, it may be a moot point.

To hear Vanderhall tell it, front drive is a big deal. I think you're also looking at a lower overall vehicle, and I suspect, a better roll center. Most of the trikes out there have cycle fenders on the front end, and occupants are smooshed together, rather than separated by a center console.

The Slingshot is about as wide overall at the front axle as at the passenger hips. That's not the case with the Morgan, Vanderhall or Campagna.

 

If you draw a triangle across the contact patches and look at how much hangs outside:

 

And, just to be clear, these are the seat-of-the-pants reasons I said I thought it'd do better. I don't have much science, and I know it. I'm not sure, and that gives me pause.

 

Ninja edit: Fixed antepenultimate sentence.

TurnerX19
TurnerX19 HalfDork
5/14/19 2:23 p.m.

Anything can be rolled over if you try hard enough. Learn the chassis limits and drive within them. Three wheel Morgans have a racing series with side cars in the UK. Very entertaining.

pimpm3
pimpm3 SuperDork
5/14/19 3:20 p.m.

I have seen several running around Jacksonville.  They are pretty classy looking in person.  

Much more appealing in my opinion than a Polaris slingshot 

Mike
Mike SuperDork
5/14/19 5:40 p.m.
TurnerX19 said:

Anything can be rolled over if you try hard enough. Learn the chassis limits and drive within them. Three wheel Morgans have a racing series with side cars in the UK. Very entertaining.

Like forgetting to bring a parachute when jumping from a plane, or jumping into a volcano, rolling an open vehicle is the sort of activity where the most effective kind of learning is from others.

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