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Sultan
Sultan Reader
9/30/10 7:38 p.m.

I know I am not like any of you who spend hours pondering new projects but......I have been thinking something and I am posting hoping to hear your thoughts.

I see a Locost and Formula Vee together as a cheap easy to build project. So maybe it looks like a Locost and the engine is like a FV where the tranaxle is flopped so it is a mid engine.

Maybe an other way to think of it is a mid engine street legal sailrail with a very simple body.

Thoughts?

Thank you RS

nocones
nocones Reader
9/30/10 7:43 p.m.

It's a very cool idea. Should be simple and hop-ups for the VW aircooled are cheap and plentiful. Make sure your state either has lienient laws regarding either

registration of homebuilts (cars that look like nothing and are all origional)

lax interpratation of what counts as a replica (ability to register as a 1961 lotus despite not really looking like one and being Mid engined instead of front engined )

or

Easy ability to register Dune bugies.

Without these three I think you would be better of building a "traditional" Front Rear locost.

Otherwise I think it's an exelent Idea, one I've toyed with but with Subaru power.

Daniel

oldopelguy
oldopelguy Dork
9/30/10 8:15 p.m.

FWD Locost with the whole VW works up front?

Maybe the AC-VW engine on a Subie AWD drivetrain Locost?

junkbuggie
junkbuggie New Reader
9/30/10 8:45 p.m.

I am no engineer so please correct me if i am wrong, but don't most AWD drive trains kinda suck for a locost? If there is a good one please enlighten me. I like bench building.

petegossett
petegossett SuperDork
9/30/10 10:29 p.m.

Indiana highway department owns a fleet of vehicles that are almost exactly like you describe. VW power in the back, torsion-beam up front. Locost style construction.... Only their's have a generator & air compressor mounted to the top of the cage.

They use them to replace the reflectors in-between the lanes, since the can drive from one to the next & never have leave the driver's seat to reach them. :)

EvanB
EvanB Dork
9/30/10 10:41 p.m.

Or you could do a locost with a rear engined Subaru drivetrain in the back

kb58
kb58 Reader
10/1/10 12:15 a.m.
EvanB wrote: Or you could do a locost with a rear engined Subaru drivetrain in the back

Yup, or a common FWD drivetrain behind the seats:

Salanis
Salanis SuperDork
10/1/10 1:20 a.m.

The man who brought us "Kimini" is currently working on "Midlana":

http://www.midlana.com/

Slyp_Dawg
Slyp_Dawg Reader
10/1/10 11:00 a.m.
petegossett wrote: Indiana highway department owns a fleet of vehicles that are almost exactly like you describe. VW power in the back, torsion-beam up front. Locost style construction.... Only their's have a generator & air compressor mounted to the top of the cage. They use them to replace the reflectors in-between the lanes, since the can drive from one to the next & never have leave the driver's seat to reach them. :)

perhaps a picture is in order? I'm having a hard-ish time visualizing any road maintance fleet vehicle looking even vaguely like a Locost, although major awesome points to them if they made some effort to make them vaguely locost-esque

Mikey52_1
Mikey52_1 HalfDork
10/1/10 12:00 p.m.

How 'bout this as a description for the original idea starter: The VW engine is separated from the transaxle by a torquetube, ala' C4 Vette or 928/944, but keep the torque tube short, right? That would put the engine where it needs to be for a locost, and allow the frame in front of the engine to be as long as it needs to be to get the right 'look' for a locost. I LIKE the idea, and I'd even do it with a diesel VW just to be snotty.

"Built it myself? Why yes, yes I did. Gets 53 mpg? Yupper! Why does it look like an old lotus? Because!"

PS122
PS122 Reader
10/1/10 1:54 p.m.

Anyone know if the 924/944 torquetube/transaxle shares a bolt pattern with any other VW or Audi engine (air-cooled or otherwise)?

PS122
PS122 Reader
10/1/10 2:16 p.m.

A mid-engine locost might look something like this:

I'm personally not wild about the styling but I bet it would be a fun drive.

turboswede
turboswede SuperDork
10/1/10 5:48 p.m.
PS122 wrote: Anyone know if the 924/944 torquetube/transaxle shares a bolt pattern with any other VW or Audi engine (air-cooled or otherwise)?

924's used an Audi 4-cylinder motor, which was the precursor of the 5-cylinder motors Audi used in their passenger cars. The bellhousing used on the 5-cylinder motors also matches many of the the V6 and V8 motors used in Audi's.

Basically, if it can fit into an Audi and bolt to an Audi transaxle, you can make it work. Look at what the Lamborghini and GT40 guys are doing, they are using Audi transaxles with adapter plates.

http://www.lambolounge.com/chassis/transmission/audi-915/index.asp

If you have a bell housing of your own you'd rather use, then the TT has a simple 4-bolt flange at the front that is easily adapted to the back of many different bellhousings. The TT itself is mild steel and easily modified through standard metalworking practices. The central shaft is also steel and could be modified by an axle shop.

The 944 V8 folks use a Camaro or Corvette bellhousing with a shortened TT and a Chrysler or Ford clutch disc. Considering the number of Audi-style transaxles they break, I'd say it works pretty well for them.

http://www.porschehybrids.com/

http://porschehybrids.pbworks.com/

mblommel
mblommel Reader
10/1/10 6:05 p.m.

In reply to Sultan:

I've been thinking along the same lines for a while now. No cooling system to deal with, lot's of dune buggy parts and know-how to make it happen fairly easily.

I dream of clothing this mythical tube frame mid engine VW locost with some Elva MK7 body work to make a poor-man's Elva Porsche.

kreb
kreb SuperDork
10/1/10 6:08 p.m.

The UK has some great mid-engined car kits. These guys stand out to me because it looks great and the basic kit is pretty friendly (until you factor shipping costs anyway.)

http://www.spiresportscars.co.uk/

Sultan
Sultan Reader
10/1/10 7:38 p.m.

mblommel - Wow that is awesome!

I wish I could make a fiberglass body but everything I have read kinda make it sem unrealistic for me.

Folks - Thanks for the input on other power plants. The reason I asked about the VW air cooled is becuase of the simplicty. If I felt brave I would do a Midlana or wait until Factory Five comes out with thier new car.

Thanks. Rick

mblommel
mblommel Reader
10/1/10 7:54 p.m.

In reply to Sultan:

Here's a thread for you to read:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/lo-cost-101-how-do-i-make-a-cool-caterham-replica/17266/page1/

Jensenman
Jensenman SuperDork
10/1/10 8:00 p.m.

Heck, half the engineering's already done: see 914 Porsche. But please do a better job on the shifter mechanism.

There was a guy in Columbia, SC who used to drive a very crude version of what you are talking about, only he left the motor in the back. Basically, it was a VW floorpan cut down to about 24" wide, driver sat in the middle on top of the 'backbone' and a steel tubing framework over that was covered with aluminum sheet. Dune buggy headlights, trailer taillights. No roll bar, windshield etc and he drove it wearing a full face helmet.

Knurled
Knurled HalfDork
10/2/10 11:10 a.m.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/the-voices-are-talking/25608/page1/

Sultan
Sultan Reader
10/2/10 11:53 a.m.

nocones - I have been following your project for a while. It is more than cool!

Platinum90
Platinum90 SuperDork
10/2/10 12:01 p.m.
turboswede said: 924's used an Audi 4-cylinder motor, which was the precursor of the 5-cylinder motors Audi used in their passenger cars. The bellhousing used on the 5-cylinder motors also matches many of the the V6 and V8 motors used in Audi's.

I like the direction of your thoughts, however, there is NO WAY that a 924 torque tube will handle Audi V8 levels of stress. They have way too much trouble with GM V6 power, and the gearing is not set up for that much torque.

Junkyard_Dog
Junkyard_Dog Dork
10/2/10 12:17 p.m.
PS122 wrote: A mid-engine locost might look something like this: I'm personally not wild about the styling but I bet it would be a fun drive.

Add a boat tail and some even more retro styling and I think it would be dead sexy.

Sultan
Sultan Dork
3/2/14 10:51 p.m.

Bringing back one of my old threads because of this car, http://megadeluxe.com/interviews/frankfurt-flyer-chris-runge

Amazing!

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic UberDork
3/2/14 11:45 p.m.

If you want a ACVW based locost I'd take an approach closer to rebodying a beat up super bug with a roll cage/exoskeleton.

oldopelguy
oldopelguy SuperDork
3/3/14 12:14 a.m.

With a water boxer van bell housing a vw air cooled engine might be adapted to bolt up to a front-engine rear-drive transmission. With a type 4 engine the bonnet could be super low and the cooling air ducted in right from the front of the car. If the airflow around the cylinders could be reversed, up through the engine instead of down, the fan would probably not even be necessary once the car was moving.

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