Interesting question. In Georgia right now there are many signs posted on businesses that basically proclaim..
"enter at your own risk of C19.. the owner of the business is not responsible for XYZ.. entering the premises is considered acceptance of this policy".
I kinda doubt that equals an ironclad legal agreement.. but it might.
Most people are not lazy self absorbed jerks despite the prevailing attitude of this thread. Truth is we see distinctly with our central vision which takes up less than 7 percent of our total vision. We see details, letters, shapes, colors, etc. Outside that 7 percent we perceive things. And imperfectly. Unless you point things out to people many will miss a lot. How do I know this? I teach driver education every day. I spend my days pointing out what most people miss because there's just too much visual information to digest. Unless it's huge, a high contrast to the surroundings, and DIRECTLY in their central vision, most people will miss it. I see this when I work at my wife's store. We hung a large sign just about six feet in the air with entry requirements just inside the door. We have a display table with a pump bottle of sanitizer and a table top sign with the same info. What do people do? They walk in, see the cute dog mannequin with the bright orange coat, and totally miss the signs and sanitizer. Not all, but some. Aside from telling everyone when they walk in what the rules are some are just not going to see them.
In reply to Duke :
It's the tyranny of the therapeutic.
Individual license is slowly consuming liberty for all.
I did once see a sign posted saying Seeing Eye dogs only. I'm certain it was a Federal bldg surprisingly.
I was thinking of this some more.
When you carry a concealed weapon, any place that clearly marks that you cannot carry concealed inside is (as far as I know) legally binding. I always have to remember to leave my pistol locked up when I go to IKEA.
There may be a slightly different set of rules for someone in that position than a random patron, but it is a stepping stone to what you're looking for?
In reply to Mr_Asa :
It's trespass if you ignore the no guns sign and don't leave when told to from what I've read.
Those kinds of people will call the Nash Bridges too because as Brendan Behan ruminated ' calling a cop makes everything better '.
vwcorvette (Forum Supporter) said: Aside from telling everyone when they walk in what the rules are some are just not going to see them.
In reply to Marjorie Suddard :
Topic Perfectly summarized
OHSCrifle said:Interesting question. In Georgia right now there are many signs posted on businesses that basically proclaim..
"enter at your own risk of C19.. the owner of the business is not responsible for XYZ.. entering the premises is considered acceptance of this policy".
I kinda doubt that equals an ironclad legal agreement.. but it might.
These are actually required for some businesses by the executive order that allowed them to reopen back in May. It's weird because the order specifically prohibits any legal recourse against a business anyway. The sign thing isn't legally necessary but it's in the order somewhere.
I spent 10 years in the sign business. Doesn't matter what you do, no one will read your signs. You can try to upcharge them but they will likely just walk out and you'll be left canceling the sale. Youll just lose customers without ever making the next one smarter. You can call it a code of conduct and kick them out of the store, but you'll have to hire a bouncer because things will go sideways on a regular basis.
I agree that if this has started grinding your gears that badly it's more profitable to spend your time on developing your own coping mechanisms than on trying to make the customer change.
For dogs (and small horses) my understanding is that service animals must be allowed and the business isn't allowed to ask the owner of the service animal what the animal does or to provide any sort of paperwork as to its necessity. Basically you can tell them that only service animals are allowed and if they say the dog (or small horse) is a service animal you're done. That said, the ada doesn't cover "emotional support" dogs and if it's not a dog or small horse, it's not a federally recognized service animal.
But everything I learned about the ada comes from excessive podcast-listening, so you might want to check up on that.
Not to get too Tesla here (I like their version more than 5 Man Acoustical Jam, sorry) but signs are berkeleying up the scenery and breaking minds at this point. Every door that your customer is walking through every day is going to be cluttered with signs and eventually you just tune it all out so you don't get overloaded. Add to that the fact that a lot of "regulations" like you're talking about wind up being selectively enforced and most people are going to test the limits since it usually works.
I guess the real question is what are you actually trying to accomplish? If someone walks through your door with a propane tank do you get fined or otherwise reprimanded immediately? Is there an ordinance in your area that would realistically penalize the business if someone entered the store without a mask? Is there some sort of extreme danger that shelving will fall over should four paws cross the threshold? My guess on that is that any agency that you're dealing with would consider you in compliance by having the sign posted plus a gentle reminder to the noncompliant customer followed by ejecting a customer that refuses. So pissing off customers and putting on an unfriendly face isn't going to really create any net benefit.
Put your signs on the door explaining what the rules are, but be nice about it. When people aren't obeying the rules, you're going to have to speak up and tell them "I'm sorry, the big bad common enemy that we both have says that I have to tell you that you're not allowed to do what you're doing. And I can prove to you that it's not just me being a jerk, it's that stupid sign over there". You're going to get people that want to argue about it and they're going to grumble about it. And then you're going to get their money when they make a purchase. If that isn't a bargain that you're willing to make, then you might try to find something a little more back of the store to do.
This is something that I've gone through over and over again. Everybody on the customer service side gets ticked off because people don't want to follow the rules. But in the end, trying to change the customer is nearly impossible and in almost every case you need their money more than they need you.
Oh, and to answer the original question: legally enforceable? Well.... When the guy at the counter says "I'll not pay this fine I've incurred- it's unjust!" What is your plan when they leave whatever the were going to buy on the counter and walk out? Call the police? Spend a few thousand dollars to sue them for five bucks? I'm really not seeing how you win there. Upside: if you manage to piss off your customers they'll spend their money elsewhere. Like my dad always said: the job would be so much easier without all these damned customers.
In reply to vwcorvette (Forum Supporter) :
That's a big part of the problem with doors and signs. Ever see that scene in movies where the detective, or cop, or super spy scans a scene for a few seconds and then talks in amazing detail about what they saw? It's a powerful scene because that's a superpower.
We learn how to walk into a store, then we push most of that cognitive load out of our conscious mind. We don't look at every sign, every note, the hours of the store. Most stores have a ton of signage at the door. Hours, stuff about smoking, probably. If I don't think I'm doing anything strange, like bringing a pet goat with me to tie to the camcorder stand while I shop for music, I'm not going to stand outside a store and read that.
People just don't have the bandwidth to read the signs on every door, or the whole warning label on the Tylenol, or the dialog box that says "Accept" when installing software.
The only thing I can think of is making your signs novel. Perhaps something that moves? Maybe put a "no canisters" sign on the door handles?
I'm sure i'm just late to the party, but MNDSM, what is the store you now own and operate??
A much more practical solution for the entrance of your store:
In reply to ShawnG :
I tend to leave my dog at home for 2 reasons:1) as a 90 # Doberman he tends to cause an uproar by his very presence. 2) As an intelligent creature he doesn't care much for strangers.
purplepeopleeater said:In reply to ShawnG :
I tend to leave my dog at home for 2 reasons:1) as a 90 # Doberman he tends to cause an uproar by his very presence. 2) As an intelligent creature he doesn't care much for strangers.
for years I would take my dog with me and leave him in the car with water etc when I went into the store ,
But now you will come out and someone may have broken your door glass to "Save" you dog.....
I think you need to put signs on posts as you are walking in , have them at face level and blame everything on the Health Dept . !
Wear masks - Health Dept
no pets - Health Dept
no propane bottles - Health Dept
maybe put the phone number of the Health Dept on the signs.....
Marjorie Suddard said:vwcorvette (Forum Supporter) said: Aside from telling everyone when they walk in what the rules are some are just not going to see them.
This is my drinks case 50 times a day.
In reply to Mndsm :
Easier to buy a new case.
In reply to Mndsm :
Depending on the handle type, make it so the have to inconviently reach around a stood off sign to grasp the handle of it's an employee access only case.
In reply to wae :
You're dead on the screws with the dog thing.
Steve_Jones said:In reply to Mndsm :
Easier to buy a new case.
Case is new. Cased is locked because people got sticky fingers.
Just post this above your door?
Mr_Asa said:I always have to remember to leave my pistol locked up when I go to IKEA.
Who needs to bring a pistol to IKEA?
There's a BBQ spot that has "cash only" signs all over the place - probably 10 signs and I'm convinced there's always somebody who hands them a credit card. Good food if you are ever near Midlothian, IL.
In reply to ShawnG :
Dog haters
I can explain the dog thing, and this is coming from someone who only takes their dog to breweries where dogs are specifically allowed, and even then it's not too often as she hates car rides. But people who take their dogs everywhere do so because they have no personality and no way to engage other people in conversation it's how they meet potential dating partners. They take their dog everywhere so that the dog is the icebreaker. Even if 70% of people hate it if 15 are indifferent and say nothing and the other 15% come up and compliment them or engage the dog and say how cute and friendly it is, if half of that 15% is the opposite gender they now have inroads with 7.5% of the population they meet without having purchased a drink or entered a bar. Double bonus for taking their dogs to Home Depot, which allows them, because if you meet someone at Home Depot you know that they have their life together, they likely own a property, they have an interest in improving their property, they have the discretionary income to buy the supplies to make the improvements and the motivation and drive to attempt to do them on their own. This of course does not apply to teenagers who are buying edging to make an air dam for their 240SX.
So in short if you're single and want to meet somebody decent take your dog into Home Depot, don't stop at the tool cart, go directly to the back and look at backsplashes. Because that's a weekend project that are recently divorced woman will feel empowered and confident in undertaking herself.
In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :
Man... and I just take mine there to get him used to more people and situations. I've been doing this all wrong!! Did have several young women stop and say "hi" to him though....
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