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mazdeuce - Seth
mazdeuce - Seth Mod Squad
12/3/20 6:36 p.m.

ASAP which I suspect will be a while due to me being low risk. I expect it will be available to my college age kids long before me. They are both ready to get it. 

dropstep
dropstep UberDork
12/3/20 6:46 p.m.

Nope, until it's got a few years of history behind it I won't. My wife feels the same and she is being offered it in the first wave for Ohio because of her job.

RX Reven'
RX Reven' SuperDork
12/3/20 6:46 p.m.

I'm in medical device engineering rather than pharma so I'm not at ground zero but I'll happily get the vaccine as soon as I'm allowed to.

Folks, the vast majority of the criticism is political not scientific...get the shot!!

 

 

KyAllroad (Jeremy) (Forum Supporter)
KyAllroad (Jeremy) (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
12/3/20 6:55 p.m.

I'm a fed and work in a hospital.  I'm in the very first group it's being offered to.

And yeah, science is a real thing so I figure those dudes in lab coats know what they are talking about.  I'll be getting it.

(slightly shakier was when I had to take nerve agent "pre-treatment" pills during the war, they didn't feel good so I fed them to the desert)

Jesse Ransom (FFS)
Jesse Ransom (FFS) UltimaDork
12/3/20 6:58 p.m.

Absolutely, as soon as I can, which will  probably be later due to my age/job/etc.

Given the fact that it's been tested and approved, that not rolling it out will be bad for many people (not necessarily me, not necessarily not me), and that someone has to get it earlier in order for the wait-and-seers to get their larger sample size, I'm in.

grover
grover Dork
12/3/20 6:58 p.m.

ASAP.

Woody (Forum Supportum)
Woody (Forum Supportum) MegaDork
12/3/20 6:59 p.m.
Stampie (FS) said:

Getting it as soon as I can.  My biggest worry is Lil Stampie would be a lower level than me.  Hoping it's offered on the family level.

If you get the vaccine and build immunity, you will be less likely to bring the virus into your home. 

Stampie (FS)
Stampie (FS) MegaDork
12/3/20 7:10 p.m.

In reply to Woody (Forum Supportum) :

Yes but I'm more worried about him getting it when he's not with me for reasons I don't want to go into.

Type Q
Type Q SuperDork
12/3/20 7:14 p.m.

I figure I am going to get exposed at some point.  I would rather it be from a vaccine than the live virus from another human.

 

I will probably middle to the end of of 2021 in terms of priority.

aircooled
aircooled MegaDork
12/3/20 7:22 p.m.

For those doing a self risk analysis:

Much of the data out there is very much crap and showing less than relevant data.  As I am sure most know now, risk of death is VERY low for those under 75.  The risk for hospitalization (which I am assuming is a VERY bad time) is NOWHERE near as skewed.  Some here can likely tell you what hospitalization is like.

The point is: you may think you are pretty "safe" if you are under 75.  You may live, but you may very much not like the ride... roll the dice.

Don't forget, we have no idea what the long term effects of the virus are either, and it's "designed" to try and kill you.

Here is the hospitalization data broken out (those hospitalized, by age).  A 40 year old, for example, is only about a third less likely to be hospitalized than some 85+:

Sadly, this is not broken out by the highly relevant data point of pre-existing conditions.  But remember, many, especially younger, may not be aware of those.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/investigations-discovery/hospitalization-death-by-age.html

Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter)
Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
12/3/20 7:25 p.m.

I'll get it, but we live pretty damn isolated lives & I know there are others who need it way worse than I do - so I'll get it whenever I get it. Like others have said, I don't expect it to be anytime soon. 

Nick Comstock
Nick Comstock MegaDork
12/3/20 7:27 p.m.

Having just recovered from it and with my mother still in ICU with it and struggling to stay off of a ventilator I'll be getting it as soon as I can. 

Sonic
Sonic UltraDork
12/3/20 7:33 p.m.

I'll get it from one of the major US/Euro pharmas as soon as I'm allowed, but I'm pretty far down the list as a healthy middle aged person with no health issues and in reasonable shape.  

mtn (Forum Supporter)
mtn (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
12/3/20 7:38 p.m.

Getting it ASAP. I'm actually signed up for the Johnson & Johnson trial, but I don't think they'll pick me, unfortunately. Be warned, I've heard that it does cause you to feel pretty lousy the first day.

 

For people worried about it being rushed - this is how a molecular virologist described it on Reddit (I think, my brother sent this to me), and my dad (retired from Pfizer) agreed with the premise: 

I’ll take a crack at an ELI5:

You and your dad are building a bike ramp. You only have limited money that you’ve saved up all winter to build the ramp. Your mom and dad want the ramp to be safe, and they want it to last you all summer. You want the ramp to be big and fun. So you and Dad start experimenting you buy one piece of wood of a certain length and decide it won’t be long enough so you return it. You buy another piece that’s long enough, but Mom says it’s TOO long and unsafe, so you return it. You settle on the right length of ramp eventually. But, your dad is worried that the ramp is going to rot if you leave it out, so he buys three different pieces of material of the right length to test for weather durability. You leave the three pieces out in the rain for a week and two of them start to rot. So now you’ve decided on the length and material after a few weeks of experimenting. Finally, you’re able to build your ramp and you have it in one month after you started. You wasted very little money and you have something safe, effective, and durable.

Now, Carl up the street has a rich dad. Carl heard you’re building a bike ramp and wants one before you, and Carl’s parents demand the same standard of safety and durability. Except, rather than getting approval from his mom for safety, and approval from his Dad for durability, Carl just buys enough materials to build 9 different ramps, of different lengths and materials, all at the same time. Carl’s plan is to just toss out the materials and ramps that don’t get approval from his parents, but he doesn’t care because they just handed him $500 and he wants to have a ramp before you. Carl builds 9 ramps, leaves materials out in the rain for durability testing, and then asks his mom which ramps are too long and aren’t safe, all in the first week. Edit: In addition, Carl buys a “ramp template” that’s shown some promise for building really great ramps over the past few years, making his build far less complicated.

Carl’s final ramp is already built at the outset, he just needs to get approval from his parents. This means he spends a lot more money, but it takes him just one week to complete his ramp.

This was more complicated than intended, but the first method is how companies traditionally make vaccines, in a linear fashion, not moving onto the next step until the first is complete. Carl is what is currently happening for the Covid19 vaccine. Companies are proceeding “at risk” aka manufacturing all of the product before the testing is complete, so when they get approval, the final product has already been made. Our tax dollars are supplementing these companies so that they have an incentive to proceed without bankrupting themselves if the trials go south.

 

And their non-ELI5 explanation: 

No stages have been skipped. There is an argument to be made to look at long term effects of the vaccine, but what is considered long term? 12 months? 5 years? 20 years? All of these points have been proposed, and those opposing vaccines are ALWAYS going to try and push the goal posts farther.

Again, no steps are being skipped. The steps are traditionally done in a linear fashion:

  1. R&D (1 year-20 years)

  2. Lead selection/optimization (2 years)

  3. pre-clinical safety and efficacy (animal trials) (6 months)

  4. IND filing (investigational new drug) (1 month)

  5. Small batch GMP production (3 months)

  6. Phase 1 safety trials (6 months-1 year)

  7. Phase 2 safety and efficacy trials (6 months-1 year)

  8. large batch GMP manufacturing (3-6 months)

  9. Phase 3 large scale trials (1+ years)

  10. FDA approval

  11. marketing and distribution

It costs a company on average $2.8 billion to do steps 1-10.

Any company in the running (Moderna, Pfizer, AstraZeneca, Oxford, etc.) had steps 1-5 done early this year or before. The mRNA platform is very “plug and play” in that the delivery mechanism has been in the works for quite some time (see MERS, og SARS vaccines), all they had to do was optimize the sars2 spike mRNA and drop it into their systems, significantly shortening steps 1-5, and 8.

These companies are all doing steps 6-10 in parallel. This is not normal, but nothing is being skipped. This means they are not waiting for phase 1/2/3 data before ramping up large scale manufacturing, meaning they are proceeding “at risk” that those doses will get tossed out if they fail phase1/2/3. Our tax dollars offset this risk, meaning companies will not go bankrupt for trying to get a vaccine as quickly as possible.

 

BenB (Forum Supporter)
BenB (Forum Supporter) Reader
12/3/20 8:02 p.m.

One more "Hell yeah!" here.

ProDarwin
ProDarwin MegaDork
12/3/20 8:04 p.m.

Yep.

+1 to what mtn said.  The 'rushing' is just a case of taking a bunch of steps in parallel for a bunch of vaccine candidates.  No single step is completed any faster than it would be otherwise.

 

neverdone
neverdone New Reader
12/3/20 8:04 p.m.

ASAP here also.

Sidewayze
Sidewayze Reader
12/3/20 8:18 p.m.

Absolutely ASAP.

 

ultraclyde (Forum Supporter)
ultraclyde (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
12/3/20 8:23 p.m.

ASAP. 

the chance of being harmed by the vaccine is so much lower than the chance of being harmed by the virus that it is absolutely laughable. Anyone familiar with the actual process of vaccine design and approval will tell you the same. Just do it. 

Floating Doc (Forum Supporter)
Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) UberDork
12/3/20 8:32 p.m.

I don't know when I'll be eligible. Supposedly, we're essential, but I sure can't compare my risk to someone working on humans. Definitely planning to get it.

californiamilleghia
californiamilleghia SuperDork
12/3/20 8:32 p.m.

Waiting for German approval ,   well really it will be months before I get offered the jab , 

by then they will have a better idea.......

But if it was now or never , I would pick now !

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/3/20 8:36 p.m.

ASAP here.  Our country long ago decided at all levels bottom to top that ~80% of us are getting antibodies for this thing somehow*.  As a slightly obese high BP Father of an asthmatic kid with 2 immediate family members with genetic kidney diseases I'd  much rather our antibodies come in the form of a vaccine that has been tested to not put me or my family on a ventilator then taking my chances that one of us get bad COVID.

 

*That's not flounder, I'm not blaming anyone, I'm saying our collective response to this pandemic requires that we reach herd immunity to get out of it.  That can occur through infection or vaccine.  We are collectively not willing to take the steps that other countries have taken with enough compliance to exit any other way.  It's possible we are avoiding a worse calamity by making that choice.  I don't know, my knowledge is not in the necessary fields to be able to assess those possibilities so I trust those who  have that expertise.

MrJoshua
MrJoshua UltimaDork
12/3/20 8:38 p.m.

Step 9) Phase 3 large scale trials (1+ years). 

A year plus means significantly longer than 1 year for just the trial stage prior to FDA approval. Where are we on this timeline? 

Zachary
Zachary New Reader
12/3/20 8:46 p.m.

This “vaccine” is not a vaccine in the traditional sense. It is an experimental injectable technology that has never been used before in humans. I wouldn't be considered an "anti vaxer", but I've got no interest in playing guinea pig with big pharma, especially when they are exempt from any financial fallout from adverse effects from this experiment. 

And then there’s the fact that the coronavirus vaccine trials themselves are a documented sham. The vaccine candidates are not even being measured on the basis of whether or not they can prevent infection, but whether they can reduce symptoms such as coughs and headaches in patients who have already tested positive. 

And there’s the fact that, right after Pfizer's announcement of a successful trial (and subsequent media extravaganza), Pfizer’s CEO and executive vice president both sold millions of dollars worth of stock in the company.

Nope, I'm going to stick with Vitamin D, fresh air, exercise, and a healthy diet.

ProDarwin
ProDarwin MegaDork
12/3/20 8:47 p.m.
MrJoshua said:

Step 9) Phase 3 large scale trials (1+ years). 

A year plus means significantly longer than 1 year for just the trial stage prior to FDA approval. Where are we on this timeline? 

I'm not sure exactly where that number came from, but I have seen numbers around 3 months for Covid vaccines to complete a phase 3 trial.  

https://www.niaid.nih.gov/news-events/phase-3-clinical-trial-investigational-vaccine-covid-19-begins

Several of them began phase 3 in July

https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html

 

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