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mad_machine
mad_machine MegaDork
9/12/18 8:48 a.m.

We all know yesterday was the anniversary of that awful attack. With this date came the usual slew of FB posts on the conspiracy theories regarding the fall of the towers. I lost two co-workers and almost lost an old friend to that attack. Nothing pisses me off more than people putting up half baked "theories" about why the towers went down. I actually de-friended one of my casual co-workers on FB when I asked him to stop and he came back at me

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
9/12/18 8:53 a.m.

I'm sure Wally has some stories about people telling him the "truth." Conspiracy theories are fun till they aren't.

Tom_Spangler
Tom_Spangler PowerDork
9/12/18 9:31 a.m.

It's an interesting quirk of the human psyche, this desire to believe in things that are demonstrably not so. I guess some of it is looking for things that confirm your own biases or suspicions. And some of it is wanting to be one of the people with the "real information" and not what everyone else believes. It helps, of course, that there have been coverups in the past. But the idea that something this big could remain hidden for this long is frankly ludicrous. But that doesn't stop otherwise intelligent people from buying into it. Including a certain Superbowl-winning football coach.....

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
9/12/18 9:40 a.m.

Yeah, I always find it interesting that thousands of government and private sector workers have never talked in nearly 2 decades...............................but this same government can't handle buying books for schools or getting the roads paved. 

 

That being said, there are some anomalies that make you wonder. 

But nothing like "A missile hit the Pentagon, or planes didn't hit the towers it was real time CGI, etc."

One of my favorites is "Silverstein insured the building he purchased against terrorist attacks right after he bought it." Well yeah, it had already been attacked once,and many other plots against it failed. Would you not insure your new car? Your house? 

Frittatas are everywhere.

The0retical
The0retical UltraDork
9/12/18 9:47 a.m.

In reply to z31maniac :

That's where I fall on things too. Having worked in position where some extremely sensitive things were said and done, it is amazing how freely people will volunteer information. Hell, I had a hard enough time keeping peoples phones out of the SCIF and that's some basic E36 M3.

That's why the deep state nonsense rarely holds water.

As for the anomalies. When you spend a bunch of time dealing with various facets of governmental organizations, you realize how little information is actually exchanged. That's why, for example, my DNA is on file 4(? I lost count could be more) separate times with the US government. None of them are for criminal offenses mind you.

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH MegaDork
9/12/18 10:11 a.m.

I wrote a similar rant many years ago:

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/off-topic-discussion/911-truthers-are-the-dumbest-conspiracy-theorists/15295/page1/

I actually have the most respect for flat earthers among the conspiracy nuts, they've thought their theories through to the point where it's hard to tell if they're a bunch of deeply deluded nutballs or very clever trolls - some people absolutely insist they're the latter. They've carefully constructed an alternate reality bubble elaborate enough that you can only decisively pop it with a spaceship.

Adrian_Thompson
Adrian_Thompson MegaDork
9/12/18 10:25 a.m.

I think what get's me most about 9/11 conspiracy theorists is that compared to most other conspiracy theories these ideas are truly deeply offensive and upsetting to millions of People around the world.  Let alone the poor friends, relatives, parents, children and loved ones who lost their lives on that day.  Talk all you like about JFK and a 2nd shooter or a CIA hit, it isn't going to negatively affect too many people.  Prattle on about a flat earth despite photo's from every angle imaginable taken from space, you are amusingly blinkered.  Spout on about lizard people running the planet or the Illuminati, you're funny.  But start spouting BS about one of the most horrific events in recent history and you are directly insulting the memory of those who died within the life time of most people in this country.

Duke
Duke MegaDork
9/12/18 10:30 a.m.

Annnnnd, I've wasted an hour of my life this morning battling this idiocy... AGAIN.  Just like every September.

Cooter
Cooter Dork
9/12/18 10:45 a.m.

I make it very well known that if I hear any of that nonsense, it is an immediate unfriending.

In real life, as well.  

Wally
Wally MegaDork
9/12/18 10:47 a.m.

I’ve stopped arguing with people and just suggest that since the Government did it we should be apologizing to the people of Afghanistan and any other Muslims that have wrongly been punished for it.  I haven’t met anyone yet that believes in their theory enough to agree with me.

xflowgolf
xflowgolf Dork
9/12/18 10:49 a.m.

I find it interestingly frustrating in the timing of the event having occurred just before the internet was really universally used, yet close enough that anyone with an opinion was able to vomit their theory into the void of internet space within the few years after that followed.  The iphone was till 5 years away, YouTube and Facebook didn't exist yet, and Google had just begun to surpass AltaVista in popularity, etc.  

As a result, the majority of the content on YouTube today related to 9/11 seems to be predominantly related to the conspiracy aspect of it as all the videos were made after the fact.  Very few people had DVR's/Tivo during the live feeds.  Now YouTube is hardly the gold standard for research, but as a parent, my son is now in 4th grade, and I consider him to be part of a YouTube generation.  YouTube and Google are the first go to when curious about just about anything.  

He had been asking me about 9/11, so we decided to do some YouTube searches to find some content or news feeds, etc.  I had to be like.. Nope.  Nope... eh.. not that one.  "the trutha bout" nope not that one... 

I was surprised how prevelant it was, and how dilligently I had to go out of my way to find legit content.  An unsupervised youth (and many of them are) wouldn't really understand how much fake/derived content they're being delivered.  

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH MegaDork
9/12/18 11:09 a.m.
Adrian_Thompson said:

I think what get's me most about 9/11 conspiracy theorists is that compared to most other conspiracy theories these ideas are truly deeply offensive and upsetting to millions of People around the world.  Let alone the poor friends, relatives, parents, children and loved ones who lost their lives on that day.  Talk all you like about JFK and a 2nd shooter or a CIA hit, it isn't going to negatively affect too many people.  Prattle on about a flat earth despite photo's from every angle imaginable taken from space, you are amusingly blinkered.  Spout on about lizard people running the planet or the Illuminati, you're funny.  But start spouting BS about one of the most horrific events in recent history and you are directly insulting the memory of those who died within the life time of most people in this country.

I think the mass shooting false-flaggers are worse. 9/11 truthers may dispute *why* your relatives died, but the "shooting truthers" will dispute *that* your relatives died, or that they even existed, or that you are a real person and not an actor.

T.J.
T.J. MegaDork
9/12/18 11:18 a.m.

I thought this was going to be a thread about the 914-6. 

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
9/12/18 11:25 a.m.
GameboyRMH said:
Adrian_Thompson said:

I think what get's me most about 9/11 conspiracy theorists is that compared to most other conspiracy theories these ideas are truly deeply offensive and upsetting to millions of People around the world.  Let alone the poor friends, relatives, parents, children and loved ones who lost their lives on that day.  Talk all you like about JFK and a 2nd shooter or a CIA hit, it isn't going to negatively affect too many people.  Prattle on about a flat earth despite photo's from every angle imaginable taken from space, you are amusingly blinkered.  Spout on about lizard people running the planet or the Illuminati, you're funny.  But start spouting BS about one of the most horrific events in recent history and you are directly insulting the memory of those who died within the life time of most people in this country.

I think the mass shooting false-flaggers are worse. 9/11 truthers may dispute *why* your relatives died, but the "shooting truthers" will dispute *that* your relatives died, or that they even existed, or that you are a real person and not an actor.

Ooohh, I've even read some that say the were military copies of civilian jets and that the "crashed" ones were landed in Ohio and the people sent where? Who knows. And all kinds of crazy stuff. 

Wally
Wally MegaDork
9/12/18 11:30 a.m.

In reply to xflowgolf :

People also forget it was before camera phones so there are far fewer photos.  At the time I thought carrying my camera to work and snapping pics would be disrespectful but now I wish I had.  There were so many things, bad and good that I wish had been preserved. 

 

In reply to GameboyRMH :

I would agree with that, I find the Sandy Hook one far more offensive. To tell people that have already lost a child that they are actors and their kid didn’t exist in the first place takes a special kind of shiny happy person. 

Floating Doc
Floating Doc HalfDork
9/12/18 11:49 a.m.

They're the contemporary version of the Holocaust denier.

Ransom
Ransom PowerDork
9/12/18 11:51 a.m.
xflowgolf said:

He had been asking me about 9/11, so we decided to do some YouTube searches to find some content or news feeds, etc.  I had to be like.. Nope.  Nope... eh.. not that one.  "the trutha bout" nope not that one... 

I was surprised how prevelant it was, and how dilligently I had to go out of my way to find legit content.  An unsupervised youth (and many of them are) wouldn't really understand how much fake/derived content they're being delivered.  

There's a great lesson for everyone, but especially for young folks learning how to research/think/etc about the very nature of what the motivation is to make a video. There aren't thousands of non-conspiracy videos on the topic because, well, non-conspiracy-theorists don't have their own personal version they're wound up about selling. It's been covered, no new video needed. The same is true for so much information apart from conspiracies as well, of course.

Woody
Woody MegaDork
9/12/18 11:59 a.m.

I'm in Sandy Hook almost every day. I have a zero tolerance policy for conspiracy theorists.

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
9/12/18 12:09 p.m.
z31maniac said:

Yeah, I always find it interesting that thousands of government and private sector workers have never talked in nearly 2 decades...............................but this same government can't handle buying books for schools or getting the roads paved. 

This. My mother worked for the Govt for over 30 years. I have friends who work for the Govt now. Some in fairly sensitive positions.

The idea that our Govt could pull off the act of taking down the WTC towers and keeping it a secret is absolutely laughable. 

Duke
Duke MegaDork
9/12/18 12:24 p.m.
Ian F said:
z31maniac said:

Yeah, I always find it interesting that thousands of government and private sector workers have never talked in nearly 2 decades...............................but this same government can't handle buying books for schools or getting the roads paved. 

This. My mother worked for the Govt for over 30 years. I have friends who work for the Govt now. Some in fairly sensitive positions.

The idea that our Govt could pull off the act of taking down the WTC towers and keeping it a secret is absolutely laughable. 

I have a car guy friend who I like a lot, but he's absolutely a Koch-Brothers-9/11-inside-job-conspiracy nut.

The stuff he says about Newton's Third law proving the towers were demolished would make a communications major roll their eyes.

RossD
RossD MegaDork
9/12/18 12:27 p.m.

I only look at FB to check the comments after posting a picture of my kids. This reaffirms that.

Dusterbd13
Dusterbd13 MegaDork
9/12/18 12:29 p.m.

I work with a girl that was in tower 2 when it was hit.

Ive had a meal with eli wiezel (haulocost survior at Auschwitz.) Heard firsthand about both.

People who try to deny the validityof these have a special place. 

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
9/12/18 1:20 p.m.

In reply to Duke :

Yeah... all of the "theories" about how there is no way burning jet fuel gets hot enough to melt steel is another one...  well.. if you can't understand basic thermodynamics, I can't help you... 

Wally
Wally MegaDork
9/12/18 1:26 p.m.

In reply to Ian F :

It’s easier to picture Dick Cheney crawling through the a/c ducts planting Thermite.

alfadriver
alfadriver MegaDork
9/12/18 1:26 p.m.
Ian F said:

In reply to Duke :

Yeah... all of the "theories" about how there is no way burning jet fuel gets hot enough to melt steel is another one...  well.. if you can't understand basic thermodynamics, I can't help you... 

Worse- steel does not have to melt to lose enough strength to fail.  Just has to get past a point where it was heat treated to be that strong.

Burning jet fuel is way hot enough to change metal properties.

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