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FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/30/18 3:53 p.m.

FUTURE HARLEY-DAVIDSON OFFERINGS

 

This excites me.  As long as priced to the market...

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/30/18 4:58 p.m.

These just make me miss the Buell even more. 

Nick Comstock
Nick Comstock MegaDork
7/30/18 5:01 p.m.

I really like every single one of those. I expect they'll be expensive however. 

I'm seeing so much hate and vitriol from from the Harley faithful though. It's doesn't give me a lot of hope for the future.

Donebrokeit
Donebrokeit SuperDork
7/30/18 7:09 p.m.

Nick, H-D is looking for new riders as they will keep putting out the standard bikes to keep the current riders happy. The Company is planning for the next 20 years,as we move towards less gasoline E/V bikes will be the future look at Paris and London.

 

Ithink it's a bold move and I hope this will help them down the road.

 

Paul B

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 6:31 a.m.

Exactly, Nick.  The cruiser and touring market will be "the same as it ever was".  There will be continued evolution.

What we see here is H=D making inroads to places that it has never been (ADV), and to places it never really got serious about (Sportbikes/Naked bikes) as well as being on the pointy end of something completely new--a "big name" in the Electric bike arena.

Bold move indeed--but a necessary one.

 

wearymicrobe
wearymicrobe UberDork
7/31/18 8:17 a.m.
FSP_ZX2 said:

This excites me.  As long as priced to the market...

This is Harley they will charge 18K for a 60hp "sportbike", but for 10K more you can get a stage 4 kit that ruins the drivability to take it to 75hp.

Trans_Maro
Trans_Maro PowerDork
7/31/18 9:15 a.m.

Congratulations to HD for once again figuring out how to build a 10 year old Japanese motorcycle.

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 9:37 a.m.
wearymicrobe said:
FSP_ZX2 said:

This excites me.  As long as priced to the market...

This is Harley they will charge 18K for a 60hp "sportbike", but for 10K more you can get a stage 4 kit that ruins the drivability to take it to 75hp.

The currently available 750 Street Rod is certainly "sporty" by H-D standards, and makes 65 HP at the wheel and is $8699. Your comments make you look like an ignorant hater.

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 9:42 a.m.

In reply to Trans_Maro :

The MT1 was Yamaha putting a torquey, low-revving "big block" touring bike motor into a sporty chassis.  I do not see the H-D Streetfighter as this at all.  Its more like a  Ducati Monster or Truimph Triple-esque bike.

Nick Comstock
Nick Comstock MegaDork
7/31/18 9:49 a.m.

In reply to FSP_ZX2 :

See what I'm saying. Non Harley guys ridicule. Harley faithful ridicule. If the dealers support these like many did Buell, treat them like the bastard step child, it's going to be a long hard expensive road for Harley. 

I'm extremely hopeful. But not optimistic.

Trans_Maro
Trans_Maro PowerDork
7/31/18 9:53 a.m.

It's going to be a long road for them.

They've spent the last 20 years turning their company into a caricature of itself.

It's going to take a few home runs before people start seeing them as an innovative company. 

They have the talent and the money to build awesome things, I hope they do it.

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 10:20 a.m.
FSP_ZX2 said:

Exactly, Nick.  The cruiser and touring market will be "the same as it ever was".  There will be continued evolution.

What we see here is H=D making inroads to places that it has never been (ADV), and to places it never really got serious about (Sportbikes/Naked bikes) 

 

ahem...

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 10:29 a.m.
FSP_ZX2 said:

In reply to Trans_Maro :

The MT1 was Yamaha putting a torquey, low-revving "big block" touring bike motor into a sporty chassis.  I do not see the H-D Streetfighter as this at all.  Its more like a  Ducati Monster or Truimph Triple-esque bike.

I don't see that as a Monster Killer. Or even a monster fighter. I see a top heavy poseur. And a missing drive belt. This is coming from someone who wants to be able to buy something from the MoCo. 

 

The MT1 turned a 11.77 in the quarter mile, BTW. I don't see the Streetfighter coming anywhere near that. 

The most innovative and best performing products H-D ever sold were designed by Erik Buell. 

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 10:29 a.m.

In reply to Cooter :

Buell was *not* H-D, as closely allied as the companies were.  Buell was Buell.  I had an M2 and an STT--I love their bikes, but aside from sharing powertrains and a dealer network (who largely did not know how to market and sell them), they were still two distinct companies. 

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 10:42 a.m.

In reply to FSP_ZX2 :

Hogwash. 

 

Buell was wholly owned by H-D.  H-D made Erik sell that blasted Blast, which he wanted absolutely nothing to do with. And when the economy tanked, the MoCo killed off Buell "to focus on the Harley Davidson brand"

Thus digging the grave that they are now trying to get at least one of their feet out of. 

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 10:53 a.m.

And as for the Street 750 being "sporty" by H-D standards, this was an actual sporty bike by Harley standards. 

 

 

The street couldn't hang with an XR, but an XR couldn't hang with any sportbike from the rest of the world. It made 79 horsepower and cost $11k in 2009. 

wearymicrobe
wearymicrobe UberDork
7/31/18 10:57 a.m.
FSP_ZX2 said:
wearymicrobe said:
FSP_ZX2 said:

This excites me.  As long as priced to the market...

This is Harley they will charge 18K for a 60hp "sportbike", but for 10K more you can get a stage 4 kit that ruins the drivability to take it to 75hp.

The currently available 750 Street Rod is certainly "sporty" by H-D standards, and makes 65 HP at the wheel and is $8699. Your comments make you look like an ignorant hater.

Dude I own and ride Harley almost exclusively. Mind you most of mine have been 20-30 years old. Hell I am starting a rebuild on a WLA with a friend soon. 

I just don't think they have the balls to price it right. Well I should be clear I don;t think they have the scale to produce it cheap enough given the cash flow issues they have.

 

The 750 street shows just how freaking out of touch they are with the US market.  

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 11:19 a.m.

In reply to Cooter :

Yeah--I own one.  2011 XR1200X

It seems you are confusing the Street 750 with the Street Rod 750.  Same frame and tank--everything else not the same.  

Nick Comstock
Nick Comstock MegaDork
7/31/18 11:21 a.m.

By and large the reaction I'm seeing is negative. That's from Harley groups and non Harley groups. Sport bike groups and adventure groups. 

I'd love to be in a position to help the cause when these things hit the showrooms but I seriously don't see that happening. 

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 11:35 a.m.

In reply to FSP_ZX2 :

Then you know better than saying the Street 750 is sporty. By Harley or any other measure.  

 

I've been invited to demo the new KTMs. That is more exciting to me than anything in H-D's projected lineup.  And like I said, I truly wish I felt different about it. 

 

Let's put it this way- if these models were being put out by any other major manufacturer, would anyone actually be talking about how much excitement they will generate?

Even the electric bike doesn't do as much for me as I would like it to.  

Xceler8x
Xceler8x UberDork
7/31/18 11:37 a.m.

The bikes are pretty nice. I think they'll be overpriced for what they are but they are nice. Also, a step in the right direction.

I think HD's bigger issue is their dealer network. I started riding in my early 20's and felt that HD dealerships were actively hostile to me as a consumer. Now, I'm in my 40's and have absolutely no desire to step foot in an HD dealership. HD needs to fix the dealership's archaic methods of service and selling motorcycles. I just can't see a younger person walking into an HD dealership, haggling for hours on end on price, and then riding out with a smile on their face. 

 

Oddly enough, I like the electric bike the most. I just wish it was smaller.  

 

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 11:41 a.m.
Cooter said:

In reply to FSP_ZX2 :

Hogwash. 

 

Buell was wholly owned by H-D.  H-D made Erik sell that blasted Blast, which he wanted absolutely nothing to do with. And when the economy tanked, the MoCo killed off Buell "to focus on the Harley Davidson brand"

Thus digging the grave that they are now trying to get at least one of their feet out of. 

There is a bit more to the story than that. Erik took the Sportster-based architecture as far as he could, and then went a different direction with the Rotax based bikes.  The connection to H-D was all but lost.   Yes, the economy tanked at the same time...and that certainly had some influence on the decision.  But at that point Buell was past the point of any real R&D benefit (there was little to no commonality across brands), and while they did not lose money, they didn't make money either.   The best thing for both parties was to cut Erik loose and give him his autonomy back.  That would allow him to run EBR as he wanted.  The deal he later made with Hero is what really screwed him.   

FSP_ZX2
FSP_ZX2 Dork
7/31/18 11:44 a.m.
Xceler8x said:

The bikes are pretty nice. I think they'll be overpriced for what they are but they are nice. Also, a step in the right direction.

I think HD's bigger issue is their dealer network. I started riding in my early 20's and felt that HD dealerships were actively hostile to me as a consumer. Now, I'm in my 40's and have absolutely no desire to step foot in an HD dealership. HD needs to fix the dealership's archaic methods of service and selling motorcycles. I just can't see a younger person walking into an HD dealership, haggling for hours on end on price, and then riding out with a smile on their face. 

 

Oddly enough, I like the electric bike the most. I just wish it was smaller.  

 

I can't speak for what other dealers do, but I make a nice living selling H-D bikes in Milwaukee--many to 20-30 somethings.

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 11:55 a.m.

No confusion here. The Street Rod is a whopping 122 lbs heavier than a FZ-07, over a second slower in the quarter mile, but at least you get to pay $2000 more to buy the Harley. 

This isn't a kids' soccer game where everyone is a winner. H-D has to put out a better product.  They haven't. 

Cooter
Cooter Dork
7/31/18 12:02 p.m.
FSP_ZX2 said:

 I make a nice living selling H-D bikes in Milwaukee

And now this whole thread makes perfect sense. 

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