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Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 8:34 a.m.

Today we head to Hutchinson KS, finishing up our free breakfast and we will head out

 

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 9:08 a.m.

 

Or not....

OHSCrifle
OHSCrifle SuperDork
7/4/19 9:28 a.m.

Another busted stud? Yikes

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 9:30 a.m.
OHSCrifle said:

Another busted stud? Yikes

Yeah, that one is brand new too so there's something off with the rims. Gotta do some research

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 9:34 a.m.

I am safe in the parking lot of our hotel though, it snapped when I was checking them with a tire iron

californiamilleghia
californiamilleghia HalfDork
7/4/19 9:34 a.m.

is this the same problem rotor ?

did you switch rims around or is that the rim that originally failed ?

did they blast the lugs on with an air gun ?

did they go back and loosen them a little and then torque them to spec ?

looks like a clean break , did you hear it snap or ?????

I had the studs break on a new rotor on my Chevy van , less than a month on it !

Good luck

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 9:45 a.m.
californiamilleghia said:

is this the same problem rotor ?

did you switch rims around or is that the rim that originally failed ?

did they blast the lugs on with an air gun ?

did they go back and loosen them a little and then torque them to spec ?

looks like a clean break , did you hear it snap or ?????

I had the studs break on a new rotor on my Chevy van , less than a month on it !

Good luck

Same front axles, I'm not sure if it's the same wheel.

 

It snapped when I was checking them for tightness before we drove

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 10:08 a.m.

Sadly I think we've come down to the fact that this isn't safe to drive such a long distance, I've never snapped a wheel stud and now we are up to 4 in 750 miles.

 

I'm thinking I'm gonna have to have it shipped home now

sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
7/4/19 11:18 a.m.

In reply to Antihero :

yes

Always best to stop and make sure you’re not making a series of small decisions that could lead to a major problem.

llysgennad
llysgennad Reader
7/4/19 11:44 a.m.

That really sucks. I was hoping for a better trip. 

You can put the car in time out at my place if you need to, but you're still quite far away.

Edit: I sent an email with my contact info

NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
7/4/19 11:50 a.m.

That looks like a fatigue failure from where I am sitting. So something is wrong with your wheel to hub fit that is causing this.

 

As a last resort, and assuming the wheels are a common bolt pattern, I would put new wheels on the front.

 

Oddly enough, fatigue failure in wheel studs is mostly blamed on loose fasteners with the wheel then "pounding" the stud at a point in the revolution. A wheel that was not flush to the hub surface would be able to wobble  and cause this effect. It may even be visible if you were to jack up a corner and run the tire looking for  run-out.

 

What seems odd is that you have these forces acting on the studs that are strong enough to break steel, but not apparent as any vibration while driving?

 

Pete

AAZCD
AAZCD HalfDork
7/4/19 12:05 p.m.

Maybe park it with a GRMer for now and rent, borrow, or steal a car to continue the trip. Alternatively there are some cheap flights from SGF that could get you started on the way home or on a continued Journey. You can arrange shipping from home, or regroup and pick it up later.

I could pick it up next week (Wednesday or later) with a trailer and store it with a cover in Northeast Ok. I also have people in El Dorado Springs, Mo that might help out if needed.

 

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 12:35 p.m.
NOHOME said:

That looks like a fatigue failure from where I am sitting. So something is wrong with your wheel to hub fit that is causing this.

 

As a last resort, and assuming the wheels are a common bolt pattern, I would put new wheels on the front.

 

Oddly enough, fatigue failure in wheel studs is mostly blamed on loose fasteners with the wheel then "pounding" the stud at a point in the revolution. A wheel that was not flush to the hub surface would be able to wobble  and cause this effect. It may even be visible if you were to jack up a corner and run the tire looking for  run-out.

 

What seems odd is that you have these forces acting on the studs that are strong enough to break steel, but not apparent as any vibration while driving?

 

Pete

Yeah, exactly. There is zero vibration when driving or pulling or anything. 

 

It's probably the rim fit but what it cones down to now is that it isn't safe without some serious debugging, and even if I buy rims.....I'm not entirely sure what the axles came off yet. It could be an Omni but I think I'm rushing too much on this. Montana is coming up with 80mph roads and I have no real warning before it snaps a stud so shipping it is the smart option. I contacted uship and they have a couple of options.

 

But, we are still gonna rent a car and continue on the trip. I really wanted to finish it with the rampage but I'm not gonna risk my life, and note importantly my wife's life, to make sure I drive the rampage home.

 

I'll get it home and get it sorted out, not on the side of the road, or in a gas station, or in a hotel parking lot etc but in my shop with unlimited time.

 

The car is still a whole hell of a lot of fun, it just has more debugging to do to it before it's ready for such a long trip

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 12:36 p.m.
llysgennad said:

That really sucks. I was hoping for a better trip. 

You can put the car in time out at my place if you need to, but you're still quite far away.

Edit: I sent an email with my contact info

Thank you! I think uship is gonna pick it up here(well montvale I guess)

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 12:38 p.m.
AAZCD said:

Maybe park it with a GRMer for now and rent, borrow, or steal a car to continue the trip. Alternatively there are some cheap flights from SGF that could get you started on the way home or on a continued Journey. You can arrange shipping from home, or regroup and pick it up later.

I could pick it up next week (Wednesday or later) with a trailer and store it with a cover in Northeast Ok. I also have people in El Dorado Springs, Mo that might help out if needed.

 

We are definitely continuing on, the rampage was only part of this trips allure.

 

Thanks for the offer on the storage, I think uship is gonna work(hopefully) but I really do appreciate it

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 1:24 p.m.

Here's another thought while I drink dirty martinis.......

 

They are all snapping behind the disc.....maybe the reason why I'm not feeling vibration is the wheel itself has nothing to do with it. Maybe the disc is moving just a little under braking and it's slowly fatigued the studs until it snaps

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 2:01 p.m.

You can tell me I'm crazy, I've had.....a lot of dirty martinis lol

NOHOME
NOHOME MegaDork
7/4/19 2:14 p.m.

In reply to Antihero :

So the same thing I was thinking about the wheel might be true of the disc: it does not seat flat against the bottom of the studs or the spindle surface itself.

I missed the part where the axles and drive components might not be original to the car?

 

I really hope you can find a smoking gun otherwise it is going to be hard ever getting to trust this car.

 

Pete

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/4/19 2:15 p.m.
NOHOME said:

In reply to Antihero :

So the same thing I was thinking about the wheel might be true of the disc: it does not seat flat against the bottom of the studs or the spindle surface itself.

I missed the part where the axles and drive components might not be original to the car?

 

I really hope you can find a smoking gun otherwise it is going to be hard ever getting to trust this car.

 

Pete

As far as I know this car is about 3 cars in one. The axles are probably from an omni

Stefan
Stefan MegaDork
7/5/19 12:48 a.m.
Antihero said:
NOHOME said:

In reply to Antihero :

So the same thing I was thinking about the wheel might be true of the disc: it does not seat flat against the bottom of the studs or the spindle surface itself.

I missed the part where the axles and drive components might not be original to the car?

 

I really hope you can find a smoking gun otherwise it is going to be hard ever getting to trust this car.

 

Pete

As far as I know this car is about 3 cars in one. The axles are probably from an omni

To get the later model transmission to work in an L-body, you have to use 90 Omni axles.

L-bodies were available in 4x100 and vented discs, on the early 83.5-84 GLH/Shelby Charger.  And 5x100 on the 85-87 GLH/Shelby Charger.

The L-body uprights are different from the K-car units, they’ll physically interchange, but the strut adjustment is different between the two, so you’d have to slot the struts to get things aligned properly.

On the front, the rotors float and it’s really easy to get dirt behind them or to get them a little off if you’re not careful with the calipers or caliper mounting brackets.  A quick test would be to take the wheel off and put lugnuts on to hold the rotor and see if it will seat properly and spin it to make sure there isn’t something wonky there.

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/5/19 5:42 p.m.
Stefan said:
Antihero said:
NOHOME said:

In reply to Antihero :

So the same thing I was thinking about the wheel might be true of the disc: it does not seat flat against the bottom of the studs or the spindle surface itself.

I missed the part where the axles and drive components might not be original to the car?

 

I really hope you can find a smoking gun otherwise it is going to be hard ever getting to trust this car.

 

Pete

As far as I know this car is about 3 cars in one. The axles are probably from an omni

To get the later model transmission to work in an L-body, you have to use 90 Omni axles.

L-bodies were available in 4x100 and vented discs, on the early 83.5-84 GLH/Shelby Charger.  And 5x100 on the 85-87 GLH/Shelby Charger.

The L-body uprights are different from the K-car units, they’ll physically interchange, but the strut adjustment is different between the two, so you’d have to slot the struts to get things aligned properly.

On the front, the rotors float and it’s really easy to get dirt behind them or to get them a little off if you’re not careful with the calipers or caliper mounting brackets.  A quick test would be to take the wheel off and put lugnuts on to hold the rotor and see if it will seat properly and spin it to make sure there isn’t something wonky there.

I'll definitely look at it once the huge thunderstorm passes

chief8one
chief8one Reader
7/5/19 11:40 p.m.

I'm a long time FWD mopar guy and have had 6 seasons of autocrossing on purple crack in my 94 duster v6 5spd and never ever snapped a wheel stud.  I would recommend scoring some factory wheels and continuing  your quest.

Ashyukun (Robert)
Ashyukun (Robert) UberDork
7/6/19 9:28 a.m.

The axles on it now are from a ‘89 Omni. 

Antihero
Antihero SuperDork
7/6/19 11:15 a.m.

So the sun finally came out and i finally pulled the wheel off.

 

The stud that broke is NOT a new one. It's an old one which means that it's not a new problem, it's the same problem and the studs were weakened. There is no damage to the studs at all, no threads we're harmed at all. So you know what that means?

 

IT MEANS RAMPAGE ACROSS AMERICA IS ON ONCE AGAIN!

O Reilly has some studs and I'm gonna replace probably all the old ones. I'm perfectly fine with that outcome, if it was a new stud then I would have shipped it home but now? I'll fix that, guess I should have listened to myself when I say that I should never gave anyone else work on my stuff

JohnInKansas
JohnInKansas SuperDork
7/6/19 11:28 a.m.

In reply to Antihero :

Still dead serious about garage space just west of KC. If you want to check your rotors/axles/studs after a couple hundred miles, you're more than welcome to do so here. Let me know 30 minutes in advance and I'll have a spot cleared for you in the garage.

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