'74 TVR 2500M

   Well, it seems like ages since I posted anything here, and it's mostly because I haven't really done much with the TVR.  I've been concentrating on the TR3 during the autocross season (first place in CCR-SCCA HCS class 3rd consecutive year, thank you very much!) and I'm still doing modifications to that car, but the TVR is still an on-going project. In fact, I just dumped yet another butt-load of money to Richard Good (Goodparts) for his triple Stromberg manifold,  an EGR/catch can system, and more wheel spacers and ARP long wheel studs (for the TR3)   Also spent money with British Parts Northwest for sundry TR parts including three lovely chrome mesh air filters for the TVR.  Naturally I had to test fit the manifolds and yet-to-be-rebuilt carbs, and it does look awesome!

Who doesn't love polished intake manifolds over shiny silver ceramic coated headers?  of course I had to try the new air filters as well, and as you can see I've only got two in place... 

   I've used these filters on several dual-carb engines and never thought of the possibility of them not fitting!  It seems that there is insufficient room for these oval filters.  Sure, I could have just used the usual round K&N units, but they now run about $120 each, vs. $42 for these.  I'm thinking either using a round version of these filters in the middle or seeing if I can modify (i.e. cut and weld) the 3rd filter to mount vertically.  Either will look a bit odd, but short of starting over and going to K&Ns or Goodparts' cool but expensive cold air intake set-up that may be my choice for now.  Thoughts, anyone?  Except Bernard... he would just tell me (again) to "bin" the Zenith-Strombergs and get Webers!

I'm not sure on that price for round K&Ns bought a pair a couple years ago -$80 for both.

edit- just saw the price on Moss- yikes!

It's pricy, but I like Richard Good's cold air intake.  There are other generic air boxes that cost way too much (e.g. Borla).  I spent around $150 to make my own tubular cold air intake.  How hot does it get under a TVR hood?  Given where the exhaust is located, I'd imagine the intake will be sucking in some fairly hot air.  Also, have you considered putting some air horns on there to improve air flow?

That does look nice.

Common baseplate with an oval filter? Somethin' kinda sorta like

https://www.knfilters.com/e-1963-replacement-air-filter ?

I appreciate all of your comments.  Yes, it seems K&N filters have become very pricey!  Yes, I do like the Goodparts cold air intake, and it would solve this problem and provide cooler air, but add even more cost on top of money already spent. As to a common base-plate, I don't have the machining skills nor does K&N make an oval filter long and narrow enough to cover all three carbs.  I had considered "shorty" air horns in the filters... maybe air horns plus three "universal fit" type filters clamped onto them, like motorcycles often use. That could work, then maybe pawn off my new unused filters on another Triumph owner.  Hmmn...

I made these mid length stacks up to fit universal K&Ns to a Sprite. Material is UHMWPE, and it took about 1 hour each to make. PM me for more info if you want me to make three for you.

In reply to TurnerX19 :

I do like what you did there, and appreciate the offer to make some up for me, but the Z-S  carbs use 3 threaded tabs plus additional vents.  More complicated. Also doing some kind of air filters on those would be complicated, or expensive.  They are perfect for an open, race car application.  I'm now thinking more about rotating the filter 45 degrees, as the 3 mount holes seem to be equidistant from the throat.  Might just take drilling a couple more small holes and blocking off one or two others.  I'll grab a gasket and see how well they line up!

In reply to Stu Lasswell :

I think you may find, that when you re-mount the body, the rear-most air cleaner will foul the passenger side footwell. 

Well, here's one option, and it wouldn't take much modification to the back plate after all.  The spacing for the third (upper) mount bolt is the same as the lower pair, so just drilling another hole or two.  Not really liking the look overall, but inside the bodywork I don't think it would stand out as much as it seems to now.  No doubt I'll end up with the GoodParts cold air unit later on anyway.

It seems all my efforts to economize recently have been for naught.  I took my old radiator to a repair shop to get checked out... maybe it's still in usable condition, or easily (cheaply) reconditioned.  No such luck.  Cost me $52 to find out that it would be over $500 to have it rebuilt!  Cheap Chinese ones are on e-bay for $200.  Don't trust them.  Guess I'll be going with the Wizard alloy unit like Scott did.  I'd hate to blow my hot-rod engine up because I cheaped out on the radiator!

The Wizard aluminum radiator can be had with three fans already mounted properly (not zip-tied through the core!), which adds to the price considerably, buy you get what you pay for.  Then I'll have to start looking at the bodywork... again hoping Scott can resolve  his issues so I can learn from his experience! 

Oof. Hate to hear the price on the radiator! 

I don't hate the air filter idea. What about all three vertical to make them match?

In reply to Dusterbd13-michael :

I considered that too, Michael.  I would then be modifying (i.e. "ruining") all three filters, and if I do go to the cold air intake/remote filter set-up I wouldn't be able to recoup some money by reselling the intact pair.  Actually, I may do nothing to any of them until I can get the body on, in case slow_M is right about clearance issues.  No rush there!

You want me to take a couple measurements, Stu?  Might help you make your decisions.

Maybe do all three on a 45?  At least they'd be uniform.

In reply to TVR Scott :

Thanks for the offer, Scott.  I thought about  all three  set at 45 degrees, but that would entail completely re-designing the back plate, whereas 90 degrees involves relatively minor changes.  If the visual aesthetic is the only drawback to the middle one being sideways then I can live with it. Or, as I said, I will most likely "upgrade" to the cold air intake, getting me the visual as well as the performance benefit.  I (and you) have bigger things to worry about in getting our respective projects on the road!

FWIW i have cheap Chinese aluminum radiators in a couple vehicles and they're doing fine, much better than the originals they replaced.  My datsun has the cheapest ebay aluminum radiator i could find in 2015 and it has no issues 6.5 years later 

I just went through similar decision process with my radiator. My use case may be more street focused than yours but a conversation with Bill @ Dominion Spares gave me reassurance that a well functioning stock type radiator will perform adequately in all but the warmest of climates. To that end I am in the process of having mine re-cored at a local shop. Out the door price is $350. To that I will be adding modern electric fans. May be an option for you if you haven't committed to the Wizard piece already.

And if that's the option you talked about being $500 I have a spare stock radiator, I could have them do the same and ship to you. I'm in 14450 so just cover the shipping. 

In reply to ViperT4 :

   I appreciate the offer, and that price does seem better than the shop I hit.  I could probably find a better price in this area somewhere, but this shop was well recommended.  As to Bill, I'm impressed that you've even talked to him.  I have once, but most of my inquiries get no response.  As to his comments about the stock radiator, I had heard that it was "adequate" at best, but better (more) fan was necessary at higher temps.  I'm going to go ahead and go with the lighter and more efficient alloy unit mostly because of 80-90 degree summers, and because of the nature of the tune on this engine.  I've also heard that the later (Taimar?) radiator shroud can make a huge difference... if you can find one!

Stu, have you come up with any pics of the Taimar radiator shroud?  We could potentially duplicate it.  I already have plans for a lot of ducting.

I agree with you on this one.  I don't want my car to be a cranky garage queen that overheats in 10 minutes.  Seems like that cooling is one of the critical ingredients in making a useable classic.

In reply to TVR Scott :

   I've never even seen one.  I've seen mention of them in the TVRCCNA site, probably in some archived members only info.  I think Wadman here in NA designed it, and TVR then copied it for the later Ms and Taimars.  I'll look for the reference, maybe pictures.

   Found it!  TVRNA site, in "Links".  Go to "Taming the Truculent Troll", under "Cooling".  Apparently its a '77 2500M feature, and there are several photos there.  Frankly, it's a shroud to make the stock (cut-down TR6) fan more efficient, so wouldn't help you.  Or me either, as I've eliminated the rather useless stock fan anyway.  Probably designing an efficient shroud to utilize 3 electric fans mounted close to the radiator would be best rather than copying the original.

In reply to Stu Lasswell :

Yeah, that doesn't sound very helpful.

I'm thinking ducting from the grill inlets to the radiator would be more useful.  That would really force the air where it needs go instead of letting it swirl around in the nose and hoping some of it goes thru the radiator.

In reply to TVR Scott :

I agree.  I'm under the impression that post-radiator/fan air doesn't matter.  Forcing as much air, either natural flow or fan-forced, through the radiator is key.

Stu Lasswell said:

Can't you just build three 3/8" aluminum adapter clocking rings to bolt onto the carbs and bolt the air filters onto at a vertical or 45 degree angle so you don't molest anything you don't want to?

In reply to VolvoHeretic :

I'm not sure how that would allow me not to "molest" anything, as the mount holes and vent holes still need to align with the holes in the back of the air filter.  90 degree fitting involves the least modification, as the mount holes are evenly spaced at the 9-, 12-, and 3-o'clock positions, so adding one more plus minor vent-hole changes make it work.  That's looking like my current best-case scenario for now... assuming the one at 90 degrees clears the bonnet!   I may try to sell off  these air filters to fellow Triumph owners (no doubt at a loss) to recoup some of the cost of Goodparts' airbox unit.

Ok, I understand now.