Back home again in Stuttgart - 1985 Porsche 944

Nobody seems to be reading this, but I feel like I should keep it going just for my own records, so here goes.

It's been about a month and a half since my last update, and while I'm still behind schedule, I have accomplished a few things in the meantime. The new bearings are in and the new-to-me oil pan is installed with a new gasket. Hopefully that will take care of the leaks.

I did a few other jobs without taking many pictures, like installing new Meyle engine mounts. I know, I know, the OEM ones are best, but for $35 each, I figure they have to be better than the 33-year-old ones that were in there, and besides, the car will be lucky to see 2000 miles a year, so they should last a good long while. Once that was done, I replaced the crossmember, which wasn't too bad, and aligning the steering shaft was much easier than it was on the BMWs I've owned in the past.

Normally, I'd replace all bushings and other wear items in the suspension while I'm at it, but budget constraints and the fact that new control arms for this thing are $600 each mean that I'm cutting a few corners this time around. There's always time to replace things later. For instance, at some point I'm going to put M030 sways on it, so I'm not going to bother replacing my front sway bar bushings right now. But new tie rod ends are cheap and easy, and while my ball joints seem to be in good shape, the boots were looking a little rough, so I cleaned them up, re-greased them, and put new boots on:


So, the crossmember and suspension are all back on the car, and it's on to the timing belt, balance shaft belt, water pump job.

Setting the car to TDC in cylinder #1 was a bit of a hassle, since the "OT" mark is not visible on my flywheel, there's too much surface rust. However, by looking at the other mark from below, double checking with a dowel in the spark plug, and aligning the mark on the cam with the alignment mark, I'm pretty confident I have it in the right spot:


So, at this point, the belts and rollers are all off, and tonight I'm going to tackle the water pump. For what it's worth, the belts, which were supposedly replaced some time around 2014 or so, look absolutely perfect:

Regardless, they are getting replaced along with the tensioners, rollers, and water pump. So I should be good to go with this engine for a good long time.

I'm following along! One of my criticisms of this forum is that there's no view counter - so there's no way to know if you have loyal readers with not much to say, or if you're being ignored. I choose to believe it's the former on my threads 

As for your belt tension problem, Miatas face a similar problem when power steering is deleted but A/C is retained. There is a tensioner available, but it's pretty hard to find and expensive. I know that people have shimmed the A/C compressor to tension the new shorter belt - is that possible with the way the alternator is mounted on a 944?

I'm reading too!  Any track day plans for the 944 this summer?

As a fellow sufferer, I read all the 944 posts on this board.  The belts are supposed to age out after 5 years (pretty sure it's 5; healthy paranoia on them never hurts), no matter how good they look

monknomo said:

As a fellow sufferer, I read all the 944 posts on this board.  The belts are supposed to age out after 5 years (pretty sure it's 5; healthy paranoia on them never hurts), no matter how good they look

If unknown, then change it imediately, otherwise its about 3-4 years or 45000 miles:

http://www.clarks-garage.com/shop-manual/eng-04.htm

Trust me, I have this thread watched, along with the other 944 threads.  Just because we don't always comment (no reason to clutter up the thread flow with useless posts, IMO), doesn't mean we're not watching and reading.

Keep up the good work!

I'll read yours if you read mine!

Stefan said:

If unknown, then change it imediately, otherwise its about 3-4 years or 45000 miles:

http://www.clarks-garage.com/shop-manual/eng-04.htm

Thanks for the encouraging words, folks. I've always heard that the timing belt rule with 944s is 3 years or 30k miles, but I have my doubts. For one thing, I'm sure the materials in these belts are better than they were 30+ years ago. Regardless, better safe than sorry and all that, and if you have a documented recent belt change in a car's history, it helps the resale value.

Installed the new water pump tonight, which went smoothly. Updated to the new style:

I'm replacing all the coolant hoses while I'm at it. I got a Gates lower radiator hose from Rockauto, and it's almost-but-not-quite long enough to fit. I figure that because it's brand new, it needs a bit of a stretch. So I did this:

The top part is clamped to a hook around one of my ceiling joists, the bottom is clamped to the old water pump, to which I've tied a 5-gallon bucket with a 50-pound bag of sand in it hanging a few inches off the ground. I probably won't get back out there until Saturday, so it ought to have a nice stretch to it by then.

Sometimes, in this hobby, ya gotta improvise! 

In reply to Tom_Spangler :

That is the most hillbilly thing I've seen all day.  Adapt, improvise, overcome!

AngryCorvair said:

In reply to Tom_Spangler :

That is the most hillbilly thing I've seen all day.  Adapt, improvise, overcome!

Thank you! And yes, I'm sure Gunny Highway would approve. 

cmcgregor said:

I'm following along! One of my criticisms of this forum is that there's no view counter - so there's no way to know if you have loyal readers with not much to say, or if you're being ignored. I choose to believe it's the former on my threads 

As for your belt tension problem, Miatas face a similar problem when power steering is deleted but A/C is retained. There is a tensioner available, but it's pretty hard to find and expensive. I know that people have shimmed the A/C compressor to tension the new shorter belt - is that possible with the way the alternator is mounted on a 944?

Agreed. I think my multi-car build thread has like 2000 posts, but most of the time it feels like I'm just talking to myself and 1 or 2 other people who occasionally comment lol. 

Also, I'm folloiwing this since it's relevant to my 924S build of course. Also just watched the Wheeler Dealers episode about the 924 which got me re-motivated.

Also....replacing the speedo cable on these cars is a PITA! Just so you know for future refernce , since I did that today lol

btw I have the Meyle mounts on mine and they're fine. A bit of NVH at stock idle, but totally smooth otherwise. I bumped the idle up to 900-1000 and that got rid of the rumble at stoplights. Just can't justify the cost of the OEM liquid-filled mounts.

irish44j said:

btw I have the Meyle mounts on mine and they're fine. A bit of NVH at stock idle, but totally smooth otherwise. I bumped the idle up to 900-1000 and that got rid of the rumble at stoplights. Just can't justify the cost of the OEM liquid-filled mounts.

That's good to hear. The guys on Rennlist will tell you that your car will shake apart if you use anything but the OEM parts.

Yeah

I hear ya on feeling like you're writing a thread for your own therapeutic benefit.  Can be a lonely world.  So go read and comment on my TVR thread!

I was blown away by your UV oil leak stuff!  That's crazy cool!

And are you going to clean up the rest of the engine to match that new water pump?  That thing is shiny!

USERNAMETAKEN said:

And are you going to clean up the rest of the engine to match that new water pump?  That thing is shiny!

I'd like to. For now I'll just give the under-hood area a bath, but eventually I'd like to clean it up really well, powdercoat the cam cover, etc.

This is the long-term plan for the car:

1. Make it mechanically sound and reliable (hopefully in the end stages of that now)
2. Start driving it, the rest of the steps will happen as it's being driven and enjoyed.
3. Repair the dents and dings and repaint it
4. Minor performance tweaks like a exhaust and a chip
5. Drop it a bit and put M030 sways on it
6. Finish tidying up the interior by replacing things like the door cards and dash

I've always been a fan of the 944.  I test drove one once but didn't buy.

Good luck with your project!

I am a fellow 944 owner on the forum and always read about them, including your thread. I usually only comment when I have something to add. Your project is coming along nicely. Keep up the good work!

Tom_Spangler said:

irish44j said:

btw I have the Meyle mounts on mine and they're fine. A bit of NVH at stock idle, but totally smooth otherwise. I bumped the idle up to 900-1000 and that got rid of the rumble at stoplights. Just can't justify the cost of the OEM liquid-filled mounts.

That's good to hear. The guys on Rennlist will tell you that your car will shake apart if you use anything but the OEM parts.

Yeah, that's what I read too, but my wallet said a little bit of NVH was worth $400 lol. Plus my exhaust is still rubbing on the torque tube tunnel. so I already get a little rumble haha....

Tom_Spangler said:

USERNAMETAKEN said:

And are you going to clean up the rest of the engine to match that new water pump?  That thing is shiny!

I'd like to. For now I'll just give the under-hood area a bath, but eventually I'd like to clean it up really well, powdercoat the cam cover, etc.

This is the long-term plan for the car:

1. Make it mechanically sound and reliable (hopefully in the end stages of that now)
2. Start driving it, the rest of the steps will happen as it's being driven and enjoyed.
3. Repair the dents and dings and repaint it
4. Minor performance tweaks like a exhaust and a chip
5. Drop it a bit and put M030 sways on it
6. Finish tidying up the interior by replacing things like the door cards and dash

Re: dash. There are a couple of overlays out there, but the one I got, installed with much attention and precision, looks damn near stock. Take a look at my thread (it's in there with the e30 rally car stuff in the later pages) for some thoughts/pics. It's like $100 and in truth, even my OCD has no issue with it at all. I often forget it's actually an overlay. Just gotta make sure to get the right one (I think I say what it is on my page) because a few of them fit differently. And make sure to install it the way I did so it FEELS like a solid dash as well.

Edit: though, you have the late interior, so it might be easier for you to find an uncracked used dash than it is for those of us with the early interior.

I haven't done a lot of investigation on the dash, as that's pretty far down the priority list right now, but I have a feeling I'll end up with some kind of cover. After removing the dash in the E30 and never being able to sort out the wiring afterward, I'm gunshy about pulling another one.

Well, my hose stretching trick didn't work, I still couldn't get it to fit. For now I put the OEM one back on, but I''ll probably buy another one before I put the coolant back in.

Started reassembly today. New timing belt is on, but it's a really tight fit. It's tight on the long run between the cam and crank pullies, and loose around the other side where the tensioner and water pump are. That will equal out once I take the flywheel lock off, of course, but then I'm worried that it'll be off a bit. Need to do more research on that. Here's what it looks like now:

Tom_Spangler said:

Well, my hose stretching trick didn't work, I still couldn't get it to fit. For now I put the OEM one back on, but I''ll probably buy another one before I put the coolant back in.

Started reassembly today. New timing belt is on, but it's a really tight fit. It's tight on the long run between the cam and crank pullies, and loose around the other side where the tensioner and water pump are. That will equal out once I take the flywheel lock off, of course, but then I'm worried that it'll be off a bit. Need to do more research on that. Here's what it looks like now:

That’s how most motors are though, right? Do you have a photo that you can use to count teeth on the old belt install? 

Pity the hose stretch technique didn't work, I think we were all rooting for that one.  Where did you get it?  Can you just return it as poor quality /not fitting and get a real one.  Alternatively, what was the ambient in your garage?  Can you block off the outlet of the old waterpump and fill the hose with boiling water and leave it 20 mins then try fitting it?

I was hoping to autocross with you this year, but with my trans issues I think I better treat the car gently for the summer.

My solution to the hose issue was to order a Uro one from RockAuto for $6. The one that didn't fit is a Gates, which was $10. I figured I was getting the "better" part, but I guess not.

Tom_Spangler said:

Well, my hose stretching trick didn't work, I still couldn't get it to fit. For now I put the OEM one back on, but I''ll probably buy another one before I put the coolant back in.

Started reassembly today. New timing belt is on, but it's a really tight fit. It's tight on the long run between the cam and crank pullies, and loose around the other side where the tensioner and water pump are. That will equal out once I take the flywheel lock off, of course, but then I'm worried that it'll be off a bit. Need to do more research on that. Here's what it looks like now:

Pretty normal, tension it so that the long side can be barely twisted 90 degrees.  Pull the flywheel lock and the plugs, spin it over by hand for two revolutions and check the alignment.  Reset the belt if necessary, spin it again until the timing and tension are correct.

The balance shaft belt should be tensioned until it can be twisted to around 110-120 degrees.  Check them both with the tensioning tool, but the twist method is accurate and works, even though everyone freaks out about the belts on these motors.