A-Body Darts?

I still can't believe it, but dad is retiring. He's going to have plenty to do with the farm still, but after a discussion with my step mom, dad has shown some interest in fixing up an old car to "tour" around in. Tour is the term she used allegedly quoting dad, I'm not sure his definition, but I don't suspect were talking pro tourer or anything here. I've wanted to get him his college car for a long time, and my step mom and I have decided it would make an excellent retirement gift. He once had a '73 Dart, that he has often spoken of, and knowing/having met some of his old college cronies they too have fond memories of dad's Dart.

The search has just begun, this conversation/decision just happened a week ago, and is still materializing.

What I know; dad had a 1973 Dodge Sport, it was a light blue with white stripes down the sides, however it didn't have the "hockey stick" stripes that turn up along the C pillar, they were the length of the car. The car had a 340 engine, I've heard dad refer to something specific about the carburetor, but can't recall. The transmission was a 3 speed, floor shift manual, is that right? Dad has mentioned it having hood scoops as well, would this be the black twin scoops I've seen in google image searches?

That's the general info that I've been able to glean from memory, and some very strategically asked questions this past weekend. We spent about 4 hours in a car together, so I "talked cars," and worked in some Dart questions. He's pretty dang smart, and crafty, I can't get too inquisitive or he'll know something's up.

Anyone know enough about these to do something with the info I have, and provide some more specifics? Anything I should specifically be looking for or avoid? Knowing the original color, Sport, 340, etc. any way to know what interior it would have had?

I'm looking for a project, but not a basket case, running, straight body, as little rust as possible, rough around the edges kind of project. If it were the right color to begin with that would be even better. I don't, nor do I expect that he would be concerned about, "numbers matching," authenticity that so many of the Mopards get hung up on, but am I looking for a rare bird/expensive bird? Most Sports seem to have the hockey stick stripes, not the straight ones.

• Lee

Factory Dart Sport (and it's arguably better looking fraternal twin, the Duster) in 1973:

-the 340 package would have had a standard three-speed on the floor, although a four-speed or automatic were both optional and more common.

-the factory scoops (which I think were optional in the 340 package) were the twin scoops you're thinking of.

-As for stripes, I thought the Dart Sport got the C-pillar stripes and the duster had stripes that ran the whole length of the car

-Interior could have been any number of options. Dash could be standard (big rectangular speedometer, round fuel/ammeter/water temp gauges, and and idiot light for oil) or Rallye (three round gauges, left is a big speedometer, right is a quad oil/fuel/water/ammeter, central could be a tach, a clock, a "performance meter" (basically a vacuum gauge), or nothing at all). Seats could be split bench or bucket, might have a console, might not. The 340 package basically didn't include much in the way of interior upgrades, but they're more likely to have fancy interiors than the base car.

Might wanna look here: A bodies only

Now: If you don't give a E36 M3 about authenticity (and if it's gonna be a cruiser, you shouldn't), you can find a non-original Dart Sport/Duster (especially the less popular 73-76 models) made to look like a 340 car for much, much less than an actual factory 340 car.

Couple of other pointers:

-340's are great, but expensive. A nicely built 360 (Magnum or otherwise) will do everything a 340 will do, and no one could tell unless they crunch the numbers on the block.

-Mechanicals are cheap, but trim/sheetmetal/etc. for old Mopars is expensive compared to GM/Ford stuff, and although there are more parts being reproduced than 10 years ago, there are still some things that aren't reproduced. Also, the A-body cars aren't as popular as resto subjects as the B- and E-bodies. The upshot: buy the nicest one you can find as far as trim and options.

In reply to psteav:

Thanks! Sounds like I should find out a little more about the interior, I didn't expect there to be so many options. Dad's color blind, and it was long enough ago that the actual interior color may not matter that much. I need to figure out what gauge/console options it had though.

About the stripe I found this:

7demon2 @ Forabodiesonly.com said: The Dart sport arrived in 1973. It was the replacement for the Demon. The dart sports were made until 1976. The 1973 dart sport 340 were basically demon 340's for 73. The same hood scoop was used again this year. The striping was changed on the hood for the dart sport. The 2 stripes were tightly placed and ran from the windsheild to a point on the hood. The side stripes were the new. These new side stripes would continue to be available through 76. The tail stripes for 73 were fine vertical lines. There was also a new stripe for 73 called the over the top stripe. It ran across the top of the roof down the sides to a point on the front of the car. the scoop on the dart was an option this year. It was only available if you got the blacked out hood stripes.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showpost.php?p=97207&postcount=3

So I guess it would have had the black hood stripes with the scoops, and side stripes like this:

• Lee

As said, the 340 is the factory motor. I have a 73 340 built in the garage only I switched it to internally balanced with the Forged Crank from a 273. The factory setup is a cast externally balanced crankshaft.

That is a key difference. This is more in line with the later 360's. Also, it effects the balance on the torque converter too. If you go with an earlier 318 or 340, you will need to get the right torque converter/Flywheel to match.

If you get a factory /6 or small V8, it may have a 7 1/4 rear in it. Probably it will have a 8 1/4" in it though. Very good rear end that you can convert to Posi-Loc, 3.55, and rear disc with parts from the Grand Cherokee. You can also put an 8.8" rear out of the Explorer with not too much work. (don't say that to mopar die hards though.)

Other than that, what gets you in restoring a mopar is the small stuff. It gets expensive fast. So get the most complete one possible. The 73-76 darts are not expensive at all to buy so look hard and get a good one because the small parts will kill you.

Thermoquad is what he said the carburetor was, I couldn't remember in the original post, but reading about the 340 I came across it, and it clicked. I don't guess that's anything particularly special though from what I've been reading.

• Lee

Thermoquads got a bad rap because they are complicated and they kept adding pollution controls to it which rarely worked good. The first few years were fine though because there was very little of that needed.

They are a really good street carb because if you can stay off the secondaries, you could get some decent mileage. It would have been the smaller primary version. I've got the factory one sitting on my 340 now.

First chance I had to respond all day. Started earlier but got interrupted.

As BMW Rider said, the Thermoquad is an excellent carb. The one on a '73 340 would have been an 800 CFM one. They are all spreadbore. When the secondaries are open under full throttle it sounds like the engine could inhale the whole hood. It's beautiful.

The plastic bowls are out of production but some new ones are still out there. The originals survive pretty well though. As long as the tension is set properly on the secondary air door they work great.

Back to the Dart Sport.

By '73 the Rallye dash was gone. '71 was the last year for it in an A-body.

If the car has factory disk brakes up front they will be 4.5" bolt pattern and probably will have the 8 1/4 rear. The 7 1/4 was used in both small and big bolt and have really weak spider gears. The drum brake cars kept the smaller 4" bolt pattern wheels.

I'm a Mopar die hard and the 8.8 Ford swap seems to be more trouble than it is worth for a cruiser. A Ford 8" from a Maverick is a bolt in.

The Dart Sports are essentially a Duster with Dart front sheetmetal and different taillight. Reproduction quarters, floors, wheel houses, frame rails, and inner front fenders are all available. Reproduction seat covers, headliners, carpets & door panels are too. As are most of the floor shift console parts.

The hood scoop is referred to as the dual snorkel scoop. It was similar to the Duster one, but the base is a little different to fit the Dart hood skin. The blackout would have been a large stripe with some pinstripes around it around the scoop up to the beak on the car.

The stripes that run up the side are referred to as longitudinal stripes. The ones over the roof are usually referred to as C-stripes or just over the roof. Some call them Starsky & Hutch stripes. Usually not Mopar guys.

Since it's a car built in the '70's, and you are in OH, find one from the south-west.

Or August 8-10 take a trip to Columbus for the Mopar Nats

If you feel like taking a longer road trip the Carlisle All Chrysler Nationals is next week. I'll be there.

Wow, I learned something new today. I never would have thought that it was anything but a Demon/Duster. I'm sure I've seen many Dart Sports before and I might have noticed the Dart grill, but I never picked up on the Dart fenders and hood. Very cool.

Was it a Convertriple?

Woody wrote: Wow, I learned something new today. I never would have thought that it was anything but a Demon/Duster. I'm sure I've seen many Dart Sports before and I might have noticed the Dart grill, but I never picked up on the Dart fenders and hood. Very cool.

The Dart Sport was a name change for the Demon. Came out at the same time as the '73 body style / suspension changes.

But did early Demons use Dart fenders and hoods?

When I was growing up in the 70's, it seemed like there were more Darts than Valiants, but way more Dusters than Demons.

Demon was only '71-72. Dodge had a fit over how well the Duster sold for Plymouth and wanted one for their dealers. In trade Plymouth gained the longer wheelbase Dart hardtop body to add to its line. That became the Plymouth Scamp.

Dodge dropped the Demon name plate after pressure from religious groups. Dart Sport was less controversial. A few years later they had a Warlock package on the pickups, but that didn't get protested. Or it outsold protesters. Don't know.

The Demon/Dart Sport was a Duster body shell with the Dart front clip and a different taillight panel & lenses. The Scamp was the Dart body shell with the Valiant/Duster front sheetmetal but kept the '70 Dart rear bumper & taillights.

At the time Dodge wheel arches swept back at the trailing end of the openings. Plymouth's came straight down. If you look at a Demon or Dart Sport you'll notice the front wheel arches sweep back and the rear come straight down. On the Scamp the front fender wheel arches come straight down, but the rear sweep back. It's not as noticeable on the Scamp since the rear wheel openings are lower than the Duster/Demon/Dart Sport.

Woody, I don't know the production numbers off the top of my head, but your observations are probably correct. Plymouth sold a slew of Dusters. The Dodge line was marketed to be a little more upscale than the Plymouth, and the Dart a little more upscale than the Duster/Valiant. There are less Demons left now than Dusters. As a kid I probably saw 5 or more Dusters for every Demon. I see more Demons at the drag strip now than I do at the car shows.

Thanks for all the info fellas!

Currently the only '73 Sport within 400 miles of us:
http://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/4525030098.html

It's had a 318 swapped in at some point, or was there a Sport and a 340 Sport? No hood scoops, wrong color, not a lot of info, or very good pictures, typical for craigslist. Sunroof to me says, "rust," or were they better than your typical sunroof? I don't recall dad ever mentioning his having a sunroof.

Side note, how's the A/C on these, if equipped? R134a conversion on an older system okay, or don't worry about factory A/C and invest in something like a Vintage Air kit? Dad's in Arkansas, it was 97 with a heat index of 103 yesterday, so humid you could "see" the air. I think he'll want A/C.

• Lee

The Dart Sport could be ordered with any engine.

Doesn't look like that one has A/C. My Dart doesn't either, so I can't comment on how well the factory version worked myself.

Started a reply earlier and got interrupted.

The sunroof is fairly rare, but I've seen a few Dusters with them. They were probably done by American Sunroof Corporation. ASC did them in the B&E bodies and probably the C's as well. There's potential for rust from the drain hoses. But parts for the mechanism are very hard to come by. If anything is missing for the sunroof take a pass on the car.

In '73 three engines were available in the Dart Sport. 225 slant six, 318 2bbl, and the 340 4bbl. In '74 the 340 was replaced by the 360. That was the performance model though the end in '76.

I had a '72 Dart with factory air. It was still running R12 and was cold enough to store a side of beef in the car. With everything working it's a good system.

The car in the pic looks like it was a factory air car with pieces missing. The firewall in the engine shot shows the A/C car blower motor and there are a second set of fittings on the firewall for the A/C lines. The upper set of fittings behind the plug wires is for the heater hoses. The set closer to the blower motor are for the A/C lines.

The firewall and whole engine compartment should be body color, not flat black.

Mopar used two different stampings for the A-body firewalls from '67-76. The A/C cars got one like the one in the pics, and the non-A/C cars got a different one. The stamping is shaped different to support the A/C or standard heater box. A non-A/C heater box won't bolt up to the A/C firewall.

If you want A/C in a non-A/C car, go with one of the aftermarket kits. I think Classic Auto Air might have a bolt in kit. Vintage Air has one that looks like the old dealer installed kits that would look at home hanging under the dash.

Oh, another bit of trivia for you. The '73-74 nose (or beak), hood latch support, and grill are different from the '75-76 pieces. A '73-74 grill isn't a bolt in for the '75-76 cars. The other supporting hardware needs to be swapped over too. The '75-76 front bumpers are extended out further than the '73 and have a rubber filler in there with what looks like fish gills molded in it. Looks better than that description sounds. I can't remember if the '74 got the '73 style with the bumper closer to the body, the '75-76 style, or a 1-year only filler. I think it was one year only and a smaller filler than the later cars.

Have had 2 old school mopars now with original r12 systems now converted to R134. The '73 Duster is more than serviceable. The '83 Fifth Avenue (different style compressor) could freeze you out of the car no matter how hot it was outside.

Quickest way to identify a factory A/C car if the ad doesn't have an underhood shot is to look under the dash. A/C cars will have a vent box hanging down underneath with three long rectangular vents.

Also, if you find one with a vinyl top (and a lot of them had one), there can be a lot of rust hiding underneath. When we redid my duster we had to weld new metal in around the windshield channel in a couple different places.

In reply to Rob_Mopar:

The 5:1 Duster to Demon ratio seems about right. At least according to my childhood car observation memories. And it seems that the Dart to Scamp ratio would have been about 3:1.

So, in a nutshell Dusters and Demons don't share the same fenders and hoods? And neither do Darts and Scamps?

This one is about 5 miles from my house and has been for sale for some time...

http://jacksonville.craigslist.org/cto/4510414301.html

There is a very original brown Demon here in town driven by a little old lady. She is the original owner. I think about every car guy in town is waiting at a chance to get that thing.

Talk about close, it's local, in LR too. Not much of a "project" though, it's an automatic, and it's getting on up there in price and hasn't met the reserve yet.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Dart-Sport-1973-dodge-dart-sport-matching-340-motor-and-transmission-/331246978599?forcerrptr=true&hash=item4d1fdbc627&item=331246978599&pt=US_Cars_Trucks

• Lee