Story And Photos By Gary Grant
Anyone who has watched or competed in a single-marque series like Spec Miata or Spec E30 understands the level of excitement they inspire on both sides of the fence. When the starring cars are sporty cult classics like the Miata and 3 Series, it doesn’t take much imag…
Toyota did the same thing with the Echo hatch when it first appeared in Canada, called it the Echo cup.
Good idea, but $20k for that car? That sounds nuts to me.
10K (canadian) plus 10K (canadian) in mods.. sounds like cheap racing to me
I was just talking to a guy who sold an podium e30 for Chumpcar/AER with a spares package for 14k CAD.. < 20k for a new racecar sounds like a good value..
I guess I'm the only one old enough to remember Renault Cup racing. Laps around Road Atlanta timed with an hour glass.
I'm old enough to remember Honda Canada sponsoring the Honda Challenge in the late 70s, with the original Civics, bog stock. It was hilarious racing - tires howling, bump drafting, cornering on 2 or 3 wheels, brakes going away. It was much closer and more intense competition than in many of the 'senior' series, much the way all the iterations of Spec Miata are a couple of generations later.
I don't follow series racing all that closely, but isn't there a Spec Mazda2 series in the US or something? Could have sworn I saw something about that...
What ever happened to the Bspec class ?
I have a friend who raced in the Renault cup.
How do you fit $10k in mods in an econo box class like that?
That class was called Bspec and it died on the vine
Zomby Woof said:How do you fit $10k in mods in an econo box class like that?
probably not hard, tyres, rims, cage, tune, suspension, and prep. This not like how we build a race car, these are basically the same as just writing a cheque
DIY race car build = $1100 Spec E30 donor plus suspension, wheels, tires, cage, seat, etc and doing the work without paying anyone for labor I wound up with between nine and ten grand in the car. So yeah, if you are starting with a ten grand car and paying someone to do just the cage and safety mods you will easily be there.
BSpec isn't dead, but the Pro Series that tried to run them made sure the entry and tire bills from each weekend made you wish you stayed home.
$20k for a brand new racecar isn't bad, when you consider top flight spec miatas are selling in the $30-$40k range.
iceracer said:What ever happened to the Bspec class ?
I have a friend who raced in the Renault cup.
In the Pirelli Cup, there's a class called Touring Car B that is what Bspec was.
I doubt it will last that long, since the cars are not really market supported much- we've even said the Fiesta is being taken out of North America.
And the organization is adding some more classes (and they point out that Alfa Romeo is part of one of these...)
Zomby Woof wrote:How do you fit $10k in mods in an econo box class like that?
I would guess it would break down as such:
Seems pricey that the racing kit doubles the price of the car, but when you think it makes a turn-key car, it doesn't seem nearly as bad.
I love the idea of the series because it also seems to make very close racing. I enjoy when there are a pack of cars dicing for the lead rather than one or two and the rest scattered throughout the field. Given the overall speed, though, seems like the would be must more fun and entertaining on shorter tracks vs. long tracks (like COTA) where corning ability and speed are critical.
-Rob
In reply to rob_lewis :
^^^That’s one reason why crap can racing never made much sense to me.
The cost of race-prepping a car is not that different whether you’re starting with a pristine E30 M3 or a clapped out Tercel. The cost of consumables (tires, brakes) isn’t that different either. And, of course, entry fees, travel, and hotels are the same no matter what.
LanEvo said:In reply to rob_lewis :
^^^That’s one reason why crap can racing never made much sense to me.
The cost of race-prepping a car is not that different whether you’re starting with a pristine E30 M3 or a clapped out Tercel. The cost of consumables (tires, brakes) isn’t that different either. And, of course, entry fees, travel, and hotels are the same no matter what.
Running a few sets of 200TW street tires divided by 4-6 guys is way cheaper than going through at least 1 set of sticker Hoosiers per weekend when you're footing the entire bill.
In reply to LanEvo :
I can almost guarantee you that crap can racing is cheaper than more "serious" racing. Compare apples to apples and look at the cost to run an endurance race weekend in two different series. A Lemons race can be had in a competitive car for $4k-$5k/weekend, split among 4-6 drivers, all in - tires, fuel, entry fees, everything. No way you're running 16-24 hours on track for that much in an E30 M3. Do you have a point of comparison? I've had SCCA guys say similar things - why race crap cans, I can race in my Acura for a similar cost - and they were talking basically sprint races compared to a Lemons race. Minutes of track time compared to hours of track time.
Not to mention the car build itself, for the first event, is usually around $5k. Give or take depending on levels of speed and cheatiness desired, of course. Additional events are just repair / upgrade costs like any series.
I guess I don’t see how the build can be $5k unless you’re fabricating everything yourself. A proper cage from a decent builder will be $5k alone. And it’s not like Recaro, Schroth, FireSense, etc. are giving you discounts for installing their products in a Yugo vs. a Porsche. Safety equipment costs whatever it costs.
More important, I’m not comparing sprint races to enduros. That would obviously be a silly comparison.
If you want to run in a series that restricts costs by making you run street tires, etc. then I’m all for it. But I’d rather start with a chassis I’m more excited about.
I’d totally run my 190E Cosworth or new Triumph TR6 project in a low-budget endurance race ... but those cars cost me $3-4K to buy (not $500-1500). Once you’ve spent the time, money, and/or energy to turn them into race cars, paid for consumables, entry fees, hotels, transportation, etc. etc. the price difference between them and a Yugo is pretty much negligible.
A cage doesn't cost anywhere near that much to have a pro do it, there are other rated safety products that aren't Schroth or FIA rated Recaro's etc.
It's always obvious who has and hasn't priced things out and who is exaggerating for the sake of making a point.
well, as these are meant to be a factory backed series, I am sure they are using top brand gear. better to be safe than to get sued because something that was not A+++ failed. Factory backed stuff also tends to be "flashier" in regards to name brands. Just looking at the stickers on the two cars at the top of this article. I see Perilli, Hawk, FAST, Nismo (of course) and a few others that I cannot make out.
LanEvo said:I guess I don’t see how the build can be $5k unless you’re fabricating everything yourself. A proper cage from a decent builder will be $5k alone. And it’s not like Recaro, Schroth, FireSense, etc. are giving you discounts for installing their products in a Yugo vs. a Porsche. Safety equipment costs whatever it costs.
A Lemons cage runs about $1500-2000 and is the single most expensive part of a build, though many people do install them themselves and a kit costs around $400 from Roll Cage Components. And most people racing Lemons do not use Recaro or Schroth hardware. You see a lot of Kirkey and Racequip stuff. For example, a Racequip SFI camlock 6-point harness is $150.
There have been some 190e Cosworths in Lemons. I imagine they were bargains that then had parts sold off. One won in Alabama the only year I got to run at Barber Motorsports Park. They sure are fast and sound fantastic!
The team I met locally spent 1700 on the cage for their 3rd gen camaro.
They also picked up an already caged miata with hardtop? (non factory) that had a rough body for like 2400 bucks running with a 1.8 swap
It's still not "cheap" 5k weekend divided by 5 drivers = 1k weekend is probably still more than a two day HPDE but it is wheel to wheel real racing
The only people who compete in series like the above are young and rich people who are looking to build careers and get to drive in better/faster series down the line.
lol, I read the title and was gonna say "it's currently being done with the Micra Cup"
z31maniac said:A cage doesn't cost anywhere near that much to have a pro do it, there are other rated safety products that aren't Schroth or FIA rated Recaro's etc.
I paid $4k for my cage and felt it was a good deal considering the number of hours involved. Folks I race with generally have nicer cages than mine ... and paid more for them. From what they tell me, $7-10k is not unheard of.
It's always obvious who has and hasn't priced things out and who is exaggerating for the sake of making a point.
One thing I've always valued about GRM is the collegiality. Your post is more mean-spirited than I would have expected around here.
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