A soul-searching what car thread.

In reply to jr02518 :

Well I'm definitely not a top driver David, but I've probably done around 100 events by now. I just can't seem to click with a Miata. Or at least any NA Miatas I've driven. 

At the Challenge in 2016(?) Mazda had an RF and Mazda 3(both automatics) with some Continental all-season tires on it. Each team got to assign one team member to take one run in each car, and the driver with the fastest combined time for a free set of tires. I think I ended up with fastest time in the RF, but wasn't as fast in the 3 & ended up in 2nd or 3rd place overall. 

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

Replying to a couple more of your comments...

I honestly don't really autocrossing like FWD all that much. There's just no AWD cars that I think wouldn't take fistfuls of cash to make competitive & keep running, yet I've not found any RWD cars that I feel I can consistently drive at the limit. 
 

I checked the Evolution schedule & they don't currently have anything nearby. There's only 3 classes currently listed. The closest is at NCM next weekend, but that's too far on too short of notice. 

Have you ever driven a Mini? You can't get much smaller or lighter. Torquey FWD with options for a decent transmission(stay away from the pudding stick). Cheap tire budget.

Zx2?

In reply to buzzboy :

I've autocrossed a MINI, but never driven a Mini. 

In reply to Antihero (Forum Supporter) :

A BG Escort GT is a car I have fond memories of, but I also remember how bad I hate open-diff FWD cars for autocross. The only FWD car with an LSD I've driven was on a test drive of a Sentra SE-R Spec V. The diff was definitely trying to yank the wheel from your hands. 
 

One car I've had two separate GRMers suggest is the MR Spyder. I've not actually driven any generation of MR2/Spyder, but harder researching 2zz-swapped ones it definitely puts it in the 5-second 0-60 range which I think would be fast enough to be fun. 

I don't know if 8-12k could buy an E36 M3 any more, but I'd try something like that. Torques for ages, but some great driving dynamics and AC with all the fixin's. I don't think the Bugeye WRX is a great autocross car- the shifter is *very* notchy, and the 2.0 doesn't spool quickly- so keeping it lit up is a little tough, and you'd want a transmission that could make that part easy, which it doesn't have.  Other option is any other GTI... just torquey as hell and easy to drive fast, but I have no idea how competitive.

In reply to Teh E36 M3 :

I've never driven an E36 BMW, but I've autoxed an E30 318is once that belongs to a good friend, and briefly owned an E46 330i. I enjoyed driving both cars, but between that friend & another who have been BMW owners for about 30-years, I just don't think I'm up to BMW ownership & maintenance. 

I think maybe I recall you saying that you enjoyed autocrossing a Neon.  I'm thinking do a crazy cheap fast Neon build.  Maybe even drop in a factory turbo engine.  Make your class FTD.

In reply to Stampie :

I did, but that was around 2003-4. Would I enjoy it today? I'm not sure. At the time autocrossing a FWD car was a necessity, not a preference. I definitely got frustrated with inside wheelspin on corner exit plenty of times. 

I'm starting to feel like I either need to commit spending the $$ to build the DSM or some other AWD car(or be committed for thinking about it). Or find someone who can teach me how to drive a Miata fast. 

Pete, sorry to hear about the DSM engine woes.  You are right that car had potential to do well.  I hope it still does.

I have an AWD NA Subaru I beat up on dirt.  I would probably loathe that car on pavement.  WRXs seem fun to drive, but I'm not sure owning one is a great joy either.  They are really quirky cars. 

You liked a Porsche.  Have you ever considered a used Boxster or driven one?  You should.  While they aren't "winning" rides in this day and age they are fun to drive in all sorts of situations including to and from the event.  I've owned 6 or so Miatas myself.  I've always enjoyed them, but the Boxster is just a more fun car with a way better chassis.  It shifts like a truck compared to a Miata though, so there is that. 

You want to have competition at every event.  Have you thought about CAM?  It's a ton of mixed cars all lumped into one class, so you are rarely alone.  You can also do lots of things that you cannot in other classes without ending up in a class by yourself. 

To me autocross is kind of an oddball motorsport.  It's not like spec Miata, spec 944, or a tightly controlled class where you can really compare yourself head to head with others based on times.  It seems like every year there is a new "go to" car and a new "go to" tire if you want to be at the pointy end too.  Chasing time in that kind of scenario is always a drag on the budget.  That's what made me gravitate towards CAM and get the F car.  Sure it'll never be the cool fast car, but I can beat on it and improve it and my skills as a driver. 

Same thing with the Subaru I can wail on it on dirt, and work on the nut behind the wheel instead of worrying about the car.

Get something reliable, with AC that works, that you like in a class with others and wail on it.  Make sure it's all comfortably in the budget too.  And remember in racing spending money on yourself and drive time is often better than throwing money and parts at the car.  Almost every normal person still has potential to improve (I know I do).

Honestly if I wanted a blank sheet of paper to go fast in autocross, I might look for a 3rd gen F body chassis that is straight and rust free.  You can go nuts on them with anything you can dream, and they are cheap and cool now.  They are becoming the new retro cool.  You can add all the HP and suspension you'd ever want to one as well. 

O agree with the dsm. It matches your wants and needs. But pay the man. Do what you can, and what you enjoy, but pay the man for the engine build and install. Gotta be one of us around that will do it right. 

And the neon is WAY more fun than the miata is to autocross. But the miata is way more fun to drive at the limits....

In reply to Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) :

There are 2 options to putting an LSD into a BG chassis with a BP (escort/323/protege of mx3) 

I'd be tempted to suggest a KLZE swapped mx-3, but KL mx-3s aren't fun to work on. 

SR20 motivated B13 cars are fun, most have limited slips and boost has a fairly easy path to add with OE bits (though that goes for BP powered BG chassis cars as well) 

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

I love the concept of CAM, but not the tire budget. I've also not enjoyed the few V8 RWD cars I've autocrossed. It just doesn't feel natural to me. Although I've not seen anyone local in the newer XS class, I really like the concept of it as it's basically CAM type rules for more than domestic RWD cars & trucks. 

I've actually only driven 2 Porsches. The GT2 I mentioned, and I test drove an 85 944. I don't really like or want a convertible, but the idea of a Cayman S seems like it could come close to the GT2 experience on a smaller budget. Unfortunately that car is probably still out of my reach & I know I don't have the budget for Porsche parts & service. 

8th GenCivic SI w/factory LSD

I've had similar feelings for some years now. I enjoy autocross when I get around to it, but not enough to invest a significant amount of my life into it.  That is the main reason I settled on a R53 MINI with a mild STX prep.  In JCW spec, it has a reasonable amount of power.  But when I have the itch to drive something more fun than my minivan and more comfortable than my Spitfire or GT6, the MINI strikes a nice balance.  

EF Civic SI?

I think you're still getting too hung up on the technical details of the car right now. Everything I've read so far makes me think your best enjoyment from autox has more to do with the competitors and competition, and less to do with the driving and the car itself. So rather than trying to pick the car and then find a competition for it, perhaps refocus on picking the competition and then finding a car for it.

Tightening the nut behind the wheel in order to gain more comfort and confidence with RWD driving styles would certainly be one place to start, as it is a good way to open up more options.

Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) said:

So let's talk more about my Miata. It a berkeleying awesome car. It's like putting on the best pair of shoes ever & taking them for a drive. You & the car become one. But at the limit in autox I'm unable to find consistency, or any confidence in what I/the car are doing.

 This has me wondering what you have for suspension on the car. 

That's how I felt about mine before I went with the Goodwin budget Feals.  Now the thing does/reacts how I thought it always should have. 

Did with the RT615s on it, and does even more with the RE71s on it, so it wasn't a matter of upgrading the tires. 

For me, that was the missing ingredient. 

In reply to Driven5 :

That's not really true. If I find the right car, I'm happy to compete against other cars/classes on the index. I used to d that pretty frequently with the Corrado when no one else was in the class that day. 

In reply to OldGray320i :

800# front/650# rear springs on Koni race shocks, ISC upper mounts front & rear, Racing Beat 1-1/8" hollow front bar w/mounting blocks, no rear bar, Bauer lower ball joints, and R-package tie rod ends. The alignment is -4.1* front camber, -3.2* rear, with about 1/8" front toe out and zero toe rear. The height is set about 4-1/4" to the pinch welds  

The car was corner weighted with me in it. It weighs 2150lbs empty with fluids.  
 

The struggle I have is that driven at 95%+ the car is amazing. Those last few percent feel vague & inconsistent to me though. Well, and another 50-100hp would be nice, but that's useless unless/until I can become confident at the ragged edge. 
 

Obviously keeping the Miata is the cheapest & most logical option. But unless I can figure out how to drop significant time in the car I'm not going to enjoy it, and then it'll continue to sit in the garage most of the time. 

It's pretty frustrating when a project seems to come together only to promptly come apart, but what are your options for reviving the DSM? Any good shops offering turn-key crate motors?

Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to Driven5 :

That's not really true. If I find the right car, I'm happy to compete against other cars/classes on the index. I used to d that pretty frequently with the Corrado when no one else was in the class that day. 

You said it yourself: You second season with it wasn't as fun as your first season, when you only had index to find others to compete against, rather than when you were class/FTDI competitive. Every time you describe getting sucked in, it seemed to be the direct competition for 1st place more than the car. Every time you describe getting dejected, it seemed to be the lack there of more than the car. While you had your legitimate car complaints, the way I read it, that too was more about competitiveness. Was a GS Corrado not FWD, open diff, and camber limited? It seems to me that (like most people) you tend to overlook similar car faults that have to be driven around far more when you're class/FTDI competitive than when you're not. Competitive = good and happy. Uncompetitive = crappy and unhappy. 

Which brings me back to my main recommendation: Pick the class, using whatever combination of car types and compeititors that satisfies you, then pick a car that you think you can make yourself competitive in for it... Unless you are actually saying that every other time you have cited a lack of competitiveness for your lack of attendance, it was because there was honestly nobody else there that you could 'compete' against on index?

In reply to Driven5 :

It is human nature to want to be competitive, regardless of the sport or platform. Having no chance for success with given equipment is no fun, also dominating to the point where you're going to win just by showing up even if you put forth a less than solid effort is no fun. 

Unfortunately when it comes to autocrossing the deck is pretty stacked against older vehicles. Newer stuff has wider stock rubber, crisper throttle response now that drive by wire programming has gotten better, and improved speed capability has pushed many platforms down classes. 

The answer can be, if regions have events to provide the opportunity to do so, is to do a mix of event platforms. If you have the ability to autocross, rallycross, hillclimb and to do some solo 1 time trial stuff, and you're mid pack or slightly above mid pack in a platform that isn't built to maximize the rulebook for any one format, then you're going to have a good time, You're not going to get bored, you're not going to overly focus on chasing a season championship in a single discipline and ruin the fun by making it strictly results focused and you're always going to feel a bit like setup is holding you back and that you as a driver have the capability to podium in any one discipline if you were to focus the build solely upon that one. 

The problem is not all regions are areas within the country have the events to provide for such an idealic playground

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

Of course, but there are many ways in which one can find their 'competition'. For some people it is considerably more narrowly defined than it is for others. Internalizing this at the individual level can make or break any endeavor, as it is the source for much of our motivation.

For example, despite his protests to the contrary, it comes across pretty obviously that Pete does not particular enjoy from pitting himself against more obscurely (self) defined 'competition' in autox. Which is why I believe Pete would be well served to plan accordingly and prevent further disappointment in the future.

Those that do not study his-story, are doomed to re-Pete it.