Advice needed: Bait-and-switched, or shame on me for not reading the fine print?

Warning, wall o' text ahead:

I've been looking for new wheels for my Evo X. The size I want looks to be produced by Japanese manufacturers only (Rays, Weds Sport, SSR, Advan, Enkei), and unfortunately have been sold out at most vendors stateside. The estimated lead time for the next batches from Japan are 8-10 weeks.

One of the vendors I spoke to is a company in Canada (lets call them Company A). I have purchased from them before and appear to have a good reputation in the import community. When I spoke to a sales rep last Wednesday, he said Company A had one last set of the wheels I want in the size I want. I wasn't in a position to purchase immediately but I bought them through the website on Thursday. The website had an older color scheme listed so the sales rep changed it to the current color (I was already aware of this) and the order was confirmed and processed by Friday.

Here's where the problem is: Come this Monday, the order page says the wheels are backordered. I was sick as a dog on Monday so I could not call for an explanation. I spoke to the sales rep on Tuesday. He said the wheels were sold sometime before my order fully processed and now they are backordered with an ETA from Japan of 8-10 weeks. I immediately asked for a cancellation, to which the rep replied that when I placed the order I agreed to their terms. I posted them below. I placed the order for these wheels under the impression that they were in stock and that I would be informed if they were sold out. This obviously did not happen.

Who is in the wrong here, me, or Company A? I feel a bit like I've been baited-and-switched here, even with the special order terms below, because I was informed the wheels were in stock when I placed the order. There is no "in-stock" indicator for these wheels on the website. Having to change the color option because the website had an old listing delayed my order further. The sales rep claims he will attempt to cancel with the wheel manufacturer but it may be too late. I am giving him til Friday to get back to me. I would like to have some options to pursue by Monday if I have any.

I'm not ready to names yet. I'm sure some of you have strong Google-fu and can find out the company name quickly. I respectfully ask you not to post any names either. Even though GRM is a relatively small fish in a big digital pond, it doesn't take much to create a tidal wave on teh Intarwebz.

Company A's website said: Some items may not be in stock, or are considered special order. In these instances, we will ship your product as soon as it becomes available... However, there may be times when the product you have ordered is out-of-stock which will delay shipment of your order. We will keep you informed of any products that you have ordered that are out-of-stock and unavailable for immediate shipment. In the instance an item is out of stock and you are not comfortable with the shipping delay prior to processing, the order can be cancelled and we will attempt to work with you to find you an alternative product. Orders that are confirmed and processed are non cancellable, non refundable except for special circumstance.

I commend you for not mentioning the company by name, as that will likely not help your case if a E36 M3 storm were to brew up on teh interwebz. Having said that the whole thing smells rotten and would definitely leave a bad taste in my mouth. I would be calling up my credit card to reverse the charges if it were happening to me, which I have been looking at wheels online lately...

The way I read it, they can stick you if they decide to and be completely inside the terms that you agreed to. OTOH, it's a dick move given the circumstances, and it clearly has an out for special circumstances in the last sentence of the terms. If they value customer service at all, they will work it out for you somehow - If it were me I'd make every effort to refund your money if there wasn't another set of wheels available to make you happy. But, as I read it, they don't HAVE to do it.

Are the b/o wheels the ones you want (as it appears to be)? Or were they of a color that is no longer made? If they are what you want, not sure why you'd want to cancel, but, 'tis your prerogative.

It sounds like they "process" the order when items are in stock and shipping ready. If it's stock out, it appears they hold the order can call you to see what you want to do.

If they process your order and it's now out of stock due to prior sale, it would seem to me that's the same condition as an order received on an out of stock item, and they should back out of the order they processed and give you the option. You cannot control their inventory.

The wording you've listed from their website is vague (i.e. them, not you), but, I'd hang my hat on this:

"In the instance an item is out of stock and you are not comfortable with the shipping delay prior to processing, the order can be cancelled and we will attempt to work with you to find you an alternative product."

"Work with you to find an alternative product" does not indicate they're keeping your money, neither is "the order can be cancelled".

The way I read their terms, they should refund your money if you so desire.

^I'd hang my hat on that too.

But I'd cancel it thru the credit card company and let them have to go on the offensive rather than asking permission to cancel again.

RexSeven wrote: The sales rep claims he will attempt to cancel with the wheel manufacturer but it may be too late.

This is the part that is fishy to me. If they are truly out of stock, Company A should be ordering more from the manufacturer anyway, right? So it would not matter if you canceled, they are making an order to refill their stock anyway. And why would the wheel manufacturer be involved if you placed an order on some wheels they thought they had in stock? Shouldn't they first have found they didn't actually have any in stock and then contact you to confirm the long lead time before they contacted the 'manufacturer'?

To me, it sounds like all the 'companies' that have this wheel available are all probably drop shipping (meaning, they actually carry no wheels "in-stock", and when they get an order they in turn place an order with a warehouse or distributor and have the wheels shipped right to the customer. I assume they cannot cancel the order they placed with their "drop shipper", and therefore if they let you cancel, they are stuck with wheels they do not want. All of these companies probably all order from the same drop-shipper, and your Company A was just the last one to find out that the drop shipper is out of stock.

If the sales rep is telling you the wheels were sold "before your order was fully processed" that sounds ot me like they reneged on their terms. It was in stock when you ordered. It went out of stock. They knew. They processed and confirmed your order (which was placed when item was in stock) anyway.

That is very different from you saying "yep they're out of stock, put in an order for me, here's my money, OH NO WAIT i didn't mean it" which is what they are trying to avoid I assume.

Sounds like the sales guy is playing games. Call your CC company and cancel the charge.

Done and done.

I would call the credit card company for sure. Let them deal with them and not you.

"Company A" is a bunch of dishonest jackasses. Far too common these days. Oh yeah, we have that in stock and can get it out to you today if you order right now. OOOps, sorry we just sold our last set before your order was processed. We'll just hold your money for the next 3 months for you and ship whenever we feel like. Yeah, BITE ME!

Call Forgestar and get a custom set.

I find it hard to believe no one has some EVO wheels in stock, especially when you're talking about these good brands.

Have you checked with Evasive? OAKOS? MACH V? Etc.

More realistically, Here is what I see really happened here.

The wheel place you ordered from probably stocks no or very very few sets of wheels because holding costs for a small business is really expensive and holding slow moving stock is the quickest way to bankrupt a small to medium business. So when you talked to them Wednesday, They looked into their distributor's warehouse and saw 1 set left. This distributor may service up to a third of all Canada depending on territory agreements, etc. Between then and the time you ordered online, one of the many other people that do business with that warehouse bought the wheels you were looking at. The sales guy you worked with has no idea what the other people may be looking at those wheels.

The partner that you ordered from didn't get the inventory update until after you placed the order and when they placed it with the distributor, they got the order kicked back saying they sold out and it's on back order. Now depending on the distributors cancellation policy, they may or may not want to take it up the rear on it and may pass it along to the customer.

Anyways, with that said is there a reason you now don't want the wheels or is it just because you felt deceived? Just wondering.

BTW, I'm not taking a side here. I'm just trying to tell what usually happens from over 15 years of experience in different distribution and channel sales and operations jobs.

EastCoastMojo wrote: I commend you for not mentioning the company by name, as that will likely not help your case if a E36 M3 storm were to brew up on teh interwebz.

IMHO going through social media is the nuclear option in customer disputes, depending on the company. If I were shopping for a kitchen appliance it would be one thing but putting a company on blast that caters to a younger crowd (or even being polite and respectful) risks incurring the wrath of the Fanboy Lynch Mob. I don’t think Company A has a rabid fanbase like that but it’s too easy for someone uninvolved to latch on and raise a E36 M3storm for the lulz.

OldGray320i wrote: Are the b/o wheels the ones you want (as it appears to be)? Or were they of a color that is no longer made? If they are what you want, not sure why you'd want to cancel, but, 'tis your prerogative.

bmw88rider wrote: Anyways, with that said is there a reason you now don't want the wheels or is it just because you felt deceived? Just wondering.

I have been working with a local supplier called Pro-Spec in Quincy, MA and they have been incredibly helpful throughout my wheel search. Unfortunately, they didn’t have the styles I like in the size that I want in stock either. I’ve called around to several other vendors before Company A and they all said “not in stock.” Company A was my last try, and if they had said no in the first place, I would have ordered through Pro-Spec instead of grasping more straws. Frankly, I feel somewhat deceived by Company A which is why I want to cancel the order.

The explanations about drop-shipping and not keeping too much stock on hand make sense. In the case of the sizes I want (18x9.5” or 18x10.5” +25) Pro-Spec and others have said they are popular enough for the Evo X that they are commonly stocked. My timing was bad because everyone is getting their tax returns and splurging on new wheels.

bmw88rider wrote: More realistically, Here is what I see really happened here. The wheel place you ordered from probably stocks no or very very few sets of wheels because holding costs for a small business is really expensive and holding slow moving stock is the quickest way to bankrupt a small to medium business. So when you talked to them Wednesday, They looked into their distributor's warehouse and saw 1 set left. This distributor may service up to a third of all Canada depending on territory agreements, etc. Between then and the time you ordered online, one of the many other people that do business with that warehouse bought the wheels you were looking at. The sales guy you worked with has no idea what the other people may be looking at those wheels. The partner that you ordered from didn't get the inventory update until after you placed the order and when they placed it with the distributor, they got the order kicked back saying they sold out and it's on back order. Now depending on the distributors cancellation policy, they may or may not want to take it up the rear on it and may pass it along to the customer. Anyways, with that said is there a reason you now don't want the wheels or is it just because you felt deceived? Just wondering. BTW, I'm not taking a side here. I'm just trying to tell what usually happens from over 15 years of experience in different distribution and channel sales and operations jobs.

This. When I used to sell stuff as a distributor, and it was an odd, rare, or only 1 item in stock on a long lead, I always quoted "subject to prior sale" and was as clear as I could be about terms. Sometimes somebody else buys it before your order gets processed.

First time it happens to you, it sucks because you have an angry customer, and you look like an arse. Depends on whether or not your salesman has ever had it happen (I suspect not - it only takes once...), or if he's a jerk.

They are probably on the hook for the money (by their terms with the supplier), and if you cancel, they have hold the inventory - no fun if it's a "slow mover".

But, I always honored my word and took care of my customer. You get yelled at by management, but if they're halfway reasonable, they know because it's happened to them too. Treat 'em right, they'll give you another shot, leave them holding the bag, there goes your rep as a distributor - you'll lose them and their friends and associates.

Tell him if he treats you right, you'll post on a board with boatloads of members that actually buy stuff, and they'll have a good rep, get some sales. You'll otherwise tell them "let the buyer beware" and to stick with Tire Rack. (respectfully, of course...)

See if that motivates them.

Hennessy Honda strikes again

Adding a bit of closure to this thread, the wheels have arrived and were mounted up last Thursday.

Nice color!

Secksay!

I'm still tempted to go drive one of these. There is a Mitsu dealer down in Dallas, TX with a ton of them selling them way under MSRP.

Thanks! The wheels are WedsSport SA-15R in 18x10.5, 25ET offset, 21lb. apiece. Tires are BFG g-Force Sport Comp 2 in 265/35R18.