Alfa Romeo 4C to End After 2020

http://www.motortrend.com/news/report-alfa-romeo-4c-will-be-discontinued-by-2020/

Apparently things aren't looking good for the 4C. 309 have been sold in 2016 so far and the peak sales period is over for the year. Not to mention these types of cars sell most early in their production run. It's a shame, as much as the car had flaws, it is the type of car that WE all want to see produced. There's much to love about the car. Doesn't everyone want a beautiful, light car with a carbon fiber monocoque?

It totally makes sense...until you live with it for an extended period of time.

David S. Wallens wrote: It totally makes sense...until you live with it for an extended period of time.

You know its bad when there 600$ a month lease for two years still did not get people in the door to even take a chance. I have been told service on these things from friends who own them is worse and more frequent then there true exotics.

They are thrilling.....in that you expect them to burst into flames at any moment. Seriously, although they are fast and responsive (and some would say beautiful), they feel like they were put together by a 4th grader.

If you like the 4c, go buy a used Elise. It will be as much fun, and they are actually reliable and pretty well built. ( I also think they are better looking-- but that's just me)

So what you guys are saying is the 4c will become the BiTurbo of the 21st Century?

I'm kind of unimpressed with the engine in these, at least on paper. It's not that the power output is bad for a car that light, and they sound pretty good for a 4 cylinder. It's just surprising to me that it takes 22psi to get those power levels. Running that much boost through a 20 year old Honda D series of similar displacement would generate substantially more power.

I know the older stuff had much looser emissions regulations, but every aspect of engine design and technology has improved in the last 20 years too. With everything that we know about cylinder head design, turbo design, fuel systems, etc you'd think it wouldn't take tons of boost to get 237hp out of that mill.

petegossett wrote: So what you guys are saying is the 4c will become the BiTurbo of the 21st Century?

I doubt they will survive even that long. I have been told stories of pulling the whole rear suspension to tighten up the chassis bolts as a yearly or biannual service.

petegossett wrote: So what you guys are saying is the 4c will become the BiTurbo of the 21st Century?

Nah....the 4c is actually a lot of fun to drive, and could be a track monster, so it has some redeeming value. It just seems fragile, and poorly made. I've driven a very nice Bi-Turbo and while pleasant, it wasn't remarkable in any way.

wearymicrobe wrote:

petegossett wrote: So what you guys are saying is the 4c will become the BiTurbo of the 21st Century?

I doubt they will survive even that long. I have been told stories of pulling the whole rear suspension to tighten up the chassis bolts as a yearly or biannual service.

Nobody in Italy has heard of Loctite?

Matt B wrote:

wearymicrobe wrote:

petegossett wrote: So what you guys are saying is the 4c will become the BiTurbo of the 21st Century?

I doubt they will survive even that long. I have been told stories of pulling the whole rear suspension to tighten up the chassis bolts as a yearly or biannual service.

Nobody in Italy has heard of Loctite?

More seriously, I've always wondered if these kinds of problems happen with cars where major chassis sections are only bolted together (the Veyron is the only other production car like this I can think of). You'd think they'd at least use blue loctite and a second locking nut on these things...

GameboyRMH wrote:

Matt B wrote:

wearymicrobe wrote:

petegossett wrote: So what you guys are saying is the 4c will become the BiTurbo of the 21st Century?

I doubt they will survive even that long. I have been told stories of pulling the whole rear suspension to tighten up the chassis bolts as a yearly or biannual service.

Nobody in Italy has heard of Loctite?

More seriously, I've always wondered if these kinds of problems happen with cars where major chassis sections are only bolted together (the Veyron is the only other production car like this I can think of). You'd think they'd *at least* use blue loctite and a second locking nut on these things...

I have been told that they are titanium bolts and catches embedded in the carbon you would think they could do it. Half the stories I hear I would not believe if they were not from people that I trust. Maybe I have a local dealer who is just full of E36 M3 and blowing smoke.

I sort of lost interest in them when I heard that even with a carbon fiber tub they still weighed a couple hundred pounds more than my Miata. That and the ridiculous markups on them when they were new.

With sales as poor as they are, I can't imagine there is much of a sample size to pull owner experience from. I just hope enough were sold so they can deprecate horribly and I can pick one up on the cheap in a couple of years. :)

Seriously though, if there is no market for a flawed but cool sports cars, are there going to be many sports cars on the market in a 5-10 years time?

Edit: Looking on Autotrader in the province of Ontario, there are several NEW 2015 models still for sale at $88-89k CDN (~$68k US). Or you can get a new turbo base Cayman with 300hp for $63k CDN ($48k USD). I recall C&D thought the Cayman with the n/a 2.7L was better than the Cayman. Based on comments above (and the published comments) it sounds like the GRM guys might agree? :) The problem is used Porsches are WAY too expensive. :)

Didn't realize how slow sales were. Now I'm surprised that I've seen one in the wild.

C'mon depreciation!

If I can buy one of these for Biturbo or X1/9 money I'm there. I wonder if part of the slow sales numbers has to do with every car being loaded to the gills with extras that take the price from the low 50's to the high 70's.

Here in Northern Va. outside DC the regular commute is full of late-model or new $50-100k vehicles, and weekends bring out all kinds of exotic stuff. I've seen a number of BMW i8s, among other things.

I have seen ZERO 4c's, which is saying alot in an area where everyone is trying really hard to have a car that nobody has. I imagined that the only reason that nobody here would have one is that they are a lot crappier than they look.

The 4C is the cokehead pornstar girlfriend of the car world.

There's going to be unparalleled excitement and thrills, but also a lot of unexplainable downtime and likely a violent ending that leaves you broke and insane.

irish44j wrote: I have seen ZERO 4c's, which is saying alot in an area where everyone is trying really hard to have a car that nobody has. I imagined that the only reason that nobody here would have one is that they are a lot crappier than they look.

Wow. In the ho-hum burg of Orlando I've seen 2 in the wild so far.

mblommel wrote:

irish44j wrote: I have seen ZERO 4c's, which is saying alot in an area where everyone is trying really hard to have a car that nobody has. I imagined that the only reason that nobody here would have one is that they are a lot crappier than they look.

Wow. In the ho-hum burg of Orlando I've seen 2 in the wild so far.

Could be that people here actually have to sit in traffic in their really nice cars lol...

codrus wrote: I sort of lost interest in them when I heard that even with a carbon fiber tub they still weighed a couple hundred pounds more than my Miata. That and the ridiculous markups on them when they were new.

Yeah, same here. All that fuss about light weight and the ND is lighter. I'd like to see one in person someday, though.

Keith Tanner wrote:

codrus wrote: I sort of lost interest in them when I heard that even with a carbon fiber tub they still weighed a couple hundred pounds more than my Miata. That and the ridiculous markups on them when they were new.

Yeah, same here. All that fuss about light weight and the ND is lighter. I'd like to see one in person someday, though.

They had 3 at the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/RAM/Fiat/Alfa (whew!) dealer I visited last weekend to check out the Fiata; two spyders and a coupe. The coupe was sitting right next to the Fiata out front. Wow, what a car (the 4C that is). Just amazing to look at with true exotic car proportions. Comparing the two side-by-side made the Fiata look about as sporty as a shopping cart.

I have to admit my interest in the 4C also took a nosedive after I found out it was heavier than the ND. It's really too bad. If they were able to sell it at the euro curb weight for around $40K I think they would have a lot more takers.

Ann Arbor dealer had 6 of them a couple of weeks ago, all discounted at least $10K.

I've seen 1in the wild, same as my i8 sighting.

I read threads at what must be the only 4C forum and it was mostly very, very, very bad news on the reliability front.

mblommel wrote: They had 3 at the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/RAM/Fiat/Alfa (whew!) dealer I visited last weekend to check out the Fiata; two spyders and a coupe. The coupe was sitting right next to the Fiata out front. Wow, what a car (the 4C that is). Just amazing to look at with true exotic car proportions. Comparing the two side-by-side made the Fiata look about as sporty as a shopping cart.

To be fair, the Fiata is not the exotic of the pair But yeah, I get that. The Alfa has a lot more drama, it's a baby supercar in the looks department.

I, too, have seen one i8 in the wild. But no Alfa. Not even at the Mitty, and it usually has everything sub-exotic.