Like the title suggests: I can't believe a Prius cannot be hacked like seemingly everything else out there.
This really bothers me for some strange reason.
Like the title suggests: I can't believe a Prius cannot be hacked like seemingly everything else out there.
This really bothers me for some strange reason.
I guess the question is, what would you want to hack it to do? You can spoof a key fob on just about anything these days but the root vehicle systems are pretty heavily encrypted.
For an enthusiast example the OBDII Toyota 2JZ-GE engines came out over 20 years ago and ECU encryption STILL hasn't been broken on those. And I guarantee you a lot more people want 2JZ-GE ECU tuning capabilities than Prius tuning capabilities...the only solution is a piggyback add-on. Likewise with the newer Hondas, Hondata has to add in a separate board to have any control, the stock ECU is locked down tight, the ability to do a reflash has disappeared.
So if someone really wanted to they could probably gain some control with a piggyback add-on but the market for that is just about near zero...
My basic understanding of the issue with majorly increasing the power of a Prius or any hybrid that uses a similar transmission setup is that you are using both the ICE and an electric motor as separate inputs to a planetary gearset. In order to get the proper gear ratio out of this e-cvt arrangement, you have to control the 'torque/speed bias' between those two inputs. Because of this, you can't increase engine torque to the point that it would overpower and slow down the electric motor, or you'd lose 'ratio control'. You also couldn't make the electric motor powerful enough to slow down the ICE for the same reason. That's my understanding of why it's more difficult than it's worth.
The early Honda system is far simpler and is hacked to a large degree. Thus my desire to build a hot rodded original Accord Hybrid. On the other hand, you CAN simply buy a fast hybrid. My Gs450h was very nearly as fast as my 911. The 911 would inch away from it on the highway. The 911 also got much worse MPG even though it was 1000+lbs lighter and didn't have a luxurious back seat. If all you're trying to do is go fast in a straight line I would go drive one of the fast ones and see if you like it. The infiniti M37 hybrid was slightly faster (but in my opinion worse in every other way).
pointofdeparture said:the ability to do a reflash has disappeared.
So if someone really wanted to they could probably gain some control with a piggyback add-on but the market for that is just about near zero...
Not really. You're seeing more piggyback options again (like back in the 90s/early 2000s), because there isn't a way to flash the stock ECU without activating the "flash counter" in the new ECUs..........which essentially will void any powertrain related warranty claims.
Using a piggyback, if you create an issue with a high power tune, those without scruples can simply unplug the piggyback unit, take the car back to stock and the dealership won't know the reason the trans is slipping or the headgasket is blown is because someone used a piggyback to double the stock boost or something.
What do you want to hack? The biggest effort has been to make EV mode not require the engine to run, make plug-in EVs.
I hack the security chip to add key IDs.
I thought the old Top Gear had one out on the track with a tuned ICE , burned runner , made lots of noise , just what the ricers would want !
z31maniac said:pointofdeparture said:the ability to do a reflash has disappeared.
So if someone really wanted to they could probably gain some control with a piggyback add-on but the market for that is just about near zero...
Not really. You're seeing more piggyback options again (like back in the 90s/early 2000s), because there isn't a way to flash the stock ECU without activating the "flash counter" in the new ECUs..........which essentially will void any powertrain related warranty claims.
Using a piggyback, if you create an issue with a high power tune, those without scruples can simply unplug the piggyback unit, take the car back to stock and the dealership won't know the reason the trans is slipping or the headgasket is blown is because someone used a piggyback to double the stock boost or something.
FWIW I was referring to the market for a Prius piggyback, not piggybacks in general which obviously are well-liked.
If i say 'whoosh' right here is that offensive?
It would be more of a "let's hack a self driving Tesla, and do all sorts of maniacal things".
if there's one thing Elongated Muskrat has taught us- it's that his company can easily have its pants pulled down.
nimblemotorsports said:What do you want to hack?
I really don't know truthfully. I'm a performance person. I'd want it to be able to do long, smokey burnouts at the very least.
_ said:It would be more of a "let's hack a self driving Tesla, and do all sorts of maniacal things".
if there's one thing Elongated Muskrat has taught us- it's that his company can easily have its pants pulled down.
I can't wait for the day where someone figures out a way to put the front motor in drive and the rear motor in reverse
ebonyandivory said:nimblemotorsports said:What do you want to hack?
I really don't know truthfully. I'm a performance person. I'd want it to be able to do long, smokey burnouts at the very least.
Peddle dance will get burnouts out of a prius. Its a start. If you put a really stiff rear bar and some sticky tires on one, they really come alive. My old winterbeater one handled awesome. It would lift throttle oversteer. Dont forget that toyota swapped a yaris motor in one to break the speed record so all the talk of ice improvements being for naught might be inaccurate.
Turbocharged Prius
Another guy has increased motor amps by hacking the current sensor in the Inverter.
A shop in my area put an LS in a Prius. Wait, that's not the kind of hack you're talking about, is it?
nimblemotorsports said:Another guy has increased motor amps by hacking the current sensor in the Inverter.
Is that the EV equivalent of a fuel cut defensor? Or a Ford "upgrade" MAF with dials on it to adjust the airflow readout?
Holy crap it's the 80s again. Too bad there are no convenient 1/4-DIN pockets for piggyback units with more knobs and switches than a typical stereo equalizer.
Rocambolesque said:_ said:It would be more of a "let's hack a self driving Tesla, and do all sorts of maniacal things".
if there's one thing Elongated Muskrat has taught us- it's that his company can easily have its pants pulled down.I can't wait for the day where someone figures out a way to put the front motor in drive and the rear motor in reverse
reversed polarity?
Carbon said:ebonyandivory said:nimblemotorsports said:What do you want to hack?
I really don't know truthfully. I'm a performance person. I'd want it to be able to do long, smokey burnouts at the very least.
Peddle dance will get burnouts out of a prius. Its a start. If you put a really stiff rear bar and some sticky tires on one, they really come alive. My old winterbeater one handled awesome. It would lift throttle oversteer. Dont forget that toyota swapped a yaris motor in one to break the speed record so all the talk of ice improvements being for naught might be inaccurate.
Now we're talking! I've been led to believe that they're are truly awful to drive for people like us. I can't stop picturing embarrassing someone in "faster" car in a Prius either in cornering or acceleration. Doing it without a Master's Degree or maxing out the credit card would be an added bonus.
A Challenge Prius would be the coolest!
In reply to ebonyandivory :
Driving a Prius is something that a gearhead will instantly get mesmerized by. You think you're happy with have a tach and oil pressure gauge, maaaybe an oil temp gauge? Priuses have current gauges, that tell you how much of your tractive force is from the engine and how much from the motors, and they have a brake force gauge that tells you how much you're regenerating when braking.
One finds oneself finding just the right braking point to maximize regeneration without the friction brakes coming online. And when you do that, the motors whine like a little supercharger! It's difficult to brake that hard in traffic, though.
A lot of other hybrids don't have this, and thus are nowhere near as entertaining to drive.
In reply to Knurled. :
I almost want to believe this is a joke (because I've heard so much negativity directed at them). But I'll admit, you have me intrigued
The Smoking Tire, or at least Matt Farrah had a slightly modded Prius in a video and I was hopeful but boy was that video a flop.
He's right. My wife and I commute in a 2013 plug in Prius and my driving habits have changed in that car a bit to maximize the regenerative braking. For a slow boring car, it can be fun. Plus, heated seats and a nice stereo and regular creature comforts and all, but especially with the plug in model I find myself seeing what kind of crazy mpg I can get on our morning commute. So far my best is 102mpg, and that's over a 10 mile commute, half highway doing 65, half stop and go city traffic. With the heavy battery down low, they also handle surprisingly well. That car has almost zero body roll, and I have definitely gone around a few corners a bit too fast just to see what it would do. Just flat handling. Also from a stop I have spun the tires a few times. Hehehe.
In reply to infinitenexus :
Why, oh why have I heard literally NOTHING like this ANYWHERE before? And although I keep forgetting this fact, I actually put several hundred miles on a worn out first gen, state-owned Prius and as much of a POS that became, I never really felt the negativity. Mind you, I drive full size GM trucks so I don't have a ton of expensive to draw from.
It'll definitely be the polar opposite of a full sized truck, that's for certain. But personally, I find the Prius to be the perfect appliance car. If there was a way to bump it up to 200hp, it would be a blast indeed, especially being so aerodynamic with that handling.
I've heard off-hand that the Gen3 Prius and later Avalon/Camry hybrids can put more power from the ICE to use.
I'm interested in this slightly... because I think it would be hilarious to take a sorted Gen3 with a 75shot to OneLap... assuming the 75shot will actually be turned into increased acceleration.
I saw a video of a guy that put nitrous on his prius. Basically as a joke. The second he hits it all you hear is a pop and the engine is dead.
Now if there was a way to replace the prius motor with a more "traditional" 4 cylinder while retaining the hybrid drivetrain, that could be fun.
In reply to infinitenexus :
That's hoovie, right? Which is a Gen2. Although, yes... Atkinson cycle might inherently have some trouble with Nitrous?
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