Am I seriously thinking about this? (GTI)

I've had an itch for a hot hatch over the last couple years. And since most of the cool ones I would like didn't make it over here it seems all that's left is the GTI. I know these things have a pretty big following but VAG scares the crap out of me.

The goal would be a fun way to get back and forth to work. The E21 will handle my fun toy duties.

Am I letting internet lore and preconceived notions keep me from experiencing a cool car? Or is living with one going to be a huge headache?

What years should I be looking at? Avoid VR6 or get it just for the sound?

What about a Jetta GLI if I decide I need a sedan instead?

Yes. :)

I've got a 1.8T and it's been pretty darned reliable, but it can be a PITA when it does break. Bought it new. Now has 208K. Radiator replacement:

In reply to tpwalsh:

In reply to nicksta43:

Ya, about 3 weeks later I replaced the radiator in my miata. Took less than an hour. Cursed VW during both rad. repalcements. :)

Sorry, I don't know much about VWs except the MkIV 1.8T's. Great motor, great interior, AWESOME highway bomber, but a little porky to be a corner carver, even if it's suspension is quite taut. The 1.8T if taken care of (mobil 1 every 5K) is reliable and has torque for days. (180ft-lbs at less than 2K RPMs)

In reply to tpwalsh:

So you know about the 1.8T? My brother's got one ('02, I think) that's had some issues stalling at high rpm's. I'll have him PM you.

I haven't got much of anything to add, except that parts are pricey. Coil packs crap out regularly (at least, they have for Steuart). As tpwalsh said, car feels great at speed, but does feel a bit lardy on the autocross course.

In reply to tpwalsh:

Heh... reminds me of some of the service tasks for a MINI.

Generally, I agree. VW's get a bad rap and sometimes it's justified, but often troubles can be traced back to poor maintenance. These cars do NOT respond well to "appliance treament". Some repair tasks are a PITA, but that can be said for most modern cars these days.

John, Did he get the recall done on the coilpacks? I've been through about 12 of them in 200K. Got a recall notice on the coils a couple years ago. Had it done, and hadn't had a hicup since. (knocks on wood)

I hadn't encountered a stalling at high speed issue. Got a VAG-COM? It's invaluable for these cars.

OP, what years/generations are you considering? GTI's have been around since '83, and I'd say there's plenty of other hot hatches out there as well.

Budget? etc.

I think the same thing. I need some utility, and a 5-Door GTI would be nice, but there is a boy-racer image that I don't want. I really need a BMW 3-Series, but can afford a VW.

Are you looking at new or used? If you are in the new market don't rule out the Abarth, it's pretty much the definition of hot hatch.

I'm afraid I have nothing good to say when it comes to watercooled VWs and VAG products in general.

Yup, need an age and price point. I'm not sure where you get the no cool hot hatches over here. What about:
Focus SVT
Escort GT
Mini Cooper and S
Saab 900
Omni GHL and GHLS
Daytona
Celica GT
etc

Adrian_Thompson wrote: Yup, need an age and price point. I'm not sure where you get the no cool hot hatches over here. What about: Focus SVT Escort GT Mini Cooper and S Saab 900 Omni GHL and GHLS Daytona Celica GT etc

Plus Civic Si, Matrix XRS, Cobalt SS.

Don't let the pic above scare you. The whole nose comes off with six bolts in about 30 minutes. But yeah, give us a year range and/or price range and I can probably help guide you on what to look for and what to avoid.

In reply to 16vCorey:

YEP! And you don't have to worry about bumper alignment much either. It slips into some tabs on either side to align it correctly.

Doesn't mean it was WAY more work than it had to be though. Once you got past the "I have to remove the grill, bumper AND core support!" moment, it wasn't bad.

I've been intriguied by GTis for a project car as well. Mainly the cubed mid to late 90s versions I guess MkIII? But Civic hatches from same range are hard to beat but, I've yet to tool around with a Jerry sled. I'm afraid it would turn into a cursing match with the car and I. The same goes for the E30s I've been looking at.

There's a nice Sirocco for sale nearby .....

Um, hello Mazdaspeed3.... pretty much the reigning king of hot hatches stateside...... Also, Focus ST if you want to spend new car coin.

tpwalsh wrote: Radiator replacement:

Not directed toward the poster, but to VAG:

HOW IS THIS OKAY? Great flibbety jibbety, I must be going Luddite; that is a totally uncool amount of disassembly to replace a radiator. Sorry; /rant off. Hats off to all of you with the stones and patience for this. /Respect.

pinchvalve wrote: I really need a BMW 3-Series, but can afford a VW.

bmw 318TIs are not all that expensive

In reply to mndsm:

Because the OP mentions the VR6 and also the Jetta GLI, I'm pretty sure he means a Mk IV (99.5-04).

I'd only chose a 1.8T version unless the VR6 happens to be an R32 version. The R32 would be the only way I'd consider putting myself through VR6 hell again... my god, how I hated that engine (past '93 Passat GLX VR6)...

I think it depends some on what one wants and budget. Personally, any new car I'm looking at to replace my current TDI needs to have auto-x in mind (since the TDI is so NOT an auto-x car...). Because of that, the MS3 is out (holy tire wear Batman!) . I like the GTI (Mk IV) simply because I love the Mk IV interior and it can make for a fun DSP car. Of course, there is also the MINI, which I know extremely well. A Focus SVT would be considered as well.

Because of my history with MINI's, I'd probably look for a used JCW Clubman and prep it for STX. Nothing I've read about the MS3 really makes me want one.

conesare2seconds wrote: Not directed toward the poster, but to VAG: HOW IS THIS OKAY? Great flibbety jibbety, I must be going Luddite; that is a totally uncool amount of disassembly to replace a radiator. Sorry; /rant off. Hats off to all of you with the stones and patience for this. /Respect.

Seriously, it's 6 bolts and 20-30 minutes. I know it looks much worse than that, but really, it's not. Another trick is to put two longer bolts where the core support bolts to the frame rails and just slide it out away from the engine without completely removing it.

16vCorey wrote: Seriously, it's 6 bolts and 20-30 minutes. I know it looks much worse than that, but really, it's not. Another trick is to put two longer bolts where the core support bolts to the frame rails and just slide it out away from the engine without completely removing it.

Pretty much the same with MINI's. The service manual refers to this as placing the MFE (Modular Front End) Panel into the "service" position. Done to gain additional access to various engine bits and for dropping the transmission. I made and sold a bunch of home made versions of the special MINI tool to support the panel.

93EXCivic wrote:

Adrian_Thompson wrote: Yup, need an age and price point. I'm not sure where you get the no cool hot hatches over here. What about: Focus SVT Escort GT Mini Cooper and S Saab 900 Omni GHL and GHLS Daytona Celica GT etc

Plus Civic Si, Matrix XRS, Cobalt SS.

I'm on a strictly no Ford diet since birth, some prejudices you just can't get over.

After much initial enthusiasm for the Cooper S my admiration has waned to the point they don't even turn my head any more.

While I like the Saab 900 and will own one someday it's too big and in my mind it's a liftback coupe not a hatch.

At the risk of upsetting some people around here whom I respect, 1980's Dodge products = POS

Celica, Cobalt SS = liftback coupes in my mind not hatches.

Civic; See Ford above.

Speed 3 and Matrix = too many doors.

I'm a redneck with a thing for European cars, I guess I should have said cool Euro hot hatches. Think Peugeot 205 GTI.

Anyway the most I would go would be around 8k for a perfect car. Generally with me the older they are the more I like them however I realize there are some intangibles that come along with newer cars.

If I had the scratch a dozen horses couldn't drag me away from the Fiat dealer.

Ian F wrote: In reply to mndsm: Because the OP mentions the VR6 and also the Jetta GLI, I'm pretty sure he means a Mk IV (99.5-04). I'd only chose a 1.8T version unless the VR6 happens to be an R32 version. The R32 would be the only way I'd consider putting myself through VR6 hell again... my god, how I hated that engine (past '93 Passat GLX VR6)... I think it depends some on what one wants and budget. Personally, any new car I'm looking at to replace my current TDI needs to have auto-x in mind (since the TDI is so NOT an auto-x car...). Because of that, the MS3 is out (holy tire wear Batman!) . I like the GTI (Mk IV) simply because I love the Mk IV interior and it can make for a fun DSP car. Of course, there is also the MINI, which I know extremely well. A Focus SVT would be considered as well. Because of my history with MINI's, I'd probably look for a used JCW Clubman and prep it for STX. Nothing I've read about the MS3 really makes me want one.

I park my Cooper S right next to my MS3. I love the ability of the S to dance- the ms3 is CLEARLY a sledgehammer in a jewelers kit... It's threatened to kill me before (helloooooo snap oversteer) and that's what I like about it. Plus, I have 4 doors and a car seat in it. My mini-me has to be loaded through the hatch in the MINI. I have no real bias against VW's.... but i've had a pile of friends have nothing but problems with them... one guy in particular with a MKIV 1.8t.... that car hasn't been not broken since he purchased it. It still runs and drives, but it isn't always pretty. Plus those goddamn door locks of doom that like to pinch my arm skin all to E36 M3 if I have an arm on the sill and the car locks at speed, like German cars are wont to do.

Ian F wrote: Because the OP mentions the VR6 and also the Jetta GLI, I'm pretty sure he means a Mk IV (99.5-04).

http://asheville.craigslist.org/cto/3599339334.html They made older GLI as well.

Actually I'm thinking along the same years as Per's most recent Golf. I can't really remember for sure but I think it was a '96? Anyway I saw a VR6 in that body style in very nice condition the other day. I just don't know enough about them.