An interesting look back at the 959

Saw this and thought it was interesting. I learned a couple things. 

 

Very cool.  Thanks for sharing!  I need to watch Vinwiki more.  It's one of the better car channels and rarely is it annoying.  There are so many annoying ones that are popular. 

The ultimate Radwood car......  true.  I would put the Ferrari 288 GTO there as well.  Honestly if I ever had stupid money, these are the two I would want. 

I cane here to post that link. That was very interesting 

Interesting, indeed.  Having seen some of these stories about cars I worked on, some of it may be a stretch, but it would be just some details.

BTW, the idea that the government is full of car haters is BS.  I know that there are quite a few car enthusiasts that work at the EPA- some of them regularly went to local autocrosses and track days, while others were drag racers.  Heck, there was even a suggestion that a Challenge car have an EPA sticker on it- but that idea was squashed as a pretty bad idea.

Back to the 959- that was one of my last car models I made back in the late 80s.  I did fully buy into the Group B rally car for this and the 288- and looking back using the info presented- I really have no idea why I thought that was the only reason now.  Both Porsche and Ferrari were so huge into road racing that it just makes more sense that their Group B cars were made for circuit racing.  It's interesting that Group B road racing never made any real headlines like the Rallying did.  And really too bad- that would have been some amazing racing to see.  Especially since some of the rally cars would have rocked on the race track, like the Ford RS200.

Great video

I found VINwiki a while back and really dug into their videos and then, just stopped. Not anything 'wrong' with them,but just sort of lost interest. Maybe it was a few videos in particular which pushed me away (gumball, for example). But this was a good one with some awesome information on this legendary car. 

I remember, as a kid, hearing they werent here because they were 'too fast' for the American roads. Funny how rumors start, even in the pre-internet days

I remember seeing the stats that the 959 hit 60 in under 4 seconds and thought that no car could ever beat that forever. Now I can beat that in a stock Jeep SUV.  

I loved the cutaway display  959 that was at Frankfurt Auto show....

and if you find the picture in an old Road and Track , they reversed the negative and made it right hand drive ,

I just happened to be at the show on Press Day :)

He is watchable, mostly because of how into it he is.

I didn't understand the certification part, whom did Porsche have a contract with? Why was it null and void? If they were paying a 3rd party to certify the 959, why not keep working on it until it passed? If they were working with the DOT, again, find out why it didnt pass and fix it. I don't understand why a contract kept the 959 from such a lucrative market. 

hybridmomentspass said:

I found VINwiki  a while back and really dug into their videos and then, just stopped.

There are a couple of people on there that I really like - this guy (John Ficcara), Bill Warner (founder of Amelia Island concours), and Pamela Yates.  The rest were semi-interesting early on, but as the channel grew the level of pomposity seemed to grow even faster. 

Ficcara's vid about the Whittington brothers and IMSA is great.  

pinchvalve (Forum Supporter) said:

I don't understand why a contract kept the 959 from such a lucrative market. 

Porsche lost money on every 959 it sold.  If you watch again, he said that because the DeutscheMark tanked against the dollar, US sales were going to result in them losing even more money, so they used the contract thing as an excuse to avoid said hemorhaging of cash. Interesting theory.  

NorseDave said:

pinchvalve (Forum Supporter) said:

I don't understand why a contract kept the 959 from such a lucrative market. 

Porsche lost money on every 959 it sold.  If you watch again, he said that because the DeutscheMark tanked against the dollar, US sales were going to result in them losing even more money, so they used the contract thing as an excuse to avoid said hemorhaging of cash. Interesting theory.  

Yea- so if the wiki is right on the sales price- the 431k DM in 1987 translates to $225k, which is about the Jan '87 exchange rate of 1.91.  By the end of the year, the exchange rate was just 1.62, so the same $225k was only 346k DM- almost a 100kDM drop just from the exchange rate.  And it went down a little more all the way to the end of production in 1994 (except for 1989, where it went up).

Plus, his point that agencies are not the ones doing the testing is right, too.  That's on the OEM to either do it themselves or find a third party to do it for them.

So the theory has some good bones.  

NorseDave said:

hybridmomentspass said:

I found VINwiki  a while back and really dug into their videos and then, just stopped.

There are a couple of people on there that I really like - this guy (John Ficcara), Bill Warner (founder of Amelia Island concours), and Pamela Yates.  The rest were semi-interesting early on, but as the channel grew the level of pomposity seemed to grow even faster. 

Ficcara's vid about the Whittington brothers and IMSA is great.  

I like the term "level of pomposity" because it describes most of those guys very well. Ficcara is honestly one of those as well and he loves hearing himself talk but his info is top notch so I watch him.

My contribution to this thread, belongs to RL (Polo):

Thanks for sharing. I got hooked on cars at about 7 or 8. My grandfather gave me a R&T special issue on Porsche, and it had the 959 in it. It's my favorite car of all time!

I was cruising down a road fiddling with my GPS on a bike and a red 959 blew by me in a passing zone. I damn near fell off the bike. Chased him for a little bit but he was getting after it, and I was having a hard time keeping up on a KTM 950 on knobbies. Somewhere on twisty roads outside Telluride, CO. One of those moments where you feel like you are living a dream.

I saw it parked on the street the next day...what an amazing machine. Note the license plate...my friend taking the picture was trying to be artistic; pardon the angle. I think this might be the only picture I have of myself with someone else's car. I was geeking out HARD.

Oh man. You made me remember my favorite 959 video.

NorseDave said:

pinchvalve (Forum Supporter) said:

I don't understand why a contract kept the 959 from such a lucrative market. 

Porsche lost money on every 959 it sold.  If you watch again, he said that because the DeutscheMark tanked against the dollar, US sales were going to result in them losing even more money, so they used the contract thing as an excuse to avoid said hemorhaging of cash. Interesting theory.  

I think all manufacturers lost money on their homologation specials, especially Group B.

I recall that Ford had a fire sale on all the RS200s that they could no longer sell. $60k or so, IIRC.

In reply to Slippery :

I'm coming over.