anyone with diesel vans?

Ian F wrote: Most conversion vans are built on a 1/2 ton cargo van base. Occasionaly you'll find one built on a 3/4 ton, but they're rare. Some GM's were built on a G20 van, but that isn't really a 'true' 3/4 ton chassis (uses 5 lug wheels, for example). IMHO, the "ultimate" is one of the 3/4 or 1 ton extended length models, which are exceptionally rare, although oddly enough if you search for Quigly 4x4 conversions, many are extended, raised roof coversion vans. However, these do hold their value reasonably well, mainly due to how much they cost to build in the first place. Many of these are also diesels. The downside of the extended vans - at least Fords & Dodges - is they're not as good for towing due to the additional length between the axle line and the hitch. GM's are better here since they extend the wheel base for the additional length. Having been down this road in the past, if the plan is camping, you want a raised roof van. Don't dismiss how much you'll want the extra standing height. Especially when changing clothes. The 1/2 tons seems ot tow reasonably well, if weight is kept within reason. I remember a guy on Ford Truck Enthusiasts who used his E150 conversion van to tow his race car in a 20 foot-ish enclosed trailer. There are a few tricks you can do to increase stability w/o going crazy: rear air springs, RSB, spacers to increase the rear track width, HD trans cooler and so on. Unfortunately, most conversion vans come with smaller engines (5 liters), although some GMs have 350s. The option I've considered is a retired airport shuttle van (NOT a bus, which usually have whacky door set-ups), which are extended length 3/4 or 1 tons with a raised roof. They're often diesels as well. Then gutting it and doing my own conversion on it. The trick there will be finding one that isn't already used up.

Agreed on all points.

I'm faced with the following options from what I can find:

1) diesel cargo van which is perfect in almost every way. I would probably add some kind of interior roof and wall lining/insulation for the camping part (heating and cooling reasons). Buy one of those conversion van fold down seats and be done.
2) conversion van - super cheap, but almost always gas, and almost always 2.73 or 3.08 rear (or similar) and half-ton chassis. I can strip out what I don't want.
3) airport shuttle/15-passenger van. Again, almost always gas, but they at least a true 3/4 or 1-ton and typically have a more tow-friendly rear ratio.

Not sure about you guys, but 'round here diesel is still the clear choice for fuel cost (more expensive fuel but better mileage)

I'm a bit torn on the hightop roofs. The extra headroom would be nice, but compared to what I have now (truck bed with a cap) I don't think its necessary. Also not sure if they affect MPG and if so, how much.

Diesel swap? Maybe a rollover diesel pickup and a gas van body? Not sure how much of a project you want.

too many projects as it is, Tuna. I need a turn key, coast-to-coast-ready van.

As much as I'd love to buy an A100 or a greenbriar and drop in a 4BT, I don't think its in the books this time.

High roof vans won't go into parking structures, regular vans will. Not a huge deal until you have to go to an airport or downtown in a major city though.

Some of the late 80s/early 90s Ford conversion vans were built on Club Wagons, which as I recall had the heavy suspension and maybe 8 lug axles. A step below a true 3/4 ton but beefier than a 1/2 ton. They may have been a heavy half though, as the memory is a bit foggy. Mostly they had 351s, which are sows and do not make power or get good economy.

Truth be told, I don't know if you would want a conversion van. Most of them were built out of the cheapest materials available. The only benefits we ever saw to them was that the rear windows had screens, which is really nice for camping in. You can get magnetic screens that snap in place over the windows on a regular passenger van though. The regular passenger vans are much simpler, can move more people, and do not have acres of poorly installed wood trim, curtains, and opera lighting.

Why not get a gasser 1/2 ton conversion van and swap in 3/4 ton running gear? Should be able to be done in a weekend with jackstands in the driveway. Good chance to refresh the brakes and running gear which you would want to do on a tow vehicle anyway.

curtis73 wrote: too many projects as it is, Tuna. I need a turn key, coast-to-coast-ready van. As much as I'd love to buy an A100 or a greenbriar and drop in a 4BT, I don't think its in the books this time.

Hey - why do you want a van? Why not just get a truck with a topper if you're not carrying people? They are like 8 million times more plentiful than a van.

I have a 2001 Dodge Ram Wagon 2500 that actually uses 1-ton suspension on it(When I order parts at the counter I have to mention this) that I am thinking about selling.Red with black interior,and fully loaded aside from ABS which is strange I know.The paint is faded,but could be saved. Spot of rust on the drivers side rocker that looks pretty bad,but could be fixed easy enough.It has 13xk+ miles on it,but it runs great,and the front end is all rebuilt a year ago with less than 6k miles on it I bet. Heavy duty trailer hitch with wiring for electric brake controller,step bumper on rear. Has A/C,and heat in rear as well. It is an 8 passenger model,and has plenty of utility. Side doors open on hinges instead of a slider,and the rear is one giant ass heavy door instead of double doors. I know I am far away from you,but it may be worth the ride as it is a quality van. I could deliver it as I have a friend in Austin who I have been meaning to visit,and this would be a good excuse. PM me if you are interested.

Chris

93gsxturbo wrote: High roof vans won't go into parking structures, regular vans will. Not a huge deal until you have to go to an airport or downtown in a major city though. Some of the late 80s/early 90s Ford conversion vans were built on Club Wagons, which as I recall had the heavy suspension and maybe 8 lug axles. A step below a true 3/4 ton but beefier than a 1/2 ton. They may have been a heavy half though, as the memory is a bit foggy. Mostly they had 351s, which are sows and do not make power or get good economy.

This depends on the city. A handicapped friend of mine had similar thoughts, only to discover that his std van still wouldn't fit in most Philly garages, so he really regretted not getting a raised roof van.

My conversion van was built on a E150 Econoline base. 5.0, AODE, pillow-soft suspension, std 5 lug wheels with P235/75-15XL tires. Definitely geared for hwy driving (which is did exceptionally well) and would get in the upper teens if I kept speeds docile. It wasn't the best daily driver, but for long trips I always preferred the van. An 8 hr drive was nothing. I'd get to my destination and not be tired.

For me, the only reason to get a conversion van was for the raised roof. I had removed the rear seats and basically used it as a cargo van. I do agree the finish materials are marginal at best.

While it may not be applicable for Curtis, the 5.0 had one major benefit over the Cummins in my truck: it didn't mind long periods of inactivity. Sometimes it would sit for months (literally) between starting. I'd hop in, turn the key and the damn engine would start and purr like it had just run yesterday. My Cummins is NOT a happy camper if I don't run it at least once a week. I'll probably drive it again this w/e and I'm not looking forward to the embarassing belches of smoke that will come out of the exhaust and pretty much cover my neighbor's yard for 10 minutes. Hell, my much newer and better cared for TDI isn't all that happy when I get back from vacation and it hasn't run for a week. To me, it seems like diesels don't tolerate sitting as well as a modern EFI gas engine.

tuna55 wrote: Diesel swap? Maybe a rollover diesel pickup and a gas van body? Not sure how much of a project you want.

This doesn't really work. The chassis are drastically different. Plus, you can run into all kinds of titling and inspection issues when trying to run a vehicle with a gas VIN and a diesel engine.

Hey - why do you want a van? Why not just get a truck with a topper if you're not carrying people? They are like 8 million times more plentiful than a van.

See page 1. I have a truck with a topper. Too much vehicle for so little camping/cargo space. the truck is 9' of hood and cab with 6.5' of cargo space. A van is 4' of hood and cab with 12' of cargo space.

the van is much more dual-purpose for my use. The truck is something I can use for multi purpose stuff, but a van is better.

curtis73 wrote:

Hey - why do you want a van? Why not just get a truck with a topper if you're not carrying people? They are like 8 million times more plentiful than a van.

See page 1. I have a truck with a topper. Too much vehicle for so little camping/cargo space. the truck is 9' of hood and cab with 6.5' of cargo space. A van is 4' of hood and cab with 12' of cargo space. the van is much more dual-purpose for my use. The truck is something I *can* use for multi purpose stuff, but a van is better.

Sorry Curtis, I missed that.

dude............

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=13777721&cat=656&lpid=&search=

In reply to Ian F:

Sorry Curtis, I missed that.

You are forgiven... this time

No worries... I'm the worst about reading a complete thread before replying... especially with this forum. Some threads disappear without a single response. Others have 1600 pages of BS.

Love you guys.

MG_Bryan wrote: In reply to Ian F:

Yes?

How about a 2001+ Chevy Express/GMC Savana 2500 or 3500 gasser. It gets you the heavy duty chassis, the 4L80e, the tow friendly rear gear, and not much worse mileage than the diesels.

edit-mine has 300k plus and runs pretty well (no idea on service history though)

I have been toying with the gas idea. The thing that I always come back to is towing MPG and towing torque. Diesel trumps gas in big ways.

For instance, unloaded: gas = 15mpg, diesel = 20 mpg. Towing 10,000 lbs, gas = 9 mpg, diesel = 15 mpg. Diesel maintains more MPG when towing than a typical gas does, and you have darn near double the torque.

Only if it has a turbo. And then put a turbo on a gas motor and there goes that part. But the MPG thing is the real point here anyway.

Frankly, every non turbo diesel ive driven was complete E36 M3. People talk about diesels making so much power as if the turbo is a foregone conclusion, but the way i see it, the diesel is an engine that doesnt work worth a crap without a turbo.

Im just ranting, no real contribution here..

Vigo wrote: Only if it has a turbo. And then put a turbo on a gas motor and there goes that part. But the MPG thing is the real point here anyway.

Agreed, but then I'd have to buy 93 octane gas that is just as expensive as diesel. The other nice thing about diesel is for about a $800 investment, you can get 800 lb-ft to the wheels and actually improve MPGs

Frankly, every non turbo diesel ive driven was complete E36 M3. People talk about diesels making so much power as if the turbo is a foregone conclusion, but the way i see it, the diesel is an engine that doesnt work worth a crap without a turbo. Im just ranting, no real contribution here..

Rant away... I'm with you. I had a 6.2L in a step van. Painfully slow.

What about a 6.2/6.5 Suburban? That's sorta a van.

curtis73 wrote: I have been toying with the gas idea. The thing that I always come back to is towing MPG and towing torque. Diesel trumps gas in big ways. For instance, unloaded: gas = 15mpg, diesel = 20 mpg. Towing 10,000 lbs, gas = 9 mpg, diesel = 15 mpg. Diesel maintains more MPG when towing than a typical gas does, and you have darn near double the torque.

Diesel=Twice the torque, half the rpm range, and higher buy in. The 2003 6.0 Express is rated 300hp and 360 ft/lbs and has a pretty friendly rear gear. IIRC rated 14/18 mpg and 10,000lb tow capacity. I understand your diesel logic, but don't totally rule out gas. The LSx motors make the comparison interesting.

If camping is what you are interested in, then... http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58784

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/200x-classifieds/diesel-suburban/34396/page1/

huge-O-chavez wrote: If camping is what you are interested in, then... http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58784

I'm not in the market for a camper though. I want a naked van that once a month I can throw a couple sleeping bags in the back. But my main purpose is daily driver, parts hauler, tow rig, and beater truck.

Found the PERFECT van... but its in Philly and I'm in Austin.

Bidding anyway. Keep some fingers crossed.

Road trip?