We've never had a problem with people not working. Then again we average 6-7 runs in a day and are a pretty close-knit group.
We've never had a problem with people not working. Then again we average 6-7 runs in a day and are a pretty close-knit group.
ProDarwin wrote:alfadriver wrote: (umbrelas to a great job of shading both the sun and the rain....Course workers cannot use umbrellas at many SCCA events. You can't sprint to a cone and reset it too well with an umbrella in your hand.)
Well, we don't seem to see that problem. So we don't have a rule against it. Figure it's better that the corner worker is cool and comfortable if we are going to ask them to sprint to cones in the heat of the summer- the comfort is more important than a cone missed every once in a while...
There were quite a few people who left before completing their work assignments. The GTR guy has been talked to in the past about not working but simply does not care. It sounds like our board is going to enact a 6 month ban for people who skip out on working.
At a normal autocross event I volunteer additional work assignments to keep the event going. I start and announce and shag cones/ instruct as needed. (work multiple heats)
I understand that working might not be fun, but as the guy who has to get on the PA begging for workers for several minutes a few times so the last group can run, I do feel that a public lynching is almost in order. With our club, its not really a problem if you come talk to us if you have another commitment. But simply not showing? I have named names I was looking for that signed up for the last heat over the PA.
When there is someone who runs 1 and volunteers 3 heats, I do have a problem with someone not even working one.
Could just drop the umbrella and run to the cone without it...
To paraphrase Shepard Book: "..you're going to burn in a very special level of hell. A level they reserve for child molesters, people who talk at the theater, and people who don't work after their autocross runs."
spriteracer wrote: There were quite a few people who left before completing their work assignments. The GTR guy has been talked to in the past about not working but simply does not care. It sounds like our board is going to enact a 6 month ban for people who skip out on working.
Good call. Glad to see a club enforce something like this. I've run with clubs with a similar problem before and due to potential lost income they are too afraid to ban members or even slap them on the wrist.
jstein77 wrote: Could just drop the umbrella and run to the cone without it...
A) the extra 2 seconds to set the umbrella down is fairly significant. B) once set down, it could easily be blown in front of another car/into a worker/etc.
It's pretty simple to wear a raincoat if its raining and hat/sunscreen if its sunny. Not my rules, but I do agree with them.
jstein77 wrote: Could just drop the umbrella and run to the cone without it...
Or you can have the person next to you get the cone, and you call it in on the radio. Then switch. We try to have 3 at each corner, but even two can come up with a run/stand agreement.
Easier than banning umbrellas.
Our club does the disqualification of time if you skip out early without prior coordination also. Haven't had any issues with it. A few time there were barely enough people to shag cones but we lived with it. Prior coordination shows respect to the others and usually the event master will OK it. We all sometimes have thing come up.
jstein77 wrote: And about the "staying all day for a couple of parking lot runs" comment: If you aren't hooked on the adrenaline rush afforded by the most intense 40 seconds of your life, then check your heartbeat - it must have stopped some time back.
It's a GTR. From what everyone says, it's as involving as an amusement park ride. Sounds pretty dull to me.
alfadriver wrote: Or you can have the person next to you get the cone, and you call it in on the radio. Then switch. We try to have 3 at each corner, but even two can come up with a run/stand agreement.
The person who simply stands is the captain, responsible for both the radio and the red-flag, leaving no free hand to operate an umbrella.
I like how the GTR owner "had other things to do". Like what, exactly? Model for the cover of this month's issue of Douche Illustrated? And he hoped the "fans" enjoyed seeing the GTR. See it what? get beat? What a loser. Shame on all who didn't work their assignments but this guy is a special kind of jerk. I say take his entry fee and don't give him any times for his runs. He either won't come back or won't care. Either way you win.
ProDarwin wrote:alfadriver wrote: Or you can have the person next to you get the cone, and you call it in on the radio. Then switch. We try to have 3 at each corner, but even two can come up with a run/stand agreement.The person who simply stands is the captain, responsible for both the radio and the red-flag, leaving no free hand to operate an umbrella.
Yup. Hence why you can spot an experienced autoxer by their goofy looking hat.
alfadriver wrote:jstein77 wrote: Could just drop the umbrella and run to the cone without it...Or you can have the person next to you get the cone, and you call it in on the radio. Then switch. We try to have 3 at each corner, but even two can come up with a run/stand agreement. Easier than banning umbrellas.
I dunno. Banning umbrellas seems pretty easy to me.
Personally, having to work course with people with umbrellas is something of an annoyance. I can't count the times that that I've almost gotten poked in the eye with one, or I've had to chase down one that someone sat down, or I'm scrambling to get multiple cones far apart while someone is trying to fix their inside out umbrella.
Of course, it seemed like everyone at nationals was walking around with a golf umbrella this past year. It made it tough to get clean course walks or watch other people run the course. You'd sit in the stands, then someone would squeeze in a row in front of you and pop open the golf umbrella. Not very courteous, IMO.
If you run, work. If you skip out on working, the next time you sign up, you should have to work double shifts.
I stopped auto-xing because I didn't like the ratio of time spent at the site vs real seat time. With transit time to the site, I'd be gone almost 10 hours for about 6 minutes of driving time. When I moved to Denver it got worse, as the courses are half as long here.
alfadriver wrote:DrBoost wrote:(umbrelas to a great job of shading both the sun and the rain....alfadriver wrote: A good reason why it's easier to entice people to work with rewards vs. forcing them to do so.^^This. I ran with SCCA many times (always handling my assignments) but it was tough. With AROC, I'd usually show up to set up the course, that way I can leave when I want to. I don't really understand the reason to skip out on your assignments though. Everytime I go to an AROC event I work, even though the last 4 times I didn't even run. I get a better view of the action out on a corner...but I do miss the shade.
Yes, but that takes forethought. I don't even have threethought so I'm screwed.
His "the fans" comment killed me. Clearly he wears the mantle of douchedom proudly. Really, what he's saying is that his time is more important than anyone else's, the same as the guy who drives on the shoulder to get around a construction delay, cuts in line at the bank or subjects everyone else in line at the supermarket his inane cell phone conversation (because "Dude, sup?" is so crucially important). Sadly, there's nothing you can do to shame such an individual. Although making him wear a cone with "douche" painted on it at the next event sounds like fun, he'd think it was a cool hat.
kazoospec wrote: Sadly, there's nothing you can do to shame such an individual. Although making him wear a cone with "douche" painted on it at the next event sounds like fun, he'd think it was a cool hat.
It's pronounced doo-SHAY. It's Italian.
(there were, in fact, multiple things intentionally wrong with that.)
docwyte wrote: I stopped auto-xing because I didn't like the ratio of time spent at the site vs real seat time. With transit time to the site, I'd be gone almost 10 hours for about 6 minutes of driving time. When I moved to Denver it got worse, as the courses are half as long here.
\
You need to get into rallycross. I think my non seat time to seat time ratio is around 2 hours/1 minute, once time spent wrenching is factored in...
ProDarwin wrote:alfadriver wrote: Or you can have the person next to you get the cone, and you call it in on the radio. Then switch. We try to have 3 at each corner, but even two can come up with a run/stand agreement.The person who simply stands is the captain, responsible for both the radio and the red-flag, leaving no free hand to operate an umbrella.
Wow, you go so far to assign specific duties for each person?
OK. We don't. And don't have a problem with people taking stuff to corners so that they can be comfortable.
To each his own, for sure.
It's very clear that SCCA favors absolute 'fairness' in the fact that each group is tightly assigned when to run and when to work, everyone should suffer, I mean do their part, equally, all day, starting with pre-event pre-registration that requires you to show up at 8am, well before anything happens, and stay until the last car takes it's last run.
OTOH, we take a fun position- work if you want, run when you can, show up and we'll take your money. When you work, make sure you are comfortable, and IF you work, you get a reward. No forcing for anyone. If you are there by noon- cool. If you have to leave by 11:30am, I'm really hoping we start before you need to leave. If it's raining, we don't want to suffer, so we cancel. If you want to be there with us, from 8:30-4 or so, great. But you should get 5 runs, and 3-4 fun runs in that effort.
Works for both groups.
In reply to alfadriver:
I want run with your club!
so, yinz guys drive on a black top parking lot huh? 
alfadriver wrote: Works for both groups.
Absolutely. We have some on-strict "fun oriented" groups around as well that function similarly. I do both types of events. I will say that while SCCA may seem anal, the local region runs like a pretty well oiled machine, especially in comparison to the "fun oriented" groups mentioned above. As a result the events can generally handle over 200 drivers while still having longer runs pretty easily.
ProDarwin wrote:alfadriver wrote: Or you can have the person next to you get the cone, and you call it in on the radio. Then switch. We try to have 3 at each corner, but even two can come up with a run/stand agreement.The person who simply stands is the captain, responsible for both the radio and the red-flag, leaving no free hand to operate an umbrella.
so carry a red umbrella. really, why are people so pissy about cone-shaggers using umbrellas?
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