Bench racing - New, "track focused" and very different, $35k edition.

Both of these cars are out in the past year, only come with a manual transmission, cost about the same amount, and have similar 0-60 and ¼ mile numbers.

The Camaro 1LT 1LE is a V6 powered car with a track package that starts around $32,895. Weight is 3500 lbs. Horsepower is 335, torque is 284 lb ft.

The Honda Civic Type R is $33,900 and has a little less horsepower and a little more torque than the Camaro. 3111 lbs. 306 horsepower here, but more torque than the Camaro V6 - 295 lb ft. It's faster to 60 and faster through the ¼ mile than the Camaro by a slim margin.

What would you do, besides buying stock in Alcantara™?

I've spent enough time in the new Camaros to know that they're an impressive platform, I'm an old school hot rodder who hates FWD and races a gen2 Camaro.  However, something about that Type R really speaks to me. 

What about a $26k mustang GT and $6k in mods getting it track ready?

https://www.koonsfordbaltimore.com/new/Ford/2017-Ford-Mustang-baltimore-md-553ace380a0e0adf5dc318965ade47ad.htm?searchDepth=1:45

TypeR every day including Sunday. There are a LOT of Camaros I'd put in front of it in line, but not the V6 car. 

Both cars have been reviewed really well.  You might need to drive them to make up your mind.

I'd vote Camaro V6 1LE, it's giant killer.  Little known plus, the warranty is unaffected by track usage.  It also has a great exhaust note.  Faster than a Mustang GT around a track.

Here's another idea:  The V6 1LE is basically a regular V8 SS with the V6 drivetrain.  Buy the regular V6 Camaro, and get the DSSV suspension setup from the ZL1 1LE, your own better wheels and tires and hit the wreckers to find the upgraded rad and oil cooler setup.  The 1LE diff cooler setup might not be realistic to DIY.  There is a lot of value in the 1LE package, but it's still pretty expensive.

Interesting piece:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a33419/2017-chevrolet-camaro-v6-1le/

I suspect both cars would put in similar lap times.  R&T had the Type R 3 seconds a lap faster than a STI on a short course (St. Eustache).  C&D has the V6 1LE 6 seconds faster than a STI at VIR.

Since you are not getting a R anytime soon unless you pay above sticker I say STI or a Mustang EcoBoost.

I think i'd have to drive the current V6 to decide. In the 5th gens it's somewhat less pleasant than its numbers suggest. Kind of an NVH/powerband thing. I hear the noise has gotten MUCH better. If the power delivery is a little more theatric now as well then i'd probably take the Camaro.  Even at that, only because you said 'track focused' in the title. 

My brain hurts at the thought of any Civic having more torque than any Camaro.

If I had to use it on the street ever, Civic.  I'm assuming since "bench racing" is in the thread title, speed around the track is the ultimate goal here.

So, Camaro.  A bonus is that Camaro is nowhere near the limits of that chassis.  Tons of room for a LOT more tire/wheel, brakes, power, etc.  Civic has some room to grow, but likely not as much before a hammer, sawzall, rivet gun, welder, etc. are needed.

etifosi said:

My brain hurts at the thought of any Civic having more torque than any Camaro.

 

That was my first thought too!

I'm in the CTR camp. 400lbs is a lot.

Robbie said:

etifosi said:

My brain hurts at the thought of any Civic having more torque than any Camaro.

 

That was my first thought too!

And it's rwd vs fwd, Camaro vs Civic, and V6 vs I4, and we don't have a strong consensus.

Can't we get the fors down that far? 

The 4-cyl Camaro is ~3350-3400lbs with similar straight line speed as the V6.  The base V6 is ~3450-3500lbs.

As ProDarwin suggests, variants of the Camaro literally ship with the widest front tires available in an OEM application.

The CTR punches above its weight too and it sounds like they've made it fantastic to drive.  Based on the reviews it may be the finest FWD sport oriented car ever made, but I'm still skeptical that it would feel as nice to drive as a good RWD car.

I think I'll have to vote Camaro because I like dumb and simple sometimes. The whole "this thing contains lots of GM parts bin content" also seems rather appealing on the Camaro's side. 

In reply to dculberson :

Jeez that is cheap

I am a Honda fan, but I've driven the Chevrolet a lot as a rental.  Wow thats a hard choice.  As purely a track beater, is probably go Chevrolet for price of consumables.  I'm also a little leery of a turbo car on the track, having seen turbo everything cause problems during my rally days.  But it's a turbo Honda so keeping it stock should bring reliability    Ohh so difficult  dang  

For everything else. Civic. I like rally cars more than drag cars. 

Snrub said:

Both cars have been reviewed really well.  You might need to drive them to make up your mind.

 

I'd vote Camaro V6 1LE, it's giant killer.  Little known plus, the warranty is unaffected by track usage.  It also has a great exhaust note.  Faster than a Mustang GT around a track.

 

Here's another idea:  The V6 1LE is basically a regular V8 SS with the V6 drivetrain.  Buy the regular V6 Camaro, and get the DSSV suspension setup from the ZL1 1LE, your own better wheels and tires and hit the wreckers to find the upgraded rad and oil cooler setup.  The 1LE diff cooler setup might not be realistic to DIY.  There is a lot of value in the 1LE package, but it's still pretty expensive.

 

Interesting piece:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a33419/2017-chevrolet-camaro-v6-1le/

 

I suspect both cars would put in similar lap times.  R&T had the Type R 3 seconds a lap faster than a STI on a short course (St. Eustache).  C&D has the V6 1LE 6 seconds faster than a STI at VIR.

Are you sure the V6 doesn't get the Mag shocks like on the SS 1LE?

I know the spool dampers of the ZL1 LE are pricier than the mag setup.

Also, depending on how company stocks look next year, I'm going to put an SS 1LE in the garage.

z31maniac said:

Are you sure the V6 doesn't get the Mag shocks like on the SS 1LE?

I know the spool dampers of the ZL1 LE are pricier than the mag setup.

Yes.  The 6th gen Camaro suspensions are as follows:

Base I4 and V6.

Base SS suspension, V6 1LE.  aka FE3.

SS magnetic suspension.

ZL1, SS 1LE:  More aggressive magnetic suspension.

ZL1 1LE:  DSSV supension.

To make maters more confusing, there is also the GM Performance parts lowering/handling kits.  Cars can now be ordered with them installed.  They're for the base I4/V6 with 20" wheel packages (I fail to see why this would mater), SS base, SS magnetic, SS convertible.

My 2016 1LT gets as good as 35mpg on the highway, and 23mpg around town, all on regular unleaded.  It's been suprisingly comfortable on long trips, and I even folded down the rear seat and slept in it at the Daytona 24hr this past February, and I'm 6'2"!

I think the 1LE is an interesting package. The problem it has is the depreciation of the regular V6 model. You can grab a regular V6 model in the really low 20's. Add on your suspension of choice, bigger brakes, and some extra cooling and I doubt you'll be in the range of the 1LE. I just don't see 1LE's just sitting around the lot and getting the discounts. 

With that being said, I would get the Camaro over the Civic all day. I do wish it was 8-10 inches shorter though.