Chevy "E-Rod" crate engine

No link, sorry, but GM introduced an LS3 crate engine designed so that classic cars can pass CA smog tests.

Umm...classic cars (pre-75) DON'T GET SMOG TESTED IN CA. What am I missing?

I think there may be something about being smogged on the year of the motor. NJ does that in certain situations and NJ seems to take alot of its cues from CA

http://wot.motortrend.com/6602262/aftermarket/2009-sema-gm-introduces-first-50-state-emissions-legal-e-rod-ls3-crate-engine/index.html

The way i read it, it may be legal for newer cars too, so late 70s-early 80s carbed stuff will be worth bothering with again.

nice it comes with the wiring harness and 430HP

Damn! You mean to tell me GM did something smart. Probably more for the custom guys building from the ground up.

JThw8 wrote: I think there may be something about being smogged on the year of the motor. NJ does that in certain situations and NJ seems to take alot of its cues from CA

California quit doing that quite a while ago; sometime before 1993.

Travis_K wrote: The way i read it, it may be legal for newer cars too, so late 70s-early 80s carbed stuff will be worth bothering with again.

But will people who can afford to buy a crate engine like this want to put it in a late 70s-early 80s car?

do the laws allow you to put the engine in non-GM cars and still be able to pass?

Apparently it would be California legal for pretty much any car up till 1995. In case you wanted a smog legal LSx Miata, no doubt.

yeah a lot of the 944 swappers have to deal with emissions, its one reason I got a 25 year old car, no emissions tests for me.

List Price = $9400 Great if you have the cash....

It might just be cheaper to move to some place without the restrictions.

So the price of this thing is 7850ish now.

That still not cheap, but 430hp and everything turn key just about. Is this worth the price in people's minds?

A 5.3 out of a truck would be nice, but for the cheap one that would be a iron block, and then I may need to swap intakes, get a harness, comp, etc. for fitment and to make run. Plus that's a full liter down just about.

So I guess parts cost it may be 2000 legitimately to get a running 5.3 into the same "condition" as the e-rod. So is 5800 worth the less headache and the increase in displacement/power?

Discuss......

Thats a great idea, and I'm a bit surprised that no mfr has done it already. I think its too pricey for GRM type folks, but at under $10k for 400+ hp in a complete package it sould be a no brainer for the custom car building pros.

Also, I thought that The Peoples Republic of California already had certain recognized swaps that were ok if done according to the rules?

Thinkkker wrote: So I guess parts cost it may be 2000 legitimately to get a running 5.3 into the same "condition" as the e-rod. So is 5800 worth the less headache and the increase in displacement/power? Discuss......

You know, I run into the same thing with race (rally cars specifically) cars all the time.

The fact is, even for a relatively experienced backyard mechanic like myself who has been working on cars since he was 14, putting a motor into something that it did not come out of is typically a nightmare (if you want it to be nice), end of discussion.

I can always earn more money, but I can't earn more time. It's the same reason I paid $7k to have my rallycar fixed after I crunched it real good at the last event. It probably would have taken me 3 months of everynight in the garage to get it completely fixed up, and in the end, it still would have cost me $4k I reckon.

In this light, for an extra $5k (and it's actually more like $4k, if we are going to go apples to apples, as you'd want a written off vehicle with a low mileage motor if you were even thinking of considering an EROD to begin with), and then you have to cut, splice, and makeshift everything yourself to get it to work.

The sole purpose of the e-rod package is for passing emissions. You can buy all sorts of other crate engine options from GM without cats included. Also, I believe that it is illegal to sell used cats, so this might be the only game in town if you want to make sure you'll pass a check.

I have done an LS1 swap into an older car. If I was going to do it again I would purchase a running 98-02 f-body (can be had for $5k-ish) swap whatever I needed, and part out the rest to recoup costs. I went a little crazy thinking that sensors were bad, or questioning the wiring harness when I was working bugs out. I think starting with a running car would have given me piece of mind about those things.

If you're building a street rod with an aftermarket body and frame, I believe in California it gets titled as a specially constructed vehicle.

Under California law, 500 exemption permits for specially constructed vehicles are available every year on a first come, first served basis. For vehicles with an exemption, a smog test referee compares the vehicle to those of the era that the vehicle most closely resembles to determine the model year of a specially constructed vehicle. The vehicle's owner can choose whether the inspector will certify the vehicle model year by body type or by the engine model year. Only those emission controls applicable to the model year and that can be reasonably accommodated by the vehicle are required.

Cars that don't get one of the 500 exemptions, have to meet modern emissions standards.

MotoIQ did a write up about how they got their E-Rod hearted FD CA legal.

The overview of the CA swap and aftermarket rules can be found on the Air Resources Board Website.

Basically it's a lot less complicated than people make it seem because there is so much bad information out there. People will argue about it all day with you but a little research and a phone call but the rules aren't that opaque though they are subject to a bit of interpretation as MotoIQ ran into.

The E-Rod is easy though as it comes with an EO sticker you can just swap it into anything that was a passenger vehicle without a real fight. I'm not sure about swapping it into a light truck like an S-10.

Vehicles pre 75 are still smog exempt.

The0retical wrote: MotoIQ did a write up about how they got their E-Rod hearted FD CA legal. The overview of the CA swap and aftermarket rules can be found on the Air Resources Board Website. Basically it's a lot less complicated than people make it seem because there is so much bad information out there. People will argue about it all day with you but a little research and a phone call but the rules aren't that opaque though they are subject to a bit of interpretation as MotoIQ ran into. The E-Rod is easy though as it comes with an EO sticker you can just swap it into anything that was a passenger vehicle without a real fight. I'm not sure about swapping it into a light truck like an S-10. Vehicles pre 75 are still smog exempt.

i wonder if an El Camino is considered a car or truck for the purposes of this stuff?

GM making an emissions legal complete engine swap kit with a bunch of parts under one part number isn't anything new.. they sold a kit in the early 90's to put a ZZ4 350 crate motor into an 82-87 Camaro that originally had a 305 and an auto trans in it.. what you got was almost 300hp at the wheels at a time when that was a lot of power and about $15k worth of factory oem approved aftermarket parts for something like $8k if you paid full retail for it- it was really one hell of a deal for what it was.. so for all you people that have ever wondered why they put that particular cam in the ZZ4 or why it comes with an intake manifold with an egr valve mounting boss, now you know- and knowing is half the battle.

article from another magazine

Does it come with a warranty? Unless you buy a running donor, you don't really know what you're getting. If you don't want to spend your time pulling a donor engine, chasing missing parts from a pre-pulled engine, or pulling a used engine back out to repair it, the E-ROD is a pretty compelling option.

The only problems with the E-rod are that you have to use it as supplied or the EO number doesn't apply anymore, this includes the TB to the end of the catted pipes. If the manifolds and cats don't fit the chassis, tough E36 M3 and you will have to modify everything else to make those pipes fit. And no you can't put on another GM vehicle manifolds to get clearance either. Intake hits the hood, get the hood bubbled to fit.

About the only good thing the E-rod does well is to cross the barrier of using a "truck" engine in a car chassis, which is blatantly illegal in CA.

Tyler - yes. GM gives a two-year warranty on the engine. It's one of the reasons we only use GMPP crate engines when we build cars. We've actually used an E-Rod on our latest build because they have more complete OBD-II monitoring which makes passing smog in other states a bit easier. For example, the E-Rod has rear O2 sensors which monitor the state of the cats while the standard wiring harness from GMPP does not. We put our own cats in the exhaust for packaging reasons though.

Ranger's right about the fitment. You're not going to see this making LS-powered Miatas legal in CA, as you can't fit those manifolds or cats. We've taken a look at the fitment and it's pretty much a no-go. I think you could justify a bit of cutting and realignment of the cat pipes IF you kept the distance to the ports the same, but that's not going to work in a Miata.

Says the guy who's going to spend the day driving an LS3-powered Miata around the California hills today

Honestly, the legality thing is not a big factor at all. The car is a 74.

The biggest reason is simply the time aspect as HiTemp stated and then the little things. If I buy a running car, then I normally end up trying to flip it for some cash. That has been the issue I have run into thus far with potential donors.

If you did not use the "stock" manifolds an cats I would think that you could get a couple more hp out of the system.

I was just wanting to start some banter on the issue to help get my head straight. Since I haven't even had a chance to really start on the project I would bet that this may be a smart option.

Honestly, the legality thing is not a big factor at all. The car is a 74.

The biggest reason is simply the time aspect as HiTemp stated and then the little things. If I buy a running car, then I normally end up trying to flip it for some cash. That has been the issue I have run into thus far with potential donors.

If you did not use the "stock" manifolds an cats I would think that you could get a couple more hp out of the system.

I was just wanting to start some banter on the issue to help get my head straight. Since I haven't even had a chance to really start on the project I would bet that this may be a smart option.