Decent Mazda Motors

Ok, right off the bat, no 13B's or 1.8's. Those are both ok motors, but Mazda has to have something else. I've always wanted to do a V6 Mazda, but i can't find anywhere online that says they can make any power (300-400hp). Does anyone on this forum know of any other decent Mazda motor? Or was the 13B and the 1.8 the only children Mazda can be proud of??

I'm not a Mazda expert by any means, but now that you mention it, I can't really think of anything exceptionally special that Mazda has made other than the rotories.

Odd.

The KL (2.5 v6) will make over 300whp quite easily with a proper turbo setup and a good tune.

The JE (3.0 V6) will probably do more than that, but it's not a lightweight.

The F2T (2.2 i4 turbo) will laugh at you and ask you for more in a completely emasculating fashion no matter how much boost you throw at it.

The FE3/FE-DOHC/FE3N (2.0 i4) is legendary in its ability to hold a metric E36 M3load of power in completely stock form with a turbo.

Honestly... the 1.8 is a pretty mediocre motor in every sense of the word. It's a good motor because of the car it came in. The car it came in is not a good car because of its motor. It's cheap because it's well supported, but it's not special in any way.

Skyactiv-d

But if you are looking for mazda v6 you should check out the mazda millenia. It had a small displacement supercharged v6 that runs a miller cycle.

A lot of people believe the SR20DE as having a strong bottom end for boosting from the factory...Just to put it in perspective, the OEM forged rods in the Kia Sportage (only USDM FE3 variant) make the SR20DE rods look like toothpicks. There is much more to it than that, and obviously rod strength is far from the only measure of an engines performance potential, but it's certainly one indicator.

In reply to Driven5:

SR20DE is nissan.

What has surprised me about Mazda's are how the gas mileage in cars like the Protege and Miata just isn't that hot. I assume this is because of short gearing, but, I routinely pulled equal or better numbers in my turbo 626 (F2t again) than people with Miatas or Protege's.

An F2t 323 would be a very nice thing. Something else easy and should be nice is a (gasp) Zetec & G-type trans from a ZX2 swapped in, and I bet the gas mileage would go up along with the ~80% increase in power.

fidelity101 wrote: In reply to Driven5: SR20DE is nissan.

Right... he was just making a comparison how the FE3 stacks up against a motor that's "known" for making a lot of power.

The FE3 rods are actually even thicker than the F2T rods, and of a denser metal.

I have comparison pictures around here somewhere. It's astounding.

fidelity101 wrote: But if you are looking for mazda v6 you should check out the mazda millenia. It had a small displacement supercharged v6 that runs a miller cycle.

I wouldn't wish that motor upon my worst enemy. You won't make 300whp on it. Ever.

Swank Force One wrote: The KL (2.5 v6) will make over 300whp quite easily with a proper turbo setup and a good tune. The JE (3.0 V6) will probably do more than that, but it's not a lightweight. The F2T (2.2 i4 turbo) will laugh at you and ask you for more in a completely emasculating fashion no matter how much boost you throw at it. The FE3/FE-DOHC/FE3N (2.0 i4) is legendary in its ability to hold a metric E36 M3load of power in completely stock form with a turbo. Honestly... the 1.8 is a pretty mediocre motor in every sense of the word. It's a good motor because of the car it came in. The car it came in is not a good car because of its motor. It's cheap because it's well supported, but it's not special in any way.

This plus the new(ish) 2.3 DISI 4cyl that's in the Speed3/6 is also a beast. And so is the trans/clutch.

clutchsmoke wrote:

Swank Force One wrote: The KL (2.5 v6) will make over 300whp quite easily with a proper turbo setup and a good tune. The JE (3.0 V6) will probably do more than that, but it's not a lightweight. The F2T (2.2 i4 turbo) will laugh at you and ask you for more in a completely emasculating fashion no matter how much boost you throw at it. The FE3/FE-DOHC/FE3N (2.0 i4) is legendary in its ability to hold a metric E36 M3load of power in completely stock form with a turbo. Honestly... the 1.8 is a pretty mediocre motor in every sense of the word. It's a good motor because of the car it came in. The car it came in is not a good car because of its motor. It's cheap because it's well supported, but it's not special in any way.

This plus the new(ish) 2.3 DISI 4cyl that's in the Speed3/6 is also a beast. And so is the trans/clutch.

Yep, also a good choice, but i don't know much about them besides that they make power.

Have people started swapping them into other cars yet?

In reply to Swank Force One:

IDK, I know they love to KABOOM with idiot owners adding power improperly though

Baylis wrote: Ok, right off the bat, no 13B's or 1.8's. Those are both ok motors, but Mazda has to have something else. I've always wanted to do a V6 Mazda, but i can't find anywhere online that says they can make any power (300-400hp). Does anyone on this forum know of any other decent Mazda motor? Or was the 13B and the 1.8 the only children Mazda can be proud of??

12A?

B6?

The Duratec four is a Mazda design, and is an incredible engine with big power available with some minor upgrades.

Miller cycle!

FE3 or F2T. You can make pretty big power on the 1.8 bpt, especially if it's the homologation GTR version, or build the bottom end with forged internals and bolt the GTR manifolds and turbo (or equivalent, say gt28r) to it. My street car is in that output ballpark and has done so for years with astonishing reliability but either of those other mills would be less of a grenade with the pin pulled out. Or just page Keith. Flyin Miata most certainly has everything needed to turn a 1.8 miata motor into a full on giant killer, that'll hold up for a nice long time.

FE3 is the motor I was talking about that evening we met up. F2t is easier to come by, not a high winding powerplant, but seems to be fairly bullet proof at the power levels you're discussing.

I've just got to get some projects moved out before I start hunting for a 6spd mazda tranny then the FE3 hunt is on.

F2T doesn't have to rev if you have the right gearing.

I'm pretty sure i can get an F2T to make it to 7000-7200rpm area without a ton of work. We'll see what happens in the next year or so.

Swank Force One wrote: Honestly... the 1.8 is a pretty mediocre motor in every sense of the word. It's a good motor because of the car it came in. The car it came in is not a good car because of its motor. It's cheap because it's well supported, but it's not special in any way.

Geez, what's in the air these days??

Is it great! ?

Maybe not.

But a stock motor that you can reliably add a 66% increase in power and run for 100k miles with virtually no other mods (assuming you don't disrespect it) and will happily run in stock form pushing 7 grand for hours is not MEDIOCRE

T

Tralfaz wrote:

Swank Force One wrote: Honestly... the 1.8 is a pretty mediocre motor in every sense of the word. It's a good motor because of the car it came in. The car it came in is not a good car because of its motor. It's cheap because it's well supported, but it's not special in any way.

Geez, what's in the air these days?? Is it great! ? Maybe not. But a stock motor that you can reliably add a 66% increase in power and run for 100k miles with virtually no other mods (assuming you don't disrespect it) and will happily run in stock form pushing 7 grand for hours is not MEDIOCRE T

There's not many Japanese motors made in that day and age that you CAN'T do that to. That was my point.

I'm not saying it's a bad motor. I'm just saying that it's main strength is that there's a ton of them and they're cheap to mess with. (To a point.) It's not really.... "special" in any way.

I didn't really expect my opinion to be popular, but it is what it is. I don't hate the BP, i even have a turbo BP myself. And prior to that had a BP that lasted (but was VERY tired) 286k miles in a thoroughly beat Escort GT. I like the motor, but with the limited information we have from OP, it's pretty far down on my list of things i'd want to build for 400hp.

Swank Force One wrote:

Tralfaz wrote: But a stock motor that you can reliably add a 66% increase in power and run for 100k miles with virtually no other mods (assuming you don't disrespect it) and will happily run in stock form pushing 7 grand for hours is not MEDIOCRE

I didn't really expect my opinion to be popular, but it is what it is. I don't hate the BP, i even have a turbo BP myself. And prior to that had a BP that lasted (but was VERY tired) 286k miles in a thoroughly beat Escort GT. I like the motor, but with the limited information we have from OP, it's pretty far down on my list of things i'd want to build for 400hp.

Swank force is correct, BP is not the answer for anything close to 400hp....theres a big difference between adding 66% more power to get 200ish rwhp versus adding another 200 on top of that.

They're not bad, but by no means mazda's best engine.

If OP said "I have a 1.8 powered Miata and i want 300-400hp," i'd tell him to just stick with the BP because it's easier. But it's too open ended for me to want to suggest that.

In reply to yamaha:

Um, I ever said it could....The OP is talking about a V6 so I have no idea of what your point is.....

Tralfaz wrote: In reply to yamaha: Never said it could, OP is talking about a V6 so I have no idea of what your point is.....

Just trying to figure out your obvious butthurt at the BP not recieving a glowing recommendation.

In reply to Swank Force One:

I know, but "not special" and "Mediocre in every sense of the word" aren't quite the same thing.

T

The Noble M400 used a Ford Duratec V6 and made over 400 in standard form. Many "tuned" versions running around in the 550 plus range. The Duratec was shared with Mazda, Jaguar, and Volvo. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_M400