Does a rebadged Alpha count?

All day long, a co-worker of mine has been walking around shaking his head in disbelief, eyes cast downward, and muttering "Dodge Dart"...

From a guy that's owned at least 20 Alfas and Fiats, I'm happy to see them back. I think the Dodge version looks OK, especially for a 5 door hatch-ish vehicle. I think the better it does, the more possibility we'll see more "real" Alfa's and Fiat's here.

As for calling it a Dart, I personally think that is a bonehead marketing move. Charger or Challenger is one thing, but the Dart conjures up a different kind of car totally...pure Grandma. As someone that was around when the older one's were new, albeit smaller, we certainly didn't think of Darts as something you longed to have. Instead it was the kind of car you got stuck with when you really wanted a Charger or Mustang.

Regardless of the name, hopefully it will do well and is built much better than some of their current offerings.

Grizz wrote:

irish44j wrote: Once Alfa/Fiat has one big success story, the old horror stories and FixItAgainTony sayings will slowly start to fade.........

I will never let that fade. Besides, I thought alfas were still pretty but unreliable. So long as we get some form of performance model I'm happy. Hows about a FWD model for the guys who've overboosted their SRT4s into the grave and an AWD model for those of us who don't like destroying rubber in 3rd gear(none of us) As far as I'm concerned, the Dodge version looks better, and I hope the 8c makes its way over.

IDK, when we lived in Italy in the 90s we had a Lancia Delta, a Fiat Uno, and some other random Lancia sedan that I forget (which drove like a slow Abrams tank), all of them high-miles, and all of them beat to hell on the worst roads in Italy (Naples) for 3 years. I don't recall any of them having any significant problems.

Ironically, my parents also brought over their Plymouth Voyager, which had multiple problems (which of course are hard to fix in Italy)......

DrBoost wrote: Last year answered the phone, here's what they had to say. Top selling vehicels in the U.S. 2010: 1. Ford F150 (not a small car BTW) 2. Toyota Camry (not a small car BTW) 3. Chevy Silverado 1500 (not a small car BTW) 4. Honda Accord (not a small car BTW) 5. Honda Civic (getting there, but still not what I'd call small) 6. Toyota Corolla (again, smaller, but not small) 7. Nissan Altima (not small) 8. Honda CR-V (small for a cross-over, but not small) 9. Ford Fusion (do I need to go on?) 10. Chevy Malibu (???)

Civic and Corolla aren't "small?" Yeah, not as small as they used to be, but take away the recent crop of subcompacts and the Civic and Corolla are still considered to be "small cars" by most people.

I think we're talking crossways regarding what is "small." I was referring to cars generally considered to be "compact cars." The Civic and Corolla are on that list. The Focus will be on that list soon enough, bet on it. The other sedans on that list are all considered "midsize."

I wasn't referring to subcompacts and "city cars"....those are clearly a niche market and not ideal for the roads that most Americans drive on.

Take the pickups out of there....F150 and Silverado sell a crapload of units as work vehicles as well as personal vehicles, and are not cross-shopped with cars (any cars) generally. Pickups aren't stealing sales from Minis and 500s, and vice versa.

So now you're left with 2 of the top 4 "cars" sold are compacts, and the other top two are midsize sedans.

None of the cars on that list are considered "big cars" per se (though most of the midsize models are alot bigger than they used to be).

When I think "big cars" I think Dodge Charger (and then mostly luxury cars) and other things like that.

And I don't see them anywhere in the top 10....

racerdave600 wrote: As for calling it a Dart, I personally think that is a bonehead marketing move. Charger or Challenger is one thing, but the Dart conjures up a different kind of car totally...pure Grandma. As someone that was around when the older one's were new, albeit smaller, we certainly didn't think of Darts as something you longed to have. Instead it was the kind of car you got stuck with when you really wanted a Charger or Mustang. Regardless of the name, hopefully it will do well and is built much better than some of their current offerings.

I'm not so sure. The target demographic for this car (young first time buyers) have probably never heard of the Dart, just like they have never heard of Fiat or Alfa Romeo. I'm in that demographic and I have heard of the original Dart, but honestly, I know Jack E36 M3 about them. They aren't terribly common in the land of road salt and psycho drivers.

The Dodge Dart was Dodges compact car of the 60s/70s. Mostly economical appliances with some good performance models thrown in for E36 M3s and giggles.

The new Dart will live up to the name perfectly, as most of them will be appliance cars with(more than likely) a couple of good performance models thrown in for E36 M3s and giggles.

It's not like the Dart has a serious history like the Charger or the Challenger. It may have been around longer and been a great car but it was always second fiddle to the more popular models and only really gained popularity once the prices on the "good" ones jumped up to moronic shiny happy person levels.

One thing I want to see, lose the R/T. Don't think the Dart was ever given that badging. Top of the line AWD turbo goodness = Demon, FWD Turbo goodness = Swinger.

We'll never see those fun names again. They were controversial back then and will still be today.

However, for those who think its a mistake to call it a Dodge Dart, you are wrong. Just say it out loud. It rolls off the tongue.

irish44j wrote:

DrBoost wrote: Last year answered the phone, here's what they had to say. Top selling vehicels in the U.S. 2010: 1. Ford F150 (not a small car BTW) 2. Toyota Camry (not a small car BTW) 3. Chevy Silverado 1500 (not a small car BTW) 4. Honda Accord (not a small car BTW) 5. Honda Civic (getting there, but still not what I'd call small) 6. Toyota Corolla (again, smaller, but not small) 7. Nissan Altima (not small) 8. Honda CR-V (small for a cross-over, but not small) 9. Ford Fusion (do I need to go on?) 10. Chevy Malibu (???)

Civic and Corolla aren't "small?" Yeah, not as small as they used to be, but take away the recent crop of subcompacts and the Civic and Corolla are still considered to be "small cars" by most people.

Ok, I'll give those to you. So, two of the top ten are small. Not many.

irish44j wrote: Take the pickups out of there....F150 and Silverado sell a crapload of units

OK, then we'll take the civic and corolla out of there too. None of the top-selling cars are small cars then.

Another issue with the top 10 cars sold (some lists have the Ram as # 10, not the Malibu) is that there are two cars about the size of the Alfa, the Civic and Corolla. The Dart is just a bit larger, about the size of the Camry, Accord, Altima, and Fusion. So, we see 4 cars in the top 10 about the same size as the Dart, 2 about the same size as the Alfa.
I can see why Dodge decided to go with one that's just a bit bigger.....it's what the market wants.

Grizz wrote: Top of the line AWD turbo goodness = Demon, FWD Turbo goodness = Swinger.

It'll never work. If we go swinger, we'll have to totally change the lighting in here.

How about the Dodge Dart Bullseye?

DrBoost wrote:

irish44j wrote:

DrBoost wrote: Last year answered the phone, here's what they had to say. Top selling vehicels in the U.S. 2010: 1. Ford F150 (not a small car BTW) 2. Toyota Camry (not a small car BTW) 3. Chevy Silverado 1500 (not a small car BTW) 4. Honda Accord (not a small car BTW) 5. Honda Civic (getting there, but still not what I'd call small) 6. Toyota Corolla (again, smaller, but not small) 7. Nissan Altima (not small) 8. Honda CR-V (small for a cross-over, but not small) 9. Ford Fusion (do I need to go on?) 10. Chevy Malibu (???)

Civic and Corolla aren't "small?" Yeah, not as small as they used to be, but take away the recent crop of subcompacts and the Civic and Corolla are still considered to be "small cars" by most people.

Ok, I'll give those to you. So, two of the top ten are small. Not many.

irish44j wrote: Take the pickups out of there....F150 and Silverado sell a crapload of units

OK, then we'll take the civic and corolla out of there too. None of the top-selling cars are small cars then.

I would keep this up, but I've forgotten exactly what the argument here is about at this point....

Though if we're talking about "cars" we really should compare "cars"......not pickups, white panel vans, or other top-selling vehicles....

In case you forgot, the discussion was about how American's dont buy small cars as much as they do larger cars. If you discount the trucks in the top 10, you have 2 small cars and 4 that are larger. That's twice as much to you and me.
The point is, for a cash-strapped company that needs to bring in some green now, it might make more sense to lead off with a product that should sell more. The other issue is, since the small car market it smaller (quite a bit smaller) who wants to try to unseat Honda? That's crazy-talk.