i was trying to remove the rear wheels on a '91 318is that I bought, and one of the wheel bolts was hard to turn. then it got really hard to turn (using my impact gun). all at once it started turning freely, but does not come out. like whatever it threads into broke off on the back side, and now it cannot be tightened or loosened. no space to cut it. won't hold still to drill it. what the crap do I do now?
Torch.
Its peeled the threads off the middle of the bolt, leaving a ball'o'threads on the inside end of the hub. You might be able to wear it off if you get somebody to pry out on the wheel while you spin the bolt with an impact, but it may very well damage the wheel too.
You will need a new hub, too.
i was afraid of that
sounds like you stripped the hub, because that's what it screws into.
On both my e30 and my e21 when I bought them, they required heavy dose of PB blaster + breaker bar + 6' cheater pipe + me standing on it jumping to break ANY of them loose. I calculated that they were somewhere in the neighborhood of 1000ft/lbs. Wheel bolts are my personal enemy.
Once you get them out, give a call to Motorsport Hardware and get some nice studs and lug nuts.
irish44j wrote: sounds like you stripped the hub, because that's what it screws into. On both my e30 and my e21 when I bought them, they required heavy dose of PB blaster + breaker bar + 6' cheater pipe + me standing on it jumping to break ANY of them loose. I calculated that they were somewhere in the neighborhood of 1000ft/lbs. Wheel bolts are my personal enemy. Once you get them out, give a call to Motorsport Hardware and get some nice studs and lug nuts.
Yup. Ugly is getting a set of studs before it sees the road, too. I like a lot of what Ze Germans do in their cars, but why they think wheel bolts are good idea is a total mystery to me.
In reply to Tom_Spangler:
Treated with respect, that is hand torqued, threads correctly oiled/antiseized, they're great. When you let a tire shop idiot with an impact gun at them is when problems start.
They usually rattle em on and then try to tighten it with the tq wrench, shrugging when it doesn't move. On dry threads. Or massively over greased with lube all over the seat, which drives the bolt strain through the roof.
Tom_Spangler wrote:irish44j wrote: sounds like you stripped the hub, because that's what it screws into. On both my e30 and my e21 when I bought them, they required heavy dose of PB blaster + breaker bar + 6' cheater pipe + me standing on it jumping to break ANY of them loose. I calculated that they were somewhere in the neighborhood of 1000ft/lbs. Wheel bolts are my personal enemy. Once you get them out, give a call to Motorsport Hardware and get some nice studs and lug nuts.Yup. Ugly is getting a set of studs before it sees the road, too. I like a lot of what Ze Germans do in their cars, but why they think wheel bolts are good idea is a total mystery to me.
one less point of failure.
Not just the Germans...the Italians like those bolts too.
I've hated that 'feature' on every one of the 23 Fiats I've owned. And then I bought a BMW. 
However, the Bimmer now has studs and nuts. 
Kenny_McCormic wrote: In reply to Tom_Spangler: Treated with respect, that is hand torqued, threads correctly oiled/antiseized, they're great. When you let a tire shop idiot with an impact gun at them is when problems start. They usually rattle em on and then try to tighten it with the tq wrench, shrugging when it doesn't move. On dry threads. Or massively over greased with lube all over the seat, which drives the bolt strain through the roof.
Yeah, but you can say the same thing about studs.
mad_machine wrote: one less point of failure.
Actually, one MORE point of failure. With a stud you have the thread interface at the hub and the thread interface at the nut. With a bolt there is only the one at the hub.
Studs are more convenient though, certainly. Especially on track cars that need the wheels to come off/on 10x a weekend or need to run spacers with one set and not another.
In reply to Tom_Spangler:
When you strip/break a stud, at most you have to pull the hub off to press in a new stud. Screw up a bolt and you(if daring) heli coil the hub or buy a new one. Its easier to fix when you break it from doing it wrong. The Germans expect you to do something simple as mounting a wheel correctly and have no pity for those who don't.
i think wheel bolts are a symbolic gesture of precisely how stubborn they are.
belteshazzar wrote: all at once it started turning freely, but does not come out. like whatever it threads into broke off on the back side, and now it cannot be tightened or loosened. no space to cut it. won't hold still to drill it. what the crap do I do now?
Had that problem on an ex-girlfriend's VW oil pan drain plug. In my case, the threads on the drain plug had stripped, but the pan threads were OK (though I didn't know until I got it out).
What I did: I jammed two screwdrivers behind the shoulder on the nut, one on each side so as to try and press out evenly. Then, while I'm applying that (fairly gentle) pressure, my dad turned a ratchet on the drain plug. After a couple turns, the remaining threads on the drain plug caught the good threads on the oil pan, and the plug came out the rest of the way.
If you have room, you might be able to do the same. If not, maybe have someone pull on the whole wheel while you turn the wrench.
Good luck.
belteshazzar wrote: i think wheel bolts are a symbolic gesture of precisely how stubborn they are.
Haha,no sticking an engine behind the rear wheels and refusing to move it for 50 yrs is the definition of stubborn.
belteshazzar wrote: i think wheel bolts are a symbolic gesture of precisely how stubborn they are.
Well, they use hub-centric wheels to keep you from needing to use the seat angle to center the wheel and they do clearly give torque specs so... if you aren't the sort of person who changes wheels/tires 300x a year, bolts are just fine. In fact, since they only have one thread interface the argument could be made that they are more reliable and safe than a stud for "average joe" driver guy. For racers and auto-x'ers they are a royal pain... but really there isn't any legitimate beef against them except that one that I am aware of.
kevlarcorolla wrote:belteshazzar wrote: i think wheel bolts are a symbolic gesture of precisely how stubborn they are.Haha,no sticking an engine behind the rear wheels and refusing to move it for 50 yrs is the definition of stubborn.
They moved it... slowly. So slowly. It took 30+ years to make the 911 mid-engined but even now that it mostly is... Germans will deny that they moved it. They are only surpassed by Russians in their "prove me wrong or I am correct" thinking. Pneumatic control systems on jet fighters. Even the Germans who designed the SWB 911 were saying WTF to that one.
In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:
I think the Russians are more like "We over engineered this crude thing so it will be good enough for 50+ years" See Lada, or any firearm, crude, but solid as hell.
The Germans get an idea and will just send engineers running at it till they make it work or all die trying. See the 911, they just finally got it to a point where it wont try to kill you. Kinda ruins it for most of us, but a great accomplishment for them. Or WW2 for that matter.
You'll need to log in to post.
