Formula One - 2017

One reason for frequent first lap carnage is how difficult it is to pass in F1, so the drivers tend to take extra risks during the start.

After watching that a few times, I can certainly see how it was just a racing incident. Seb didn't expect his teammate to have a better start than he, so he didn't expect Kimi to be between Max and the wall. It was funny listening to the two drivers describe what happened, Seb said he "moved left slightly" when Max said he "swerved hard left". That was an aggressive move on Seb's part to block Max but he probably would have left room if it hadn't been for an awkward Ferrari.  I'm not sure Max is in a position to be moaning about other drivers taking him out, though. Pots, kettles, etc.

Lewis did have a great start, he would have been challenging for the lead on the first few corners.

A night street race in the rain - between the visibility and the drying line, I didn't expect a single pass especially once they got on to slicks. It was always going to be about the first turn. There was more action through the field than I expected.

Especially after Vettel spewed fluids all over the track.

Regardless of what happened at the start of the race, and who is at fault. When I saw Seb and Max were on the front row, I know their was going to be a crash.

Two bad races in a row for Ferrari. I would not want to be part of any team meetings for the next two weeks. Maybe longer.

I love the closeups of the Ferrari boss' face when stuff like this happens. You just know he's itching to have one of the drivers rubbed out, but he can't because they're too public. Not like when a guy drops a wheel or something, a week later that guy is history.

In reply to Keith Tanner :

You mean like the horse head inna bed scenario.......with Guido lurking nearby....silencer ready? 

There was some good racing in the mid field. All the camera coverage was odd, seemed to catch a bit of the racing here and there. But didn't give a good show. Like during restarts, Ricciardo just didn't stay with Lewis, maybe that was the gearbox problem showing. But didn't feel like I got to  see why. Sainz racing up the order seemed to be just an after story, don't remember seeing how he got there. The director didn't do a good job with the show. 

759NRNG said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

You mean like the horse head inna bed scenario.......with Guido lurking nearby....silencer ready? 

Pretty much. I love watching him, he's a passionate guy.

In reply to Keith Tanner; What  Italians aren't? .....bet he wishes he could burn a heater  while trackside, oh and a double espresso.....

Slo this thread has been quiet for a while now.  Let's catch up?

Aston Martin to come in as the major title sponsor for Red Bull starting next year amid rumors that Dietrich Mateschitz is getting tired of pouring money into F1 as his outlay has probably risen from about $10mil a year in the title winning days to $40mil a year now due to the increased cost of the hybrid engines and the lower payout from the FIA as they aren't mopping up the constructors championship any more.  Add to that, that it's thought that Renault want to pull the plug on the Red Bull engine deal at the end of 2018 leaving 2019 as an unknown until the new engine regs come in they may be forced to use Honda engines along with STR for 2019.  Assuming no miracle turn around how will that affect their chances to retain Mad Max and the Honey Badger.  Aston aren't going to make an engine unless costs come down dramatically for the new formula.

New engine formula rumors are that the current manufacturers want to keep the MGUH concept, but others want a lower cost hybrid system.  Porsche are rumored already to have a program under way as are Cosworth.  One rumor is that Aston would badge a Cosworth engine using a Williams hybrid system.

New today Pierre Gasly to finally replace Kvyat at STR for the "Next Races"  Hopefully that means the rest of the season.  I don't see that Kvyat has earnd the right to stay and Gasly has been in a bit of a holding pattern after winning the GP2 (now F2) title last year since be been treading water in the Japanese Super Formula since RB didn't have an open F1 seat for him.

More exciting to me is that Charles Leclerc is going to at least get four Friday practice session in Sauber this year before what many suspect is a seat at Suber next year in prep for a potential move to the #2 Ferrari seat in 2019.

Glad you brought up Cosworth, even gearing up for the engine change I really see no way Aston could build any semblance of a competitive engine. 

z31maniac said:

Glad you brought up Cosworth, even gearing up for the engine change I really see no way Aston could build any semblance of a competitive engine. 

Yeah, beyond being able to throw around the buzz words du-jour like 'Technology Partnership' I don't see what Aston are doing here.  They are a tiny company with revenue of only £593.5mil ($800mil USD) and a pittance of an income of only £16mil ($21.5 mil USD)  I don't see under normal circumstances how they could even afford a 2" tall decal on an F1 car.  Let's face it, their total revenue isn't miles beyond what Mercedes and Ferrari are rumored  to be spending on their teams.

Maybe they're hoping it'll give their brand a boost so they can sell onesies and sunglasses and strollers like Ferrari does. I'll bet Ferrari could stop making cars and they'd only become more profitable. Heck, Aston makes more sense than Caterham F1 ever did!

Good to see Kvyat moved to the side. That’s about a year overdue. 

Keith Tanner said:

Maybe they're hoping it'll give their brand a boost so they can sell onesies and sunglasses and strollers like Ferrari does. I'll bet Ferrari could stop making cars and they'd only become more profitable. Heck, Aston makes more sense than Caterham F1 ever did!

That's how I see AML playing in the F1 game. Great group of people, but most of their current technology came from ford and lotus. 

Nothing wrong with them expanding the marketing though. 

Kvyatt seems to have some hard lock on a race seat for RB. It seems more that they are going to give Gasly enough experience to come out swinging in 2018 or even jump into Sainz's car if Renault really really really want to dump Palmer early. That all said, somehow Kvyatt seems locked in.  If they must have a Russian why not, that old guy (23) Artem Markelov in F2.  IDK. Must be some deal like Perez. Just bringing big dollars.

I still have hope for honda getting a handle on their issues. I did find it interesting that the NBC coverage mentioned that Honda was convinced to run a different engine format by McLaren in order to allow the McLaren chassis to be what it was. This was the first year that Honda made the engine how they originally wanted. That was kind of a odd statement and didn't get any followup. Does anyone in the GRM F1 mega-brain know if that comment had merit?

Advan046 said:

Kvyatt seems to have some hard lock on a race seat for RB. It seems more that they are going to give Gasly enough experience to come out swinging in 2018 or even jump into Sainz's car if Renault really really really want to dump Palmer early. That all said, somehow Kvyatt seems locked in.  If they must have a Russian why not, that old guy (23) Artem Markelov in F2.  IDK. Must be some deal like Perez. Just bringing big dollars.

I still have hope for honda getting a handle on their issues. I did find it interesting that the NBC coverage mentioned that Honda was convinced to run a different engine format by McLaren in order to allow the McLaren chassis to be what it was. This was the first year that Honda made the engine how they originally wanted. That was kind of a odd statement and didn't get any followup. Does anyone in the GRM F1 mega-brain know if that comment had merit?

I forgot the term that has been thrown around, but essentially McLaren made VERY, VERY restrictive packaging requirements for the engine to aid aero around the rear of the car.

"Size zero".

I guess STR wants to get Gasly some mileage now while they stilll can, since they'll be using Honda PUs next season.  :-3

My understanding re McLaren Honda was that 2015 was a disaster.  In 2016 they worked on the original engine and got it to a semi competitive position by the end of the year they were regular top 10 finishers with hope for the future.  Rather than continue to develop the old engine in 2017 Honda asked McLaren what they needed for this year, thinking they had learnt from their mistakes and could come out swinging with a new engine.  McLaren wanted less weight and a lower CofG so Honda came up with a clean sheet copying the Mercedes layout and things went back to square one.  It should be noted that (after pressure from FIA, Bernie etc) Mercedes did offer Honda assistance in looking over their design to offer suggestions.  Even though Mercedes were light years ahead of Honda in development Honda refused partly out of pride and partly in case Mercedes learnt anything useful from them!  McLaren also tried to get Mario Illien of ILMOR fame involved but they had a bad case of 'Not Invented Here' and turned that help away.  Finally there is the time change issue.  If your team is based in the UK and your Engine supplier is in the UK or Europe you are at most one hour apart so questions can be answered in real time.  When you are 8-9 hours adrift, even with long days it take longer to get answers or clarification.  I've lived that myself when working with Japan.  You send a question or idea, get a reply the next morning, discover the language barrier prevented correct interpretation of what you were saying/asking so have to send clarification then rinse, repeat.  At best you can get one back and fourth per day, not a constant stream.

So good chance that Kyvat won't be back in 2018, so what Honda/ Japan driver will take over? seems as though their stale of Redbull drivers have dried up.

Verstappen Victorious, Hamilton Second

With 5 races until the season's over, championship fight looks done. 

I thought todays race would be a real snoozer with Vettel at the back but it turned out to be quite interesting.  Quite a bit of good racing to be seen and thankfully someone other than Hamilton won the race. Good job Max! And what's up with the post finish accident between Vettel and Stroll? Overall an entertaining race.

Vettel proving he's the biggest baby and most over rated pilot in F1. Fastest car couldn't pass a Red Bull with 10 laps and better tires, bitching about Alonso and hitting a car he's over taking on a cool down lap. Now Max, OTOH, awesome job!!