GM’s Ultium electric platform

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

SVreX (Forum Supporter) said:

Ok. We agree. Dealerships need improvement. 
 

Let's get back to discussing the Ultium platform.

When will they build one into an EV minivan? I'd like to unload the GC before it explodes into a million pieces like Chrysler products are wont to do...  

You're right. As easy as it looks to build one on that skateboard platform, it looks like very few companies are working on a minivan. 
 

The Canoo van is due later this year. 

In reply to Keith Tanner :

Then how about a series of electrified Miata. That would open up the aftermarket power options as well. 

Keith Tanner said:

Driven5 said:

Keith Tanner said:

Yeah, I think trying to meet modern emissions is just too big a hurdle for niche builders. Sidestepping all that lowers the bar considerably. 

With the current existence of emissions certified crates, I don't really see that as the biggest hurdle to small volume vehicle production right now. The bigger issue in my mind is that you can still only side-step any part of the full compliment of modern safety standards if it's an officially licensed (by the IP holder), nearly exact (dimensionally and visually, interior and exterior) replica of a production vehicle more than 25 years old. Until that gets broadened, I don't really see where this opens up much in the way of niche builder options, as it will then just reverts to the same long-standing kit-car status and requirements.

That being said, this is still pretty exciting if GM puts this out as an eCrate at a reasonable (ie their noted <$100/kWh) price.

What you may have missed - everyone does unless they read the EOs - is that those current emissions certified crates are only certified if installed in a 1995 or older vehicle. All the really hard stuff related to the evap system is avoided, and the LT1 is certified to a level that's now 4 years old. The LS3 is based on an 11 year old car. So there aren't really any emissions certified crates available to build a new car from.

Of course that's not the only obstacle to a small niche automaker, but it's a big one. Emissions are HARD. Crash testing is something that can be modeled more and more accurately via computer so it's becoming easier. But even if crash testing remains difficult, removing the emissions barrier only makes niche production easier.

Good info. Thanks! So you're thinking less the potential for 'shed' based manufacturers that have production intentions for glorified kit-cars, and more the financially stable startup manufacturers likely starting with something more on the order of 8-figure investment backing... Yeah, that would still be cool too.

Toyman01 (Moderately Supportive Dude) said:

Driven5 said:

Keith Tanner said:

Yeah, I think trying to meet modern emissions is just too big a hurdle for niche builders. Sidestepping all that lowers the bar considerably. 

With the current existence of emissions certified crates, I don't really see that as the biggest hurdle to small volume vehicle production right now. The bigger issue in my mind is that you can still only side-step any part of the full compliment of modern safety standards if it's an officially licensed (by the IP holder), nearly exact (dimensionally and visually, interior and exterior) replica of a production vehicle more than 25 years old. Until that gets broadened, I don't really see where this opens up much in the way of niche builder options, as it will then just reverts to the same long-standing kit-car status and requirements.

That being said, this is still pretty exciting if GM puts this out as an eCrate at a reasonable (ie their noted <$100/kWh) price.

Low volume manufacturers don't have to meet crash standards as long as they build fewer than 325 cars a year.  

As I seem to recall, only if it's an officially licenced-by-the-IP-holder nearly-exact replica of a vehicle more than 25 years old... Not just an 'inspired by' design that looks close enough to for most kit-car definitions. Rather having the same fundamental length, width, height, exterior and interior design, etc.

In reply to Ian F (Forum Supporter) :

I think minivans are already too under-popular for the manufacturers to chase that just yet... But eventually.

Oddly enough, I've been thinking about high-performance minivan ideas lately. Once you get rid of the spare tire, gas tank, and exhuast, there is actually a considerable amount of room under the floor pan for ground effect tunnels... Or as more applicable here, a big battery pack for an EV conversion.

Toyman01 (Moderately Supportive Dude) said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

Then how about a series of electrified Miata. That would open up the aftermarket power options as well. 

Trust me, I've thought about it! And I'm going to be taking a good look at Ultium crates when they become available to see what might be possible. I've already got some rough designs for an EV ND but some of the parts are not yet available - the Model 3 LDU doesn't have standalone controllers yet. I'm waiting for the market to catch up with what I want to do :)

I used to autocross in the 90's with a big DANGER HIGH VOLTAGE sign on my car just because I thought it was funny. It wouldn't be now.

In reply to Driven5 :

You are correct. 

(i)

is intended to resemble the body of another motor vehicle that was manufactured not less than 25 years before the manufacture of the replica motor vehicle; and

(ii)

is manufactured under a license for the product configuration, trade dress, trademark or patent for the motor vehicle that is intended to be replicated from the original manufacturer, its successors or assignees, or current owner of such rights, unless there is a preponderance of evidence that such rights have been abandoned for at least three years.