Good Starter Car?

amg_rx7 (Forum Supporter) said:

StreetsideClassics said:

ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) 

I have been thinking about a race school as well. Which ones are best? Skip Barber?  Radford Racing school? Ford Performance? 

That is probably the best approach now that you mention it. Lots of good schools out there and the instrction is far more focused and better than what you'll receive from a typical hpde instructor. Do it! Pick whichever school is convenient to your location and has cars that you feel comfortable with 

Personally I'm a fan of taking schools in my own car.  I find that it's a lot easier to learn things one at a time, and there's already enough new stuff in an environment like a racing school that there's no need to throw in an unfamiliar car.

Also keep in mind that driving and racing are separate skill sets.  A lot of racing schools assume that you're already coming in with driving skills and focus on teaching you the racing ones (mainly how to be safe in a racetrack environment).

With all of that said, I took the NASA SoCal racing school at Buttonwillow last spring and I thought it was very well done.  I had 20+ years of track days coming in, and brought my own car.

As far as track-oriented cars go, the three most popular seem to be Miatas, M3s, and 911s.  It's hard to go wrong with them, pick one based on your budget. :)

In reply to SKJSS (formerly Klayfish) :

Relative to the turbo 911 he's been driving the Cayman is a momentum car. 

It's not the extreme momentum car that my Datsun is but it's good middle ground.

For the record I too am a fan of learning in sub 200hp cars.

I would 100% start out in a manual S197 Mustang GT.  300 hp, plenty quick, easily modified as your skill and interests grow, and damned near unbreakable.  They have a gigantic aftermarket plus many factory upgrades and even a spec racing series which will make it easier to obtain safety, brake and chassis upgrades to make it track ready.  Also, there are still many unmolested bone stock cars out there.

I am a bit over 6' tall and my 08 GT gives me plenty of room in every direction.

They are relatively cheap on consumables too.  I realize you aren't on a tight budget, but you didn't get where you are in business by wasting money unnecessarily I bet.  A Porsche is going to cost a lot more to track and I'm not sure you will learn any more in it.

Also, and this is personal opinion, but as a seasoned "car guy" who owns the fleet you do, are you really going to get excited driving a Miata on track?  I know they are a phenomenal car, but candidly in stock form they aren't even quick.  I find it hard to imagine someone who owns a C8 is going to get into a Miata and feel anything more than disappointment. 

Also, Miatas are simply tiny cars.  For men of our size, while i know we **can** fit, it doesn't mean we are comfortable or happy doing so.  I've spent plenty of time in all of the generations and im yet to find one where I feel like a helmet wouldn't cause me to sit like a pretzel in the car.  I can't become more skillful if I'm constantly distracted by discomfort.

None of that is offered as a slight on Miatas, and one of the most competitive and entertaining race series to watch is the MX5 cup, but for my needs at least the Miata doesn't hit the mark and I'm betting it may not for you either.

Best of luck in your search!

In reply to Loweguy5 :

I see alot of people recommending Mustangs on this thread (I'm actually a Mustang fan).  I know older Mustangs are somehwat cheap, but why has Corvette not been mentioned even once, I'm just curious?  C4/C5 Corvettes can be purchased for pretty reasonable money?  Is there something about the way Corvettes drive that doesn't make them good beginner cars?  

Easier to maintain and lower cost in consumables maybe? I dunno, both are big V8 rwd cars. There's definitely more room in a Mustang.

In reply to StreetsideClassics :

No doubt some of it is personal preference.  I've never owned either, but my take is the C4 is so old at this point it just doesn't stand up as much of a performance car.

The C5 was a huge step forward, but I've learned that early C5s can be riddled with issues leaving the 2001-2004 cars as the most attractive candidates.  Somehow in my search for a C5 before I bought the most recent Mustang, I found that many of the C5 cars that were in nice shape were saddled with an automatic transmission and/or wildly overpriced.  The Corvette crowd is seemingly well known for thinking every car produced is extra special.  "This 2004 is a rare one of four built with red trim on the seats, no Bose audio and silver valve stems".  You probably know better than most of us that sometimes while a car may be equipped uniquely it doesn't necessarily make it more collectible nor more valuable.

That being said, I view the C5 as possibly one of the most important technological leaps forward for the Corvette brand and it was no doubt a giant leap forward in performance and appearance.  The newer C5s seem to be robust and worthy of track time given some upgrades.

I drove several C5 cars and found the driver's accommodations a little cramped for me and thought it would be worse with a helmet on.  Your experience with one could of course be completely different.

All the best.

StreetsideClassics said:

In reply to Loweguy5 :

I see alot of people recommending Mustangs on this thread (I'm actually a Mustang fan).  I know older Mustangs are somehwat cheap, but why has Corvette not been mentioned even once, I'm just curious?  C4/C5 Corvettes can be purchased for pretty reasonable money?  Is there something about the way Corvettes drive that doesn't make them good beginner cars?  

The C4 is just a tragically bad car for what you want to do.  Stay away.  The C5 is an absolutely phenomenal car for track duty.  Definitely better than a similar year Mustang, IMO.  I didn't bring it up because it's definitely NOT a momentum car.  They are fast and very capable.  If you want one, I have a track prepped and ready C5 I would sell you at a great price.  It's still fully street drivable, just has track prep mods.  Keep in mind that it's not a momentum car.

StreetsideClassics said:

In reply to Loweguy5 :

I see alot of people recommending Mustangs on this thread (I'm actually a Mustang fan).  I know older Mustangs are somehwat cheap, but why has Corvette not been mentioned even once, I'm just curious?  C4/C5 Corvettes can be purchased for pretty reasonable money?  Is there something about the way Corvettes drive that doesn't make them good beginner cars?  

Probably also because of the benefit in learning in a slower car. Mustangs aren't Miata slow, of course, but they don't have the power to weight ratio of a Vette. Truly though, big power hides driving blemishes, and you don't want that. My car isn't very fast but my first time out I was passing Miatas, but then I quickly hit the limits of my driving, which is far below what performance my car itself could deliver, but I'm still able to keep ahead of a number of cars even though I suck.

It wouldn't hurt to just take out one of your cars to like a Track Night in America and you'll see what everyone means. If you're anything like most novices (or maybe just like me) you will be able to ham-fistedly hammer any of your cars too fast in the straights to be able to follow a good line in the corners. But then with your blistering speed you'll catch back up to the pace. Then you'll do it again. Curves and turns on tracks come up a lot faster than on the highway; it's easy to be nothing more than reactive.

From everything I've heard, if you're aiming for excellence, the most direct route is slower. You get time to think and you get motivation to drive the cleanest line you can. /beatingDeadHorse