Great Odin's Beard! NC Miata Options Went Bonkers this Year!

roninsoldier83 said:

flyin_viata said:

So the 2.0L with FM turbo puts out basically the same, maybe a hair more WHP than a K24A swap for a LOT less money...and the boost is getting ready to be turned up?!?

I don't need a Miata and don't really want a Miata, but stuff like this has me hearing the siren song of a rebuilt title NC (especially when it comes to consumable costs) so long as the power is reliable on circuit. 

I'm not sure I would say there's a hair more power from the FM turbo (it seems a bit more substantial to me). Most K24's with basic bolt-ons in a RWD application (a bit more drivetrain loss vs FWD) seem to put down somewhere in the neighborhood of ~215whp or so with normal breathing mods. FM seems to be indicating that their turbo kit (I'm assuming on ~8psi of boost) is putting down closer to 250whp (before they turn the boost up to 11psi). That seems pretty substantial in a ~2500 lbs car. 

I was understating things...but yes I agree the FM turbo kit seems to put more smash to the wheels than a basic K24A swap.  For the money, that's AWESOME...especially if it is reliable for general HPDE.

roninsoldier83 said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

I'm pretty sure the K-swap kit comes with a Haltech Elite 1500 ECU, which I thought was a standalone? 
 

It's an option.  Many are using KPro with a stock ECU, I settled on Link because my tuner prefers it. 

In reply to roninsoldier83 :

I don't know what's included in the K swap kits. If it's a standalone, it should be consistent. Standalones at the consumer level are considerably less advanced than what the OEs are dealing with and of course they should be fully understood.

Here's the chart for my K20A2.  Standard bolt-ons (header, intake, etc.), Hondata ECU, 12.7:1 compression, stock head, tuned for E85 by King in Milwaukee.  They told me the dyno was calibrated and not "generous:" 

Redlined at 8400 because the head was stock with stock springs.

I went with the K20 to stay in sub 2L classes.  And of course it went a bunch over budget as engine swaps tend to do.  Having the boneyard K20 show up with a bent rod made sure of that.

In reply to jwagner (Forum Supporter) :

Impressively flat torque curve, not what I would have expected.

Engine swaps aren't an easy thing to do if you want to keep plates on the car and have to get through emissions.  Any aftermarket ECU means it's track only for emissions.

I've never sat in an NC, only NA/NB's, which I don't fit in worth a damn.  Are the NC's a lot larger?

In reply to docwyte :

Yes, the NC has a good bit more space than every other generation of Miata. I've owned an NC at the same time as I owned an S2000. The interior dimensions between the 2 were nearly identical, with the S2000 having just slightly more headroom with the top up. In terms of size/fitment for someone my size (6'2", 215 lbs, 33" waist, 34" inseam) I'd rank them as follows: 

1st - NC
2nd - NA
3rd - early 1999/2000 NB1 (prior to the surfboard seats)
4th - ND
5th- 2001+ NB2

We've owned all of them over the years (technically the ND1 was my wife's). I can't hardly get comfortable in either the ND or the NB2 (otherwise I would have purchased an ND years ago). I can fit in an NA, but my head is over the windshield while driving lol. In the NC, I'm actually comfortable while driving- very similar to an S2000. I was always impressed by the fact that the NC had similar interior space to an S2000, while weighing 200-300 lbs less. 

The guys at Everyday Driver are pretty tall (I think they're both around 6'3") and they had some similar findings, with Todd mentioning the NC was the one he actually fits in: 

 

In reply to roninsoldier83 :

I look over the top of the windshields on NA/NB's too.  Without a drop floor installed I can't get close to passing a 2" helmet rule in one.

With all the excitement, I put my money where my mouth is and purchased a 2010 NC2 Miata - Grand Touring 6MT, soft-top. 

It'll likely be a while (I need to recoup some cash), but I'll eventually be giving Keith a call and ordering a turbo kit for it. 

In reply to roninsoldier83 :

Congrats!

And great color combo... 

What Rodan said. Color combo really makes this car.

How many miles?

Thank you both!

In reply to Piguin :

She's only got 29k miles on the clock. Clean title/no accidents. Someone took pretty good care of this car. 

It's been a while since I've owned an NC. I've regretted selling my old NC2 for years. I forgot how much fun these cars are! 

I should also add that the SCCA just recently re-did all the Street Touring classes. The NC (and all other cars within the class) were buried below the absolute dominance of the ND in STR. No more. They just essentially gave the ND its own class- AST. 

The NC, the S2000 and the 2022+ BRZ/GR86 are now the best cars left to run in the newly minted CST class. While I don't believe the NC will be an overdog, or "the car to have", I believe all 3 of those cars will likely be competitive, or at least certainly more competitive than any of them were against the ND. 

Lots of options for the NC these days. 

Congrats! Looks great. 

There's something about an NC with fat wheels/tires that just looks so great. 

Just a note on the size, I found my 1997 NA to be more roomy than a PRHT NC, so I think if you're tall you're better off going for the soft top. I'm 6'3" mostly torso for reference. 

Keith Tanner said:

I concentrate on the hardware and leave the classing questions to other people. Classing changes too often to try to design parts for it.

 

It would be interesting to do a few more dyno runs on that tuned K. We've found that the ND is smarter than a lot of tuners and will learn its way around a tune. First run looks great, by the time you're at the third or fourth a lot of the gains are gone. Because of that, I always take "tunes" with a very large grain of salt.

That's interesting you mention that and explains one tuner in particular. Years ago they claimed HUGE gains with ND tunes......they weren't backed up in independent testing. 

They were dragged so hard they changed the name of their company. 

CyberEric said:

Congrats! Looks great. 

There's something about an NC with fat wheels/tires that just looks so great. 

Just a note on the size, I found my 1997 NA to be more roomy than a PRHT NC, so I think if you're tall you're better off going for the soft top. I'm 6'3" mostly torso for reference. 

 

I would agree with you on taller folks searching out a soft top. 

I've owned all 4 generations. I terms of interior space, I would rank them: 

1. NC
2. NA
3. NB1 (before the surfboard seats)
4. ND
5. NB2

I drove a PRHT years ago and I would agree, it takes away headroom with the top up- from my recollection, it seemed to take away about a 1/2 inch or so (which matters for some of us). I had the same problem (but worse) with the ND RF- my head was literally pressed to the roof while just sitting in one (I didn't bother trying to drive it). 

In terms of legroom and hip-room/shoulder-room, I would say the NC has the most space, hands down. With the roof up, headroom is comparable in the NA vs NC, but only if the NC has a soft top as you mentioned. It's been a while since I've owned an NA (I've owned 3 of them), but I felt like the soft top in the NA was slightly more "bubbled" (for lack of a better term), vs flat in the NC, helping the NA with a bit extra headroom with the roof up. But the windshield on the NC seems to be a bit higher, giving the feeling of it being a bigger car. In my old NA's, if I didn't do a generous foamectomy, my head would be well above the windshield while driving with the top down, whereas that's less of an issue in the NC.