GTI, how much of a risk?

I still have no official timeline for when I get to buy a car. But, I'm hoping sometime next year. My mind has changed a million times already and probably will a million times more. I also have no idea on a budget yet, but, after a couple conversations with the warden, there is a push to not get a beater.

Anyway, my current obsession is a GTI. It fits what I have in my minds eye to a T. But after reading for years here how terrible VAG cars are I have some reservations. The car will be autocrossed, rallycrossed, used to pick the boy up from school and take me to work on the half a dozen or so days per year that the weather is too bad to ride the bike. No plans for any modifications at all, with the exception of dedicated wheels and tires for each discipline and good brake pads. Probably looking at a MK5,6 or 7.

Should I be afraid of one?

After replacing a MK6 interior fuse box, I swore off owning one indefinitely... At least out of MFR warranty. Even then lease only. Maybe.

You get a bare plastic fuse block. And you must separately order a thousand berkeleying terminals. And there is nearly zero slack for accessing the backside of the pins. Many manufacturers have "blocks" of connectors that plug into the back of a fuse block. Not VW.

I was cursing a storm for a good couple days. It melted when a rear defroster wire shorted out. Rubbing through on an interior panel.

Edit: still have a few pics on my phone so I could remember wire colors. Note there are several that are the same color.

I bought a cheap MK5 GTI a few years ago after a hail storm. In the 3 months that I owned it, the center odometer display went out, the sunroof stopped working, and it threw a CEL that VW couldn't diagnose. Which then randomly went away and stayed away. I divested myself of that vehicle ASAP.

There are no VW fanboys, just VW apologists

The first time I was looking at a GTI myself was around the time the Mk6 was unveiled. This was when they were all puking up timing chains at 50k and VW hadn't initiated the tensioner recall yet. There was early talk about the carbon buildup issues too. I passed and bought an E46.

I was looking again at the Mk6 and potentially Mk7 a few months back, but now the carbon buildup problems are apparently considered "normal" and then it came out that the EA888 engines are breaking their camshafts with some regularity, generating another recall campaign. I passed, bought a Honda.

The Golf R is a sexy vehicle and very tempting if the values fall like the Internet says they will, but I feel like a Fiat is a safer bet, and that's saying something. People seem to either have a great VW experience or a downright terrible one, nothing in between.

Find one at Carmax and get the warranty

I drove a 2007 with the DSG a while back and loved it. That's how they get you- the cars are a hoot to drive in a spirited manner, but the ownership experience is hit or miss. This one had about $2000 in maintenance due in the form of a transmission service, timing belt, tires, and so on, so I gave it a big pass.

I'd love for another DSG car to be that fun and affordable. I think the Focus has (or had) a DSG, but I don't think it is programmed the way it is on the GTI. All of the other options are much more expensive.

Yeesh. I'm not sure if I want to risk getting a bad one. It's a shame, really seems to fit my needs.

Not a GTI, but the wife had an early 2000s Jetta that shares a lot of parts. In its first 30k miles it made a dozen or so dealer visits - almost entirely for stupid electrical stuff...shorted wires, multiple window motors breaking, a gauge cluster issue, a few trip pieces breaking for no apparent reason, a headlight getting condensation in it, and other small stupid E36 M3. Also IIRC something broke in the suspension, maybe an endlink. Again, something small that shouldn't have broken with that low of miles street driven by a soccer mom.

The car drove nicely and had no driveline issues, but we couldn't get rid of it fast enough. Then VW tried to lowball trade-in (on a Mazda from their sister dealer) by saying it had been partly repainted after an accident. It was pretty clear upon close inspection that the paint on one fender had been redone, which was interesting seeing as the car was never in an accident and it was bought new from that very dealer.

I'll note that VW corporate (as well as our local dealer) was a PITA throughout all of this and not interested in trying to make up for the massive inconvenience of owning this car. And we got shafted royally trying to trade it in due to lousy resale and the long list of repairs.

All in all, it gave me a bad taste for VWs and we will never buy a VAG product again, no matter how good they may be in some other aspects.

The 2004 (first year) Mazda3 we replaced it with was just as good in pretty much all performance aspects, and never had a single problem in the several years we owned it. And held its value much better when we sold it.

Nick (LUCAS) Comstock wrote: Yeesh. I'm not sure if I want to risk getting a bad one. It's a shame, really seems to fit my needs.

Driven a Fiesta ST? I liked it better than the GTI, even though it's not as quick.

The Fiesta is tiny, though. A Focus would be a more apt direct comparison.

Two problems with the Focus and Fiesta. No two door And, Ford.

I'm really trying hard to avoid a Japanese car. I keep finding Civics and Integras and RSXs that would fill the same need for good prices but I just have ZERO interest in owning one. I'm scared of MINIs and there is not much else out there.

I have a friend with a 2011 GTI with 140k that he uses as his DD. No major issues,he's been running APR's Stage II for about a year now with no downsides reported. He's done a few track days in it as well (on stock tires) and had a blast. He said he felt his clutch begin to slip a few times at his last track day, but considering the mileage and power output, I think that's reasonable. He's definitely not VW fanboi, as his last DD was a Jag X-Type and before that he had a New Edge Mustang GT. He also has built (and still owns) a restomod Early Cougar. Just one data point, I know, but some do have good experiences.

You could just get the reliable, fun to drive, Japanese version of the GTI - the Mazda3 and Mazdaspeed3

In reply to amg_rx7:

I could. They just hold no appeal at all to me. I don't know how to describe it.

Nick (LUCAS) Comstock wrote: In reply to amg_rx7: I could. They just hold no appeal at all to me. I don't know how to describe it.

I can relate to this. Dunno, maybe it's the extra doors + size. Mazda 3 are great cars, I talked my past girlfriend into getting one because I knew it would be fairly reliable, safe, and have a lot of room. Anything from US manufacturers and Japan sort of bore me right now. When I was car shopping I knew I didn't want anything like that, but was scared of European car maintenance car. Sad fact is you're gonna pay if you want something from Europe; whether it's a GTI, C30, BMW 1 Series, or A3. I think you can hedge your bets though by going with something that makes sense for your situation though. Have you looked into Carmax warrenties? They start to make sense if you're putting in 12k+ miles a year on the car.

Note on the VW, my friend had a regular gasser was a 2012. I learned how to drive manual on it a few months ago. Turns out last month he went to get some sort of clunk checked out in his front end and all his engine mounts were worn out and he needed a new front axle, car had only 60k miles on it. He traded it in for $6k, took a huge loss on it, and is not driving an Elentra.

Elentra GT do anything for you? They pretty reliable from what I hear and i think look better than a mazda 3.

Fiat 500 Abarth and Hyundai Veloster turbo (other than being ugly) are good too. The Fiesta ST is still the best car in that class IMO, but certainly no one will be forced to buy one if they wouldn't like owning it.

Nick (LUCAS) Comstock wrote: Two problems with the Focus and Fiesta. No two door And, Ford.

Ford is phenomenal for build quality and reliability and is probably the best on the market for over a decade now.

In reply to Knurled:

Doesn't change the fact.

I have wanted a GTI for so long, and honestly , if it hadn't been for the internet stories, I would have probably already owned one. I may just take my chances.

Nick (LUCAS) Comstock wrote: In reply to Knurled: Doesn't change the fact.

What fact?

In reply to jv8:

They're still Fords. I have explained my hatred of Ford here many times in the past. I know there are tons of Ford nuthangers here, that's fine. The fact is that company has cost me way too much money for me to ever consider owning one. Plus they all have that terrible Ford smell.

Your reasoning for hating ford is much the same as my reasoning for refusing to spend over 500 bucks on a gm product. It may be ill fated logic but its your choice much like mine.

After working on my dads beetle so often id still rather drive a sub 500 gm product over a vw.

In reply to dropstep:

Exactly.

Random question. Are the MK4 GTIs as bad?

Worse than Ford.

FWIW I HATE HATE HATE HATE older Ford stuff(say pre 2005ish). When they started making the interiors nicer and not using awful electrical components and assembling cars in a way that makes sense mostly, they're REALLY damn good cars especially for the money.

I work on all makes and models, we don't see much issues from the newer stuff. Aside from their DSG wannabe Focus and Fiesta. And F150 sun roofs cracking.

Nick (LUCAS) Comstock wrote: In reply to dropstep: Exactly. Random question. Are the MK4 GTIs as bad?

The Mk4s were arguably the worst out of every GTI ever except the Mk3. Class action lawsuit over timing belts breaking before the factory service interval, chronic coil pack issues, sludge, expensive parts, heavy, underpowered...and worst of all they are the darling vehicle of stance bros right now.

You made a mention of a "Ford smell" earlier, VWs are known for a "melted crayon" smell and the Mk4s had it the worst out of all of them. If you Google VW melted crayon you will see that it isn't exactly a rare issue either.