Help me think of some large-cube, light-weight engines

A bigger engine is going to make that torque curve nice and flat.

That was my main reason for going big cubes - streetable torque. The car will probably weigh 2800-3000 and (knowing me) will probably get driven every day.

I wouldn't mind going with forced induction. Theoretically a 4.0L with 15 psi is basically an 8.0L... but only under boost. Unless I spend big bucks on a VVT that offers 15 psi from 2500-6000 rpm, it will feel like a 4.0L turbo instead of an 8.0L.

I don't shy away from blowers, I just have no experience with them, so my chances of doing it on the cheap are less likely than finding a large, light engine.

RossD wrote: factory engine with factory boost = 624 hp SAE (with warranty?). Cost $6999 + $8099 = $15098

One of the things that makes it 417 hp is the variable valve timing. Without about $3000 worth of engineering and computers, you can't keep it. Its very easy to disable and lock out, but then you're looking at 350 hp and 93 octane.

DoctorBlade wrote: There's the L92, which is an all aluminum truck engine. It's a 6.2l engine. I'm not sure if the Escalade's 7.0l is AL or not.

Escalade has a 7.0L now? And they're putting aluminum blocks in trucks? I love it.

Lots of alloy LS blocks in trucks, but mostly the 5.3's. The 6.0's (or 6.2's?) are rare beasties. FYI, Car Craft mentioned the iron block was only like 75Lbs more than the alloy? Might want to look that up, either way even an iron block/alloy head LSx is going to be the same ballpark (or lighter) than a SBC, and WAY lighter than any BB.

3 thousand dollars? wow..... for the new ford 5.0 you can get ecm and harness for 1400

curtis73 wrote:

John Brown wrote: 625hp will not be cheap unless you only want it to make 625hp once. The original post said lighter than the current engiine and never mentioned cheap.

You're right, I didn't mention cheap, but it will be. I have a knack for waiting for cheap parts and building what I want for a lot less money than buying a crate. I built a 450hp 383 once with forged internals for $1300 by just waiting for cheap parts and re-using what I could off the old 350.

OK, got one. Not light, by any means, though. The old GMC V6 engines from trucks had monster displacement, some of them had over 400 cubic inches of V6. Modernize that and turbo it and that's a neato package. Not big enough? They made a V16 version as well, it was a 702ci. For those counting at home, that's 11.5 liters.

I heard the 4.0 liter dohc V8 Toyota engine was massively over built for a stock engine. I wonder what a big fat turbo would do for power...

I'm going to throw my hat in the ring behind a supercharged cam-in-block V8 of somewhat modern vintage. An LS9/LSA style package would net you fat torque curve, big ass power, easy T56 compatibility, and mad bragging rights. If you want to shave weight, a supercharged LS1 will halve the drivetrain weighs compared to an iron big block.

However, this is all Internet racing, and we know that's serious business.

tuna55 wrote:

curtis73 wrote:

John Brown wrote: 625hp will not be cheap unless you only want it to make 625hp once. The original post said lighter than the current engiine and never mentioned cheap.

You're right, I didn't mention cheap, but it will be. I have a knack for waiting for cheap parts and building what I want for a lot less money than buying a crate. I built a 450hp 383 once with forged internals for $1300 by just waiting for cheap parts and re-using what I could off the old 350.

OK, got one. Not light, by any means, though. The old GMC V6 engines from trucks had monster displacement, some of them had over 400 cubic inches of V6. Modernize that and turbo it and that's a neato package. Not big enough? They made a V16 version as well, it was a 702ci. For those counting at home, that's 11.5 liters.

Loved those GMC V6 engines.... what a lump of iron. I had the 'small one', the 305 V6 in a '66 one ton PU. Single bbl. carb, 7.5:1 CR and a stroke the length of my forearm, they were torquers and pulled great down low, especially on the mountain. Next displacement up was the 351. They were great sounding too. Heavy tho, even the 305 was prolly the weight of a BBC. I haven't seen or heard one in over twenty years, and I could recognize that sound a block away. Now you have me thinking of my next resto project.

RossD wrote: I heard the 4.0 liter dohc V8 Toyota engine was massively over built for a stock engine. I wonder what a big fat turbo would do for power...

There's guys in Australia making the power goal on unopened examples of that motor.

Don't think it's big enough for what the OP is wanting, though. Would be pretty cheap to do, though. At the most, throw a set of forged slugs in there, good head studs and a metal gasket, lots 'o boost, call it a day.

The answer here may be diesel truck turbos most modern ones are generiously sized and VVT (variable vane technology) or VNT (variable nozzle) the most recent Duramax turbo is at full boost by 1100rpm in the truck Im sure it could be cranking by 2000rpm on any bigger cube engine

OK, light, odd, unbreakable? AMC 401 with boost. Basic build and 10 psi should do ya. And how many examples of that would you meet going down the street? Ramblers Forever!

KATYB wrote: ecoboost will do 650 im sure of it. wouldnt be surprised to see 650 whp. heck people have been making 450 whp off of the old 3.0 with a stock bottom end. thats at 10.1 compression so boost limited to around 14 to 16 psi with pump gas.

you would be correct.....theres a maybe a half dozen original v6 sho's pushing the 650whp barrier. Crank walk becomes an issue at that point though. The ecoboost engines will do it better than the haters think it will, there are guys in new sho's(the 4000lb monster) running 11's if memory serves me right.

on the same hand, the lsx is far too played out, my vote goes for a RB, 2jz, bmw s54, or the 4.0L I6T from the aussie falcon. Just because it would be different.

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

RossD wrote: I heard the 4.0 liter dohc V8 Toyota engine was massively over built for a stock engine. I wonder what a big fat turbo would do for power...

There's guys in Australia making the power goal on unopened examples of that motor. Don't think it's big enough for what the OP is wanting, though. Would be pretty cheap to do, though. At the most, throw a set of forged slugs in there, good head studs and a metal gasket, lots 'o boost, call it a day.

theres also rb20's in australia turning 12k rpm.......

and I agree with the toybota v8........

yamaha wrote:

KATYB wrote: ecoboost will do 650 im sure of it. wouldnt be surprised to see 650 whp. heck people have been making 450 whp off of the old 3.0 with a stock bottom end. thats at 10.1 compression so boost limited to around 14 to 16 psi with pump gas.

you would be correct.....theres a maybe a half dozen original v6 sho's pushing the 650whp barrier. Crank walk becomes an issue at that point though. The ecoboost engines will do it better than the haters think it will, there are guys in new sho's(the 4000lb monster) running 11's if memory serves me right. on the same hand, the lsx is far too played out, my vote goes for a RB, 2jz, bmw s54, or the 4.0L I6T from the aussie falcon. Just because it would be different.

i was not qouting the sho i was qouting the 3.0 duratec.

KATYB wrote: i was not qouting the sho i was qouting the 3.0 duratec.

thanks for clarifying that. how many magazines do you quote from your racing bench? do you have actual experience with anything you've posted?

i'd hop on that big caddy, and drop in and go while you shop for rods/pistons

The Duratec 3.0 is used in the Noble M400 reliably makes 455hp.

John Brown wrote: The Duratec 3.0 is used in the Noble M400 reliably makes 455hp.

I think the new Q1 has 500+ out of the 3.0L tec(can't find the specs at the moment, websense pwnage)

The new car (Q1, M600) uses the Yamaha V8 from the Volvo S80 with twin turbos for up to 650hp. Everyone swears th engine is not at all related to the Yamaha sourced SHO engine...

patgizz wrote:

KATYB wrote: i was not qouting the sho i was qouting the 3.0 duratec.

thanks for clarifying that. how many magazines do you quote from your racing bench? do you have actual experience with anything you've posted? i'd hop on that big caddy, and drop in and go while you shop for rods/pistons

ummm actually quite a bit. there is no said "racing bench" and ummmm magazines ya nope dont have those atleast not relating to cars. my rec of the 3.0 duratec is solely off the engine is very underrated. its weakness being shallow ring lands on the oem pistons. put in a set of 8.5:1 pistons and change out the rods. keep the oem crank. run around 21 psi through what i would prob say t3/t4 hybrids and i think youd be right where we wanted to be.... full spool by id guess 2200 to 2700 so not overerly laggy at all. run it with an atx with a 3k stall and would be very streetably and reliable. but ya your right i have to just read things oout of a magazine. now finding a rwd auto that bolts to the duratec and can handle that kind of power is difficult.

patgizz wrote:

KATYB wrote: i was not qouting the sho i was qouting the 3.0 duratec.

thanks for clarifying that. how many magazines do you quote from your racing bench? do you have actual experience with anything you've posted? i'd hop on that big caddy, and drop in and go while you shop for rods/pistons

The 500 does make the most sense from a weird/weight/power conglomeration.

http://forums.24hoursoflemons.com/viewtopic.php?id=9022

This.

Boom Done!

KATYB wrote:

patgizz wrote:

KATYB wrote: i was not qouting the sho i was qouting the 3.0 duratec.

thanks for clarifying that. how many magazines do you quote from your racing bench? do you have actual experience with anything you've posted? i'd hop on that big caddy, and drop in and go while you shop for rods/pistons

now finding a rwd auto that bolts to the duratec and can handle that kind of power is difficult.

There are RWD transmissions that will fit, I will look it up tonight.

John Brown wrote:

KATYB wrote:

patgizz wrote:

KATYB wrote: i was not qouting the sho i was qouting the 3.0 duratec.

thanks for clarifying that. how many magazines do you quote from your racing bench? do you have actual experience with anything you've posted? i'd hop on that big caddy, and drop in and go while you shop for rods/pistons

now finding a rwd auto that bolts to the duratec and can handle that kind of power is difficult.

There are RWD transmissions that will fit, I will look it up tonight.

now that is interesting john let me know please. that could make for a very interesting project ive been wanting to do with the extra engine i have laying around.

If you're okay with staying bowtie, and want to do way less work, just do this:

http://www.dartheads.com/products/engine-blocks/chevy-big-blocks/race-series-aluminum-chevy-small-block.html

(aluminum big block)

and this:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HRS-RAFR540F/

And make yourself a aluminum lightweight 540. With aluminum heads and intake it should approach a small block in weight.