Help with 1mz-fe swap, no spark

Ok, engine ran in the donor vehicle before we took it out, with same ecu, wiring harness, and igniter.

Installed in MR2, ecu connected to MR2 harness with the exception of Air conditioning and cruise control wiring, (saving those for later)

Cranks but no spark, has fuel pressure.

Checked all of the grounds on the ecu to chassis,good about 1 to 1.5 ohms

Checked battery voltage and ecu relay voltage at ECU, good

Can connect code reader and says no stored codes in ECU

All coils have 12 V with Key on, I can only check by pulling connector off as I can find something thin enough to back pin connector.

Checked 12V and ground at igniter

Seams like it would have to be something with either the ecu or igniter, but have not found a way to test either.

Anyone with previous experience have any ideas?

Thanks

You probably don't want me getting anywhere close to this...

Haha.

Any possibility a sensor or related wiring was damaged in the removal/install? I'm thinking Cam and crank angle sensors to check first.

Any antitheft modules?

In reply to Robbie :

No anti theft, 

Damage possible , neither sensor is in a good place to test.

If the cam and crank sensors work, the next thing to try would be to put LEDs on the spark trigger wires in place of the coils to see if the ECU is sending the right signals.

Ok crank and cam sensors are right in middle of the ohm range for specs. 

put an led on the coil output and if I ground the led it lights. Cranking the motor no light, so I would think maybe ecu but I am hesitant to put my spare ecu in if there is something in the wiring harness that took out the old ecu. 

In trying to test the crank sensor I was measuring the input side which I thought should have a voltage but it only measures about 500mV.  Can't find a spec in the book , just says pulse train when idling, lots of help that is when it wont start.

Spare ecu is NOT A KNOWN GOOD ONE, just a spare so might try that next if there are no other ideas.

Cam and crank are simple 2 wire sensors?

I would GUESS that there should be a solid 5v from the ECU at each sensor with the sensor unplugged. With the sensor connected you should see a varying voltage as the engine turns (maybe turn by hand and watch voltmeter).

In reply to Robbie :

Yes they are two wore sensors, I suspect that they should have 5V as well but there is not any voltage at the ecu with both sensors disconnected or connected. Book does not specify a voltage even though it does for many other signals, just says pulse train while idling.

The cam and crank sensor could also be reluctor type sensors.  A reluctor sensor will generate  ac voltage when  the engine is spinning.  You could try setting your meter to ac and cranking the engine over.  You should see the display on the meter fluctuate all over the place.  The best way to view a reluctor type signal is with an oscilloscope.  

OK latest round,

GOt the paid version of Torque so I could read some real time data. SOme new clues but some things don't make sense.

1. Cranking produces an rpm signal of about 275 so that make me thing crank sensor is doing its job.

I put an LED on the coil trigger and tested it by running ground side to body ground and light turns on. CI the coil gets a ground signal from the ecu then the light should turn on, no joy. Same test on the injector wiring and no signal.

Tested continuity from the coil wires to ecu - Good

Tested continuity from injector wires to ecu - Good

Tested all ground wires from ECU to ground again, - Good

Swapped in a spare ECU I bought off ebay, verified all part numbers the same, manufacture date as only two month apart, exact same issues

2 new Codes are 1410, egr Position - not an issue we didn't put the egr back in.

Second one is B2799 no communication with immobilizer system. On one hand this could make sense, as I believe the immobilizer interrupts the signal to the ignition and fuel injectors, which is the problem I am having. The issue is the donor car did not have a chipped key and when I took the ignition cylinder out there was not a reader around the cylinder. In addition most of the wires listed for the immobilizer system for the ecu are not present in my wiring harness. My understanding is there is no way to bypass the immobilizer, but I am not sure how I could have accidentally activated it.

I am greatfull for any ideas you may have as i am running out.

In reply to Fladiver64 :

Since the donor didn’t have an immobilizer could it be looking for a dummy ground/signal that maybe the MR2 harness doesn’t have a wire for?  I’d start with a wiring diagram from the donor and trace the immobilizer signal from the ecu  

Fladiver64 said:Second one is B2799 no communication with immobilizer system. On one hand this could make sense, as I believe the immobilizer interrupts the signal to the ignition and fuel injectors, which is the problem I am having. The issue is the donor car did not have a chipped key and when I took the ignition cylinder out there was not a reader around the cylinder. In addition most of the wires listed for the immobilizer system for the ecu are not present in my wiring harness. My understanding is there is no way to bypass the immobilizer, but I am not sure how I could have accidentally activated it.

I am greatfull for any ideas you may have as i am running out.

What was the donor vehicle?  Clearly it did have an immobilizer system that you need to source and connect to the data bus.  (It won't have separate wires, it will just be CAN, unless you have a car from the 1980s)

OK digging deeper, here is the wiring diagram for the immobilizer circuit.

There are three wires going from the immobilizer directly to the ecu. The problem is the donor car does not have a transponder key amplifier installed. Here is the donor steering column, the holes that would mount the transponder have not been used. The key for the donor vehicle is a plain metal key without a chip.

Donor Steering column

Sample of column with Key Transponder

So I cant figure out why the ECU is looking for a signal from the transponder, if it was not installed in the first place. Second how to fix the potential problem.

In reply to Fladiver64 :

Can you take a higher resolution picture of this:

I can't read it with my old eyes once I blow it up. Don't know if the board resized it. You can email Stampie @ Stampie commercial. 

Are you using the MR2 or donor vehicle engine wiring harness?

(And WHAT was the donor vehicle?  This is important info)

I'm wondering if the computer is dumb enough to allow the engine to run if you jumper the main relay.

Donor vehicle was a 1999 V6 Solara 5sp, and we are using the engine wiring harness from the donor vehicle. 

Main relay, EFI relay and Fuel Pump Relay all work as they should. 

Crank and cam signals are working as well as TPS and temp sensors.

The issue seam to be the ECU will not provide ground signals for the coils or injectors, which is typical of an immobilizer circuit, but this ecu is not supposed to have one.

You also have an immobilizer fault, which pretty much is the clue-by-four.

When I get to work tomorrow, I'll see what I can dig up.

In reply to Knurled. :

Thanks, one of the issues I don't understand is we had the engine running in the donor vehicle with the same wire harness and ecu, without an immobilizer key.. I am sure it is something simple I am over looking.

I'm guessing no immobilizer key means it spoofed the immobilizer signal or circuit from the factory not that the immobilizer circuit isn't there.

Edit again-Same harness that ran it all the way from the ECU to the engine? Any different plugs on the steering column from the donor car?

In reply to MrJoshua :

yes same harness, the picture of the steering column is the one from the donor car, and there is no key amplifier installed.

From what little info I have gleaned, all Camrys (Solaras are considered Camrys) had immobilizer systems, but higher trim levels used the key fob.  But info is not that great because Toyota are douches about providing info.

Did find a lot of hits for weird immobilizer issues that cropped up after wiring has been disconnected for a period of time, PCM reads keys but still no start, etc., and the only fix was new PCM/immo pair.

The ECU might not have an immobilizer, but it is still looking to talk to one, and not getting whatever it wants back from one means no sparky.

I think a transponder key and an immobilizer system/module are not necessarily the same thing. Just because you don't have a chipped key does not mean you don't have some sort of immobilizer circuit. 

Are any plugs on the harness left unplugged now? If be looking closely at the donor car for the immobilizer module.

I just breezed through this.  I've done this swap with a 97 Avalon as a donor.  

Here is a Google Drive link with all of the relevant wiring diagrams and documentation.  Just a document dump, so maybe lacking context, but if you need high-res diagrams, they're in there.  

Click here

Hope any of that helps.  The immobilizer code is your problem.  Toyota TechInfo is a great resource and last I checked they offered 3-day subscription with all the PDFs you want to download for anything they've made for the last 30 years.

Robbie said:

I think a transponder key and an immobilizer system/module are not necessarily the same thing. Just because you don't have a chipped key does not mean you don't have some sort of immobilizer circuit. 

Are any plugs on the harness left unplugged now? If be looking closely at the donor car for the immobilizer module.

Some models had the immobilizer module mounted to the firewall side of the HVAC system.

In reply to Knurled. :

here is what I found when I was trying to start the donor car. THe donor car had a wiring harness problem that we wanted to fix before we pulled it. The problem in the wire harness was body related not engine. We thought we might have had an imobilizer proiblem so I was do ing some research. From SolaraGuy forum "in the camry line, mostly only the LE and XLE models have immobilizer chips in the keys. in the solaras, it's pretty much only the SLEs, though some SE V6 also have the immob. chips. 

the easiest way to tell is to try and start your car with a PLAIN METAL key. one without a big plastic/rubber head on it. if it starts (make sure there are no other keys which might have a chip in them anywhere near your ignition) then you do not have an immobilizer system"

mine has just a plain metal key only and we did get it running in the donor car with that key.