In reply to CyberEric :
That's funny because around here there are tons of Mazda 3s and the gardeners all drive 20-year old HD pickups.
In reply to CyberEric :
That's funny because around here there are tons of Mazda 3s and the gardeners all drive 20-year old HD pickups.
In reply to Dave M (Forum Supporter) :
No kidding?! Alright then. Now I know where the 3s are. It’s funny how things vary from region to region.
Korean cars here have exploderated. Not just because I look for them intentionally but really took off. I see first gen Fit's beat to hell and rusty fairly often, rarely see second gen fit's. Civic Coupes are all over the place though.
As an American Honda associate, some of what I see happening is saddening, but it has to happen to survive. I am ok with losing a couple poor selling cars so that I can stay employed. What you won't hear about is much of the change that is happening internally at Honda.
metallitubby said:What you won't hear about is much of the change that is happening internally at Honda.
Do you care to elaborate, or just leave that hanging as a tease of sorts?
Regarding Mazda, the CX5’s are all over the roads in the Cincinnati area,as well as enough new 3’s to be recognizable. Not many ND’s, sorry to say. CX9’s are also few and far between, as are the beautiful (to me anyway) 6’s.
einy (Forum Supporter) said:Do you care to elaborate, or just leave that hanging as a tease of sorts?
Change is happening within AHM. I can't expand on that without getting too deep into it and not get in trouble.
In reply to einy (Forum Supporter) :
We have quite a few CX-9s in the greater Bay Area. I see scant few Mazda 6s. Sad too because I enjoy looking at them more than perhaps any other mid-sized car. I remember seeing 2, maybe 3 of the newer update with the turbo motor.
Honda effed-up the design of the Civic, but I see them regularly. When I see an 8th gen Civic I think, “wow that’s the last of the attractive Hondas.” But it doesn’t matter. People love Honda and Toyota around here and buy them impulsively. I see quite a few of the current Fit. It’s a great car for this area. I wish they would bring the new gen, as it’s better looking, but I don’t buy new cars, so no one cares what I think.
Woody said:I’m a little bummed out by the news, but I haven’t exactly bought any of these cars either.
I had a 2011 Accord 5-speed for sales. Loved it. Want a 2.0 Sport manual if I didn't need a truck.
I don't want to live on this planet either.
bobzilla said:Korean cars here have exploderated. Not just because I look for them intentionally but really took off.
The Koreans are huge here.
Canadians buy them at roughly double the rate of the US
The Si is going on hiatus like it did in 2001 and 2016. I imagine this is a result of the 2012 Civic Si that was not well received and "forced" Honda to do a refresh for 2013 in which they gave most of the Civic line-up a new front bumper, rear bumper, and trunk lid. Some Civic variants like the Si got interior upgrades as well like softer plastics, faux carbon fiber, and a black headliner to match the rest of the interior.
I've owned all 3 generations of Fit and they've all been excellent cars for what they are. 2nd Gen was the sportiest but had terrible seats, the 3rd gen was a bit more upmarket and comfortable - the Sport edition was the best looking and had the best interior that reminded me of some 80s/90s Hondas.
Sad. Just bought an '08 Fit for my kid a few months back and I liked it so much, was seriously considering a new one when I'm in the market. But, I'm not totally surprised because that model came out last year everywhere else and there were early rumblings it would never come to the U.S.
And to someone earlier, the HR-V is based on the Fit platform, iirc, but with a 1.8 instead of the 1.5.
Right now, the U.S. wants CUV/SUV's.
-Rob
rob_lewis saidRight now, the U.S. wants CUV/SUV's.
-Rob
Yup .... but mostly these are basically 4 door hatchback cars that ride a bit higher than they would otherwise, I truly get it, the market dictates what the builders build. That said, customer taste is fickle so guessing someday this will all change, but I still don’t get the attraction.
When I went shopping for my last new car I bought something that was about as far away from an SUV as I could get. I told Mrs. Snowdoggie I will NOT buy a white or silver or suburban pastel colored anything. She drives a white Honda SUV. I bought a bright red Mustang convertible. I could have had a Challenger or a Camaro but the deal on the Mustang worked out. A turbo four is still cool. The last time I took the Mustang to the dealer for service the place was loaded with SUVs and F150s. There were maybe four other Mustangs on the premises. Ten years from now all Mustangs will have four doors and look like Explorers and the Camaro will be dead. I see where this is going.
I will never sell my Miata or my 914. Somebody was banging on my door wanting to buy the 914 just last week. I didn't even know that many people drove down the back alley behind my house. My neighbor wants my Miata for his daughter. I'm not selling. I am not really interested in messing around with 10 year old used SUVs.
I just hope I don't have to buy any more new cars for like, the rest of my life.
einy (Forum Supporter) said:rob_lewis saidRight now, the U.S. wants CUV/SUV's.
-Rob
Yup .... but mostly these are basically 4 door hatchback cars that ride a bit higher than they would otherwise, I truly get it, the market dictates what the builders build. That said, customer taste is fickle so guessing someday this will all change, but I still don’t get the attraction.
It's not changing that fast. The CUV is basically the 1994 Subaru Outback* extrapolated.
* yes, I know about the Eagle, but the Outback was a massive hit and the Eagle was weird.
In reply to Snowdoggie :
Ten years from now?
Keith Tanner said:einy (Forum Supporter) said:rob_lewis saidRight now, the U.S. wants CUV/SUV's.
-Rob
Yup .... but mostly these are basically 4 door hatchback cars that ride a bit higher than they would otherwise, I truly get it, the market dictates what the builders build. That said, customer taste is fickle so guessing someday this will all change, but I still don’t get the attraction.
It's not changing that fast. The CUV is basically the 1994 Subaru Outback* extrapolated.
* yes, I know about the Eagle, but the Outback was a massive hit and the Eagle was weird.
THIS^^ and the thing everyone forgets, is the baby utes barely get worse MPG than the cars... Baby utes command better base prices and MFR's are selling them by the bunches. Just because you or I think the Ford Ecosport is dumb, doesn't mean everyone else does.
i actually like the Mazda CX-30 more than the Mazda 3 hatch where they compromised the hatch too much and yeah it's a hatch... but man the cargo space is lacking.
back to the original topic I will be very sad to see the Fit go... the civic coupe is no love lost for me.. the Accord Manual is just a sign of the times. and while it stinks.. i get it..
talking of sales figures.. the HR-V sold 100k units in 2019 compared to the sub 40k of the Fit... and the HR-V has better margins...
Since I like manual transmissions and hatchbacks I can see used cars in my future. And my '03 MINI and '99 Miata are both showing rust, so I'll be in the market in the not-too-distant-future........sigh.
In reply to Datsun310Guy :
They still sell the two door version. But for how much longer!
Wow. Just when I thought Honda was going to become interesting again they make hard turn back towards beigetown.
Just picked up a 2020 Civic Si sedan. Drove the coupe and the rear headroom was not enough for 10 and 12 year old kids. The sedan is the same size as a 10 year old Accord.
Also drove an Accord with the 1.5 turbo and manual. The shifter was so bad, it sucked the fun out of the car. I don't buy cars with automatics, but I wouldn't consider the manual Accord.
volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) said:Its like Honda hit the Fit with the Ugly Stick and then decided to kill it out of mercy.
I see more of the older, "normal" looking Fits on the road than I do of the newest gen. I was at a dealership back in 2018 when I was car shopping and the salesman worked hard to trash talk the fit. "ugly" and "underpowered" were some of the words he used.
That new Fit in the pic looks pretty decent.
The current Fit has slightly MORE power and slightly LESS weight than a 16v GTI.
It's ugly but it's a lot of fun.
CyberEric said:Future me is sad, but like Keith said, car companies can’t care what we want to buy used in 10 years.
I’m not sure where everyone is hiding the 50k 3s Mazda sold in 2019. I rarely see the new body style. Maybe 2019 was still the last gen? The CX-5 on the other hand, I see tons of. I’m pretty sure it’s the only reason Mazda stays afloat in the US market.
I see gardening people using 30 year old small trucks all the time these days, since they don’t really make them anymore. Is that how it’s gonna be for small cars in the future? If you want small, nimble, fuel efficient, we will be scouring the used market for the last of the economy cars circa 2014.
There is a 19' Mazda3 Hatch hiding out in my garage. It also sat on the dealer lot for over a year before I brought it home in the middle of a pandemic. The wife is happy with it and so am I - But I totally understand our tastes and needs are not what the majority of people want. Literally nothing I drive is what most people in the US want lol.
As for Honda, it is sad to see these models go but they aren't the first (Chrysler, Ford, GM) and surely wont be the last manufacturer to trim some poor selling models, most of which are sedans and hatchbacks we like. The future will likely bring more models disappearing, more SUVS, more collaboration, and fewer fun choices at the lower end of the price scale. Just look at how many 60-70-80k trucks and SUVs you see compared to fun efficient hatchbacks. The profit isn't in cheap affordable cars. Fit MSRP 17k - HR-V 22k.
Not surprising, everyone I know who's shopped for new econobox cars has bought Kia/Hyundai because of the price and warranty. Enthusiasts aren't buying new cars at near the rate of normal people. A lot of the fleets that used to be Honda or American cars are now all Kia around here
Dave M (Forum Supporter) said:pointofdeparture said:New clarification: no Si models for 2021 either. They are "on hiatus."
https://www.autoblog.com/2020/07/17/2021-honda-civic-info-dump/?ncid=edlinkusauto00000016
This all seems a bit odd except the Accord m/t.
No Fit - I guess it makes sense since they don't sell much. I know enthusiasts love them but as a big guy nope. Feels like cramped e36 m3 box to me.
Accord m/t - that makes total sense. If you are buying a sedan you pretty much don't care if it is a penalty box. Too bad as the Accord Sport was fun to drive!
Civic coupe - that's a head scratcher. They are the only good-looking Civics and they sell them to younger folks who associate Honda with performance vehicles. My second car was an Integra and I've had a zillion Hondas since. You lose that demographic.
Civic Si - also a head scratcher; this car was a performance bargain. Same logic as the Civic coupe - it's a gateway drug of a car.
This and the CTR getting heavy/expensive/electrified/no more m/t is baaaad news from Honda.
This.
Makes a ton of sense to me, I know lots of guys and gals that have serious brand loyalty that started with a E36 M3box in High School they couldnt kill.
I love Toyotas but you wouldnt have guessed that in 1989 by the way I treated my 84 Camry 5 speed. Think Dukes of Hazzard and Smokey and the bandit rolled into 1 FWD edition
I see more newer Fits around here in PA than Civics but I didn't have a good feeling when they announced the new Fit for the rest of the globe but not the states. What they should do is take the new Fit and make that the Civic Sport (give it bigger motor/better suspension) and make the Civic Sport hatch the new SI.
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