How bad is an E39 M5 to own...really.

So, I'm looking for a fun DD now that I have a shortish commute. The E39 M5 and E46 M3 have been on the "will have someday" list, so perhaps it's time.
If the E46 M3 was a sedan, I'd jump on one. E39 M5 pricing and M3 pricing is in the same ballpark these days, with the M5 actually often cheaper than the M3 for equal condition and mileage. How much of a nightmare is the m5 to own as far as reliability. Understand that I'm looking for cars in great condition with low miles - no projects this time. I've had a BMW, so my pain tolerance is high compared to a toyota owner's. :)

If it's really terrible, or at least worse than an E46 M3, than I'll likely go with the E46. Still a fantastic all-rounder. Thoughts?

I love both and would kill to have both.

E39: From personal experience, M5s typical clutch life is around 80k miles. I would aim for an 02 or so, when they had the suede dash and headliners.

E46: Manual. Get a Manual. SMGs are muy expensive. If you do decide on getting a SMG, use it as a manual, I.E. lifting off during shifts. Will save clutch life.

Eventually Keith will see this thread...

Personally, I'd go for the E46, but not really for any logical reasons.

I've learned from my e36 M3 that once ~everything~ is fixed on a BMW, they tend to be pretty reliable. But there's never an instance of "Do I really need to do this already?" where the answer is no.

I really want an e39 M5 as my leave-it-stock adult car for a man of a certain age. I'm a little scared that the need to take the front half off the car to do the timing chain tensioners will coincide with my just not wanting to do hateful jobs like that myself, anymore.

But they look great and they'll go 180mph- and can catch wicked air doing it - I think they're a great example of a car that absolutely needs to be bought right - as the wrong one could ruin you.

To be perfectly candid though - I find myself looking for a silver or white over black 525/528iT manual. I have 2 race cars - fast and stupid fast, and I really don't go over about 85 on the street anymore, ever.

Hi!

Our M5 is the "grown up" car. It's the one that makes me feel spoiled every time I drive it, and I love to take it on long trips. Wonderful thing. You can tell the engineers got to do whatever they wanted to make the best supersaloon they could. It's a different beast from a 540i Sport.

It's a bit high maintenance. I spent a long time chasing down a weird fueling and driveability quirk that eventually turned out to be a funky O2 sensor - but it wasn't giving normal problem O2 sensor readings. Still, when that was fixed, the car got happier.

There are lots of horror stories out there about the terrible things that could happen. But really, none of the E39 M5s are at beater status. They were expensive cars when new, and I think a lot of them are still maintained that way. There aren't all that many DIYers, and those that do DIY their cars have a tendency to do it with a high level of sophistication.

Ours is the sort of thing you're not supposed to buy. It's a salvage car that had about 94,000 miles on it when I bought it. I've put around 10k on it and have changed the MAFs and the O2 sensors. Turns out the MAFs were fine, it was one of the O2 sensors. Anyhow...I've also put in new shocks and new front bushings, both of which the car really appreciated. Total was about $600, I think, and I could have bought cheaper front control arms. Someday I'll do a VANOS service.

I don't regret it. It drives me nuts once in a while, but it's such a stupendous car. I've got some quick race cars as well and I don't speed on the street, but I will admit to maybe merging at slightly higher velocities than is strictly necessary just to hear that noise from underhood.

The BMW ownership experience of 2 BMWs and now a Mini really leaves me sour. Sure they are nice to drive but berkeley me the expensive crap that fail$ way too often just $uck$.

This was mine:

I bought it from a close friend, who was the original owner. That said, it still needed a fair bit of work once I started going through it. Things like a $900 driveshaft and a pair of headlights at $950 each, among other items. Thank goodness it came with an aftermarket warranty.

A friend has a 2002 with ~115k miles. Driving home from work last week, the motor let go. Oil filter nice and full of metal. A used motor runs ~$5k.

As much as I loved the car (and the sound with the Dinan exhaust), the overwhelming sense of foreboding was too much to take. I sold the car 9 months after buying it and shortly before the aftermarket warranty expired.

motomoron wrote: But they look great and they'll go 180mph- and can catch wicked air doing it -

I thought that was an E60 M5????

Also, the biggest complaints I remember from friends with them were clutch life and one had computer issues....

I'll assume the OP is looking at the $14-20k range? If so, remember that there have been a few E60's sneaking into the sub-$30k price range.....

yamaha wrote:

motomoron wrote: But they look great and they'll go 180mph- and can catch wicked air doing it -

I thought that was an E60 M5????

It was. That crash happened about 40 mins south of here.

the E39 is one of the prettiest bimmers... I would take mine in 540 with the M body parts

mad_machine wrote: the E39 is one of the prettiest bimmers... I would take mine in 540 with the M body parts

Exactly. I'd take one over an E60 just based on looks alone. Not to mention how frighteningly complex the E60 is.

If you want new stock replacement headlights, you'll pay through the nose like every other E39 owner. But you still get decent optics with eBay lights - mine were in the $200/pair range and M5 owners think I've installed the European lights. A bit more than those for a Grand Cherokee, but not exorbitant.

As for the driveshaft, the very first link on a google search for "E39 M5 driveshaft" is Turner Motorsports with a $545 driveshaft. Bavarian Autosport shows the same. Just FYI.

The internet is full of horror stories for every kind of car. The M5 is an exotic, and so it's not as cheap to run as a Buick. Go into it with that understanding but no dread and you'll enjoy it.

Keith wrote: If you want new stock replacement headlights, you'll pay through the nose like every other E39 owner. But you still get decent optics with eBay lights - mine were in the $200/pair range and M5 owners think I've installed the European lights. A bit more than those for a Grand Cherokee, but not exorbitant. As for the driveshaft, the very first link on a google search for "E39 M5 driveshaft" is Turner Motorsports with a $545 driveshaft. Bavarian Autosport shows the same. Just FYI. The internet is full of horror stories for every kind of car. The M5 is an exotic, and so it's not as cheap to run as a Buick. Go into it with that understanding but no dread and you'll enjoy it.

Not sure if this was the OP's intention or not, but I'd like to know:

How would you feel if this was your only driver? You've mentioned a MAF quirk that resulted in drivability issues and general high maintenance. I know you've got a bunch of cars to choose from to get to work every day, what if that wasn't the case?

^ I'm curious to know this as well. I have the luxury of taking the family vehicle if necessary without disrupting things at home tooo much, which helps a bit. I'm fairly used to how "needy" BMW's can be based on an E46, numerous E36's and E30's, and a couple E34's. I don't want a "project", just a fantastic car that I can maintain, fix when necessary, and which puts a smile on my face every time I start it up: I have little doubt that the M5 will give me that smile. Also, I've never had a V8 car. Everyone needs a V8 car once. I have been looking at CTS-V's, but they just don't excite me the same way the more subtle looking M5 does. No interest in an E60 M5, FWIW....

njansenv wrote: ^ I'm curious to know this as well. I have the luxury of taking the family vehicle if necessary without disrupting things at home tooo much, which helps a bit. I'm fairly used to how "needy" BMW's can be based on an E46, numerous E36's and E30's, and a couple E34's. I don't want a "project", just a fantastic car that I can maintain, fix when necessary, and which puts a smile on my face every time I start it up: I have little doubt that the M5 will give me that smile. Also, I've never had a V8 car. Everyone needs a V8 car once. I have been looking at CTS-V's, but they just don't excite me the same way the more subtle looking M5 does. No interest in an E60 M5, FWIW....

I would have a backup car. I've DDed used German cars and bikes in the past and always had a backup.

The O2 problem didn't stop us from driving the car. It simply meant that I was dealing with repeated Check Engine lights, and the low-speed cold driveability surges that seems to be characteristic of the car was exaggerated. There was no MAF problem, that was a dead end. The O2 sensor problem was being incorrectly diagnosed as a MAF problem by the engine computer, so the new MAFs weren't needed. Once I tracked down that sensor, the car's been great. It was just hard to diagnose.

I left one other thing off the list: I put a new battery in it. That was the only thing that ever caused the car to fail to run - letting the car sit for more than a week would mean a dead car in the garage. As an added quirk, cold weather would drain the battery enough to trigger the alarm at 3 am so we couldn't leave the car outside. The new battery solved both those problems.

Oh, I also had to pay a bit of attention to the cables on the seat adjusters. I believe this is standard for every BMW with power seats. Didn't cost anything, just took about an hour of time.

I wouldn't hesitate to use it for a daily driver. I don't hesitate about taking it on long trips. The only car we have that is really a dedicated daily driver is the 2000 Grand Cherokee with 70k, and it's just as high maintenance as the BMW. That car has actually left us stranded when the battery went down with absolutely no warning. So: E39 M5 is more reliable and no more hassle than a 2000 Grand Cherokee based on a sample size of 1

On reflection, the only time in my life I have ever been 100% dependent on a single car and I needed to car to get to work/school was one winter. And even then, I could have picked up a ride from a coworker. Never had to do that, though.

Look up what it takes to change out the rear suspension on one...

I know about that. Step 1: remove the rear interior lights.

It's a bit harder than the rear suspension on a Protege5. Not a lot harder, but a bit. You spend most of your time going "really? I have to remove THAT?"

The rear suspension design is common across all E39s and I suspect quite a few other BMWs as well.