How to fund racing

Hello all! A little background... Like most of you I love to watch racing, I Autocross when I can and am in awe at the amount of money it takes to run a professional racing team. I received in the mail the MSXexpo flyer and noticed under the "business" track it listed subjects dealing with the actual financial aspects of sports car racing. Is there an organization or association that can provide training or information on how a grassroots driver can find the funding to run a local series? If we had more people knocking on doors knowing how to beg for money we could help grow the grassroots racing sports. I have two boys who race gokarts and aspire to be professional drivers and want to find a way to fund their future racing. The best magazine in the world (GRM) ran an article on becoming a professional race car driver and how much money it takes but that was just depressing.

Any information from anyone actually in the business would be great.

What I pointed out to my son is that there are 20 engineers in racing for every driver at the top level. Just on a numbers basis, he'd be better off going to a good engineering school, joining the FSAE team and pursuing a life in racing that way. Even if it doesn't work out, you're still an engineer.
I know that's not what you asked, but it's something to think about.

mazdeuce wrote: What I pointed out to my son is that there are 20 engineers in racing for every driver at the top level. Just on a numbers basis, he'd be better off going to a good engineering school, joining the FSAE team and pursuing a life in racing that way. Even if it doesn't work out, you're still an engineer. I know that's not what you asked, but it's something to think about.

Your words are very wise. They are young 7 and 10 and I am guiding them to be successful in business or engineering for the reason of being able to afford racing if that's what they want to do when they get older. I know every father thinks their kids are the best but my boys are wired to go fast and I'm raising them to attack life like Conan The Barbarian (the original) and be smooth like Jensen Button.

Watching the Velocity Patrick Dempsey series really showed how difficult it can be to get a winning team together and find other people to pay for it.

Is there actual data out there that shows how sponsoring a car in the right demographic and region can positively impact sales and actually make the company money? I know some of the allure of sponsorship is ego, for a company to see their name on a race car but the bean counters have to also be convinced at some point don't they?

mbruneaux wrote: Is there actual data out there that shows how sponsoring a car in the right demographic and region can positively impact sales and actually make the company money? I know some of the allure of sponsorship is ego, for a company to see their name on a race car but the bean counters have to also be convinced at some point don't they?

Proving that to the company is part of your application for employment - because asking for sponsorship is applying for a job. You have to make the case to the sponsor that explains why this is a good business decision for them.

It's not easy. And it's also not done very well very often. I've been on both sides, the sponsor and the sponsored. And let me tell you, simply having a good plan will set you well ahead of most others looking for support.

Anyhow, the case you make will depend on the business you're approaching. You won't find a magic study on the internet that shows that sponsoring a race car will give a 3:1 ROI. What you need is expected reach, an explanation of how you and they will work to leverage their investment, a clear plan as to what it will cost them and what they'll get out of it.

Keith Tanner wrote:

mbruneaux wrote: Is there actual data out there that shows how sponsoring a car in the right demographic and region can positively impact sales and actually make the company money? I know some of the allure of sponsorship is ego, for a company to see their name on a race car but the bean counters have to also be convinced at some point don't they?

Proving that to the company is part of your application for employment - because asking for sponsorship is applying for a job. You have to make the case to the sponsor that explains why this is a good business decision for them. It's not easy. And it's also not done very well very often. I've been on both sides, the sponsor and the sponsored. And let me tell you, simply having a good plan will set you well ahead of most others looking for support. Anyhow, the case you make will depend on the business you're approaching. You won't find a magic study on the internet that shows that sponsoring a race car will give a 3:1 ROI. What you need is expected reach, an explanation of how you and they will work to leverage their investment, a clear plan as to what it will cost them and what they'll get out of it.

Makes sense. Customizing your approach and knowing your customer goes a long way.

Another fun thing to do is visit the track on a club race weekend and really focus on the spectators. See how many there are. Talk to them. See if they're buying food at the track. What sorts of t-shirts are they wearing.
Now find a local dirt oval on a local race night. Look at the stands. Do all of the same things. As much as I love road racing, there is a reason there is way way more money being handed out in roundy round.
As another data point, a friend of mine races in B-spec. He has an SCCA pro license and races at least two races a year that get TV coverage. With all of that, he's very happy to pick up sponsorship just for the entry fee for those two big race weekends. He's a salesman for his day job and very good at it. He still pays for 95% of his racing out of his pocket.
With all of the people out there racing every weekend, I think you find that it's fairly cheap (compared to the cost of racing) to get a huge logo on a car. It's not that I'm trying to discourage you from finding sponsors, but the personal ROI on the work to find sponsors in road racing appears to be very very low. I think that's usually why you find dads working harder to pay for their kids racing instead of chasing sponsors.

watch this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racing_Dreams (It is available on netflix streaming.)
It will give you a good idea of the types of sacrifices - and the types of fundraising - that people hold to try and turn their kids into professional racers.

I used to autocross with a guy who was able to secure a few kick ass sponsorship deals. They gave him DEEP discounts on race part, freebies and some money as well.

Of course he was campaigning his brand new STI that was built to the fullest extent for it's class (I think it was ESP) and he regularly dominated. He bought the car and payed for the mods, driver's school ,etc. to get to the front of the pack so , in other words he didn't "need" sponsorship to succeed. The last I knew he was into time attack and something with a LeMans team. I kind of lost interest due to extreme envy.

A wise man once said, "...To make a small fortune in racing you have to start with a large fortune."

My son, Johnny, is in the same boat. He is passionate about racing and dreams of being a professional driver. He is the youngest of my 5 children. I do not have the means to fund his dream.

When he was 13 (19 now) we purchased a 500cc motorcycle powered Sprint car for $3000. It was 30 years old and had the original shocks on it. I told Johnny that the car would not be competitive. But we could have fun and learn about racing. We made an agreement that I wouldn't work on the car unless he was there to help me. And, that he need to treat the car, other competitors, me, and fans with respect.

We ran the car as it was purchased. I put $80 into it for the season. He amazingly one a race and won rookie of the year. He proved to be smooth and smart.

A gentleman that had the dominate 600cc Sprint Car series approached me and told me that he was impressed with Johnny. He asked if Johnny could try out his car. (The 600cc cars are very fast. Usually faster than full size sprint cars on a small track) In a test, on Johnny's second lap, he ran one of the fastest times ever recorded at the track.

Johnny at 14 was given a full ride in the 600cc car. He started the next season and finished in the top 3 of the first few races. Other drivers complained because he was 14 and the rules said that he had to be 16. They made him sit out until he was 15 which was in August.

He came back to race in August and won the most points from then to the end of the season. He was named Rookie of the year. The next year he raced for the same Gentleman and won 3 championships driving 3 different cars.

Johnny wanted to move to Asphalt cars so we purchased what is called an American-Canadian Touring car. This is a full size dedicated racing stock car. The ACT series is very popular and competitive in the North East. We paid $6000 for an old car. New cars run $40,000 and up. It costs about $1000 per weekend to race. We only had enough money to race a very limited number of races. We ran pump gas, used tires, and when we needed parts we bought used ones. My goal was to get Johnny noticed and to get a full ride for him with an established team.

With me as the crew, mechanic, tire changer, and spotter Johnny won his second race. (Not in the tour but at a local track against a large field) He finished at the top in most races.

We went to a large ACT tour race. There were 63 cars. We had never been at the track. In his first practice, Johnny was running some of the fastest times. In the race he ran some of the fastest laps as well. We got wrecked out but a lot of people noticed him. He had passed the most cars at the event.

We had offers for him to drive for the next year but they all required financial help from me. I couldn't do it. I have 2 children in college this year and I was not able to have Johnny race this year. So, he volunteered to work on a car. He enjoyed this. At a recent race he was asked if he wanted to run some practice laps. He ran the fastest times of the weekend. A team noticed him and remembered him from last year.

Johnny was just given a full ride in 2 different types of Asphalt Stock Cars for next season. He will have a full crew, experienced car owner and crew chief. In addition he has just been approached about driving a full size Sprint Car by the gentleman that he drove the 600cc cars for. It looks like he will be busy next season. I can go an just watch him and I don't have to pay any bills.

I realize that the likely hood of him progressing to the top tiers in racing is remote. He is in college and is getting an education in business and engineering. I believe that he will be in Motor sports in some capacity for the rest of his life.

Bottom line, do every thing possible to get your kids positively noticed. You never know what will happen. Good luck!

You have a seven year old racing a go kart? I didn't know they could do that at that age. What group does he race with?

mbruneaux wrote:

mazdeuce wrote: What I pointed out to my son is that there are 20 engineers in racing for every driver at the top level. Just on a numbers basis, he'd be better off going to a good engineering school, joining the FSAE team and pursuing a life in racing that way. Even if it doesn't work out, you're still an engineer. I know that's not what you asked, but it's something to think about.

Your words are very wise. They are young 7 and 10 and I am guiding them to be successful in business or engineering for the reason of being able to afford racing if that's what they want to do when they get older. I know every father thinks their kids are the best but my boys are wired to go fast and I'm raising them to attack life like Conan The Barbarian (the original) and be smooth like Jensen Button. Watching the Velocity Patrick Dempsey series really showed how difficult it can be to get a winning team together and find other people to pay for it.

I believe teams like Stuart-Haas and Andretti have driver development teams where they start with talented kids at an early age and progress from there. I've never looked into it but may be worth while

paranoid_android74 wrote: You have a seven year old racing a go kart? I didn't know they could do that at that age. What group does he race with?

mbruneaux wrote:

mazdeuce wrote: What I pointed out to my son is that there are 20 engineers in racing for every driver at the top level. Just on a numbers basis, he'd be better off going to a good engineering school, joining the FSAE team and pursuing a life in racing that way. Even if it doesn't work out, you're still an engineer. I know that's not what you asked, but it's something to think about.

Your words are very wise. They are young 7 and 10 and I am guiding them to be successful in business or engineering for the reason of being able to afford racing if that's what they want to do when they get older. I know every father thinks their kids are the best but my boys are wired to go fast and I'm raising them to attack life like Conan The Barbarian (the original) and be smooth like Jensen Button. Watching the Velocity Patrick Dempsey series really showed how difficult it can be to get a winning team together and find other people to pay for it.

Both my boys race at On-Track karting in Wallingford, Connecticut. 7 is the minimum.

Your thread inspired me to look around here in Michigan. There is a track in Lansing that has a minimum age of 5. My boys are 5 and 6.5.

Very interesting!

mbruneaux wrote:

paranoid_android74 wrote: You have a seven year old racing a go kart? I didn't know they could do that at that age. What group does he race with?

mbruneaux wrote:

mazdeuce wrote: What I pointed out to my son is that there are 20 engineers in racing for every driver at the top level. Just on a numbers basis, he'd be better off going to a good engineering school, joining the FSAE team and pursuing a life in racing that way. Even if it doesn't work out, you're still an engineer. I know that's not what you asked, but it's something to think about.

Your words are very wise. They are young 7 and 10 and I am guiding them to be successful in business or engineering for the reason of being able to afford racing if that's what they want to do when they get older. I know every father thinks their kids are the best but my boys are wired to go fast and I'm raising them to attack life like Conan The Barbarian (the original) and be smooth like Jensen Button. Watching the Velocity Patrick Dempsey series really showed how difficult it can be to get a winning team together and find other people to pay for it.

Both my boys race at On-Track karting in Wallingford, Connecticut. 7 is the minimum.

Tell your boys to prepare to live like paupers and work menial jobs so they can spend all their free time hanging around the race track and all their cash on keeping their ride going. Then they better win alot and have a salesman's personality. If that all works out and they perform when they get the opportunity they might be able to buy or scheme their way into a pro seat in some racing class.

Making a living as a driver is a fools folly, just like becoming a professional athlete in any sport. Unless you are in the top 1% you have no chance. There are very few Dario's, Bill Auberleins or Andy Lally's out there. That being said Tim Allen and Craig T. Nelson got rides with ALMS/Rolex teams because they had a big checkbooks. The other drivers didn't really respect them as drivers though, just thought they were rich guys with big wallets. I agree with MazDeuce that as a father you should guide them engineering first. Read the Mark Donohue book. He had it figured out; an engineer with a lead foot!

I wanted to be a race car driver when I was a kid. I didn't get there until I was an adult and I did it on my own dime.

If they are not already talented champions with people interested in giving them karts sans any marketing outside the paddock... you might want to lean a little harder toward mazdeuce's advice unless you are very wealthy and looking to change that for the worse. They are more likely to pick up a pitching job with the Red Sox than get paid to drive.

Worse thing that can happen is they learn their carts front to back and it encourages them to look in an engineering background.

Getting a start in racing is tough. It's all about the timing and exposure or being able to sell like a used car salesman to get enough cash for the next race.

But if they are not winning regularly by 12, chances are they will have a tough road to hoe going forward.

Sad thing is trying to make a living as a sports car racer is even more difficult. This is an oval track nation. Indy is dying, F1 is a novalty, WEC and ALMS usually draw 50-100K people for the race.

bmw88rider wrote: Sad thing is trying to make a living as a sports car racer is even more difficult. This is an oval track nation. Indy is dying, F1 is a novalty, WEC and ALMS usually draw 50-100K people for the race.

Move to Europe. Maybe Brazil.

Actually the same advice could be applied to Soccer.

In reply to The_Jed:

Are you talking about James Elterman?

In reply to Josh:

Maybe.....

Be careful. Money goes with weird things these days. It seems the performance end of racing doesn't follow the dollars end as it 'should'. See below:

CompetitionPlus wrote: John Force said he warned Octagon and Rogers & Cowan, "You're not going to turn us into the Kardashians." Friedman shot back, "Do you know how much money you can make?" Without hesitation, Force replied, "Turn us into the Kardashians!"

http://www.competitionplus.com/drag-racing/news/26348-force-plays-rope-a-dope-with-economic-gloom

John Force, most successful Funny Car driver EVER just lost his major sponsor and his OEM backing on one season. It's tough out there!

In reply to The_Jed:

When I was in college I used to autocross with STL region SCCA, your story sounded familiar.

The best way is to keep them working their way through karting series working their ways up. It most likely won't be cheap though.

In reply to Josh:

I've read my original post a few times and it seems kind of shiny happy person-ish and bitter. The guy's a great driver, I don't want to take anything away from his skill. He's one of those guys who was able to bring it all together (skill, money, ambition, determination, contacts, etc...) and, from my perspective, live the dream. My hat is off to him and his accomplishments.